Do you know where I can find this text between Augustine and the greek speaking theologians? (punishment, doctrine)

[Mardymar]

'Augustine was the first known to argue that aionios signi-
fied endless. He at first maintained that it always meant thus,
but at length abandoned that ground, and only claimed that
it had that meaning sometimes. He "was very imperfectly
acquainted with the Greek language." - (from Confessions)'


--
JOHN WESLEY HANSON
(Aion-aionios: an excursus on the Greek work rendered everlasting, eternal, etc., in the Holy Bible)

[url]https://archive.org/stream/aionaioniosexcur00hans/aionaioniosexcur00hans_djvu.txt[/url]





From what I gathered, I think he was corrected by followers of Origen. I might be mistaken, but I would really like to see the record or accounting of this conversation that changed his mind.

[Mardymar]

What I've found:


It seems Augustine originally thought all forms of aion meant things like 'endless, infinite' etc. So a Spanish theologian named Orosius visited him and convinced him to change his definition on almost all the words. Augustine still insisted that 'aionios' could only mean endless, and used that word in his Latin bible translation, though he admitted to being perplexed by some of its uses in the Greek old testament.

[Rose2Luv]

Originally Posted by Mardymar

'Augustine was the first known to argue that aionios signi-
fied endless. He at first maintained that it always meant thus,
but at length abandoned that ground, and only claimed that
it had that meaning sometimes. He "was very imperfectly
acquainted with the Greek language." - (from Confessions)'


--
JOHN WESLEY HANSON
(Aion-aionios: an excursus on the Greek work rendered everlasting, eternal, etc., in the Holy Bible)

https://archive.org/stream/aionaioni...0hans_djvu.txt





From what I gathered, I think he was corrected by followers of Origen. I might be mistaken, but I would really like to see the record or accounting of this conversation that changed his mind.

I am familiar with the remarkable writing of Dr. Hanson, but alas, have no clue where to find what you desire in your post.

An aion is a period of time preceded by aion's and followed by aion's, and as such is plural. This is the foundation for aionios. The rules are quite precise, no noun (in this case aion), can have an adjective (aionios) of greater scope.

In fact, aionios reaches into a quality of life & correction.....

"This IS aionios zoe, that we may know You...."

[Mardymar]

Originally Posted by Rose2Luv

I am familiar with the remarkable writing of Dr. Hanson, but alas, have no clue where to find what you desire in your post.

An aion is a period of time preceded by aion's and followed by aion's, and as such is plural. This is the foundation for aionios. The rules are quite precise, no noun (in this case aion), can have an adjective (aionios) of greater scope.

In fact, aionios reaches into a quality of life & correction.....

"This IS aionios zoe, that we may know You...."

I read this whole thing in one sitting. It was really fascinating.


It just seems that, in this statement, he was wrong and Augustine never changed his mind about aionios. Hanson might have explained it better somewhere else and I just missed it, though.

[Rose2Luv]

Originally Posted by Mardymar

I read this whole thing in one sitting. It was really fascinating.


It just seems that, in this statement, he was wrong and Augustine never changed his mind about aionios. Hanson might have explained it better somewhere else and I just missed it, though.

Good grief!

We kids could never handle reading this "thing" in one sitting. Little increments is all I can handle.

I do believe you are right; Augustine was stuck in his grasp of aionios.

Universalism: The Prevailing Doctrine For the First 500 Years -J.W. Hanson D.D.

I The Earliest Creeds 5

II Early Christianity a Cheerful Religion 17

III Origin of Endless Punishment 36

IV Doctrines of Mitigation and Reserve 53

V Two Kindred Topics 61

VI The Apostles' Immediate Successors 70

VII The Gnostic Sects 90

VIII The Sibylline Oracles 96

IX Pantaenus and Clement 103

X Origen 129

XI Origen--Continued 165

XII The Eulogists of Origen 181

XIII A Third Century Group 188

XIV Minor Authorities 200

XV Gregory Nazianzen 211

XVI Theodore of Mopsuestia and the Nestorians 216

XVII A Notable Family 226

XVIII Additional Authorities 244

XIX The Deterioration of Christian Thought 260

XX Augustine--Deterioration Continued 271

XXI Unsuccessful Attempts to Suppress Universalism 282

XXII The Eclipse of Universalism 296

XXIII Summary of Conclusions 304
101201