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Well to be honest it would be difficult to pick out a name for the ministry without knowing the point of the ministry. I think Hoosier has kept that a little vague.
Is the point to show men who are gay that they are loved and cherished as gay men or is it to show them the way to NOT be gay anymore?
Thanks for the great question Alpha! This ministry is designed for men who struggle with homosexual feelings and understand that this lifestyle is a sin. There are many men in the church who feel as I do that they do not want these feelings, yet they struggle with the flesh...and many times will fall, and then feel unworthy of coming back into church because they believe God hates them, they hate themselves and their is no one in the church who could possibly understand them.
These men could not talk to their pastor because then the "secret" would be let out and they could even be told to leave the church. The feelings of guilt, remorse and pain are ridden in so many men who deal with these feelings.
These men may also struggle with the thought that maybe God made them this way and being gay and a Christian is okay. Being actively gay and a Christian are not biblical. This ministry will not discriminate, hate or treat anyone with contempt. We will accept our brothers where they are at in their life, and work with them to help. We've been there, and this ministry is being designed to be an encouragement to the men who deal with this issue.
I believe that true repentance is important and necessary to move forward in life. This ministry will not accept being gay and Christian as a truth. Men are more than welcome to come into the ministry with that mindset, but to know that we are here to help dispel any misconceptions they have about the Bible and what Jesus taught. If after a period of time a man chooses to continue to believe being gay and Christian is okay, he would not be able to be a part of the ministry or use its tools and resources. Again, this is not to hate or discriminate, this is what we know to be the truth through God's Word, and we know there are many, many men who believe as we do.
We will teach the church to love and accept men for who they are and where they are at in their lives. Accepting homosexuality as an okay lifestyle? No. Accepting men who are working toward getting out of that life, or have been there, yes.
This is most definitely a safe place for any man who has ever felt these feelings and truly has been at a loss of where to turn. I've attended groups with other ministries regarding homosexuality it they never worked for me. I went to counseling and the whole bit and it didn't work for me. Not until I put God first, the desires of my flesh second and my relationship with God first and foremost in my life did things actually begin to change.
I assume you follow the rest of Leviticus to the letter then?
"For everyone who curses his father or his mother shall surely be put to death. He has cursed his father or his mother. His blood shall be upon him." Leviticus 20:09
"If a man lies with a woman during her sickness and uncovers her nakedness, he has discovered her flow, and she has uncovered the flow of her blood. Both of them shall be cut off from her people." Leviticus 20:18
"Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves. You may also buy some of the temporary residents living among you and members of their clans born in your country, and they will become your property." Leviticus 25: 44-45
"Do not cut the hair at the sides of your head or clip off the edges of your beard." Leviticus 19:27
[SIZE=-1]"...do not plant your field with two kinds of seed. Do not wear material woven of two kinds of material." [/SIZE][SIZE=+1]Leviticus [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]19:19[/SIZE]
"They (shellfish) shall be an abomination to you; you shall not eat their flesh, but you shall regard their carcasses as an abomination[SIZE=-1]." Leviticus 11:11[/SIZE]
You forgot to add to the list one of the most extroardinary passages and commandments found in the Bible that literalists seem to selectively ignore and fail to obey. The stoning of children!
Deuteronomy 21:18-21 (King James Version)
18 If a man have a stubborn and rebellious son, which will not obey the voice of his father, or the voice of his mother, and that, when they have chastened him, will not hearken unto them:
19 Then shall his father and his mother lay hold on him, and bring him out unto the elders of his city, and unto the gate of his place;
20 And they shall say unto the elders of his city, This our son is stubborn and rebellious, he will not obey our voice; he is a glutton, and a drunkard.
21 And all the men of his city shall stone him with stones, that he die: so shalt thou put evil away from among you; and all Israel shall hear, and fear.
Hooseier, its one thing to choose for yourself to shed your homosexuality. That is your choice.
I hope you never come to the point in your life that you regret leading others to shun that part of themselves. Its one thing to have regret for how you have lived your life but its FAR worse if you feel you have led others down the wrong path.
Hooseier, its one thing to choose for yourself to shed your homosexuality. That is your choice.
I hope you never come to the point in your life that you regret leading others to shun that part of themselves. Its one thing to have regret for how you have lived your life but its FAR worse if you feel you have led others down the wrong path.
I know with all of my heart that the direction I've gone and this ministry is truly the right way to go. Lindsey, I know you may not agree with my ministry but I do hope you understand there are many men out there that believe as I do. Not everyone who is gay wants to be that way. There are so many men in the church, sitting there and are silent about their same sex attraction. They don't want that attraction and are not sure who they can trust with that information. I am giving them an outlet. I am here for them to talk to, and make that decision for themselves.
Life is not all about sexual identity. For a Christian it is all about who we are in Christ, that is the most important aspect of our lives. Being right before God is of utmost importance to believers in Christ. Those comments may sound foreign to you or others, but that is truly what is important to myself and so many other Christians.
I think its important to accept who we are in life rather then trying to force ourselves into someone else's idea of who we should be.
For example, I am adopted. That is part of my reality, I don't like it, I wish I wasn't but I am. Its better to accept it and learn to live with it rather then pulling against it.
Trying to live your life by what someone else thinks, is sure to end in heart break. From what you have said, the real you has tried to get out before. Praying harder isn't going to silence who you really are.
Who you are, inside, for real, no hiding, is a wonderful, valuable person. There is no reason to hide that. Someone who would tell you to hide it, suppress it, doesn't really love you.
Hoosier,
Let me first say, I think you have expressed some genuinely wonderful ideas that will be supported. Having stated the same, would you necessarily mind working cooperatively with those (individuals or in ministry) who support the homosexual lifestyle? You are offering one path, but as has been mentioned, those who are confused seek personal reconciliation with their lifestyle, and not a hetero path. I think this was the reference made to emptiness earlier. Can you accommodate these two ideas in your ministry or identify/encourage an off-shoot support group for the latter?
The men you speak of don't want to be gay because they see how much they are hated for it. Someone else's perception shouldn't be a guide about whether a person accepts who they are or not.
These men are gay and they love god, those things don't have to be mutually exclusive. I know many gay people who are christian, kind and loving people.
Is it posible that you are starting this ministry more for your self and trying to convince yourself that its actually posible to pray the gay away? I think its very posible that you will do alot of harm trying to convince these men to shun who they are.
How many instances of men being married, hiding who they are and then finally having to come to terms with it do we read about in the media? How many more are just not news worthy enough.
The only group that thinks its posible to pray the gay away is religious groups, people who are relying on emotion rather then fact, rather then science, rather then observations and study by psychiatric professionals.
I have seen what your idea of homosexual life is, you related it to things like doing drugs. I have known alot of gay man in my life because of the field I used to work in and not one of them was a druggy but then these men accepted, embraced who they were. Isn't it posible that the things you spoke of in the "Is it confusing to be gay" thread were because you were in turmoil about being gay, hated yourself for being gay, not because of the fact you were gay?
I have a close friend in Texas, he has had the same partner now for 15 years, they own a home together, they live like any other normal couple. They have cats, one cooks dinner the other cleans up afterward.
Not all gay people seek out sordid sexual encounters in public restrooms after having done drugs to dull the pain, just like not all heterosexual people seek out anonymous sex with strangers while on a drunken stooper.
again i applaud you for this post...keep going forward
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