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The bible says it is sin, not me. You do have to agree it isn't how God made us and most gays know they have something wrong when they realize they don't have the desires their body was made for. It's sad but many people have things wrong with them but don't make other people change to accommodate how they themselves feel.
There are many articles, etc out there on both sides. You can find them as easily as I can. I have posted many already, one can read them or ignore them. It's a free country, I hope it will stay that way with religious freedom.
And there you go. YOU believe there is something 'wrong' with gay and lesbian people and YOU feel driven to make THEM 'change' who they are, to accommodate how YOU feel and what YOU believe. That is something that is 'wrong' with you, not them.
Here's a hint. Leave other people to be who they are, instead of who YOU want them to be and you might not get so much push back. Learn to cope with the fact that other people are not all like you want them to be. It's something most children learn early on.
I'm sorry you get so easily confused by my posts, because that is not what I said.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ceist
See? Now you admit it's all about SEX! SEX! SEX! for you, despite just denying it in a post.
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Originally Posted by Ceist
And there you go. YOU believe there is something 'wrong' with gay and lesbian people and YOU feel driven to 'change' THEM to accommodate how YOU feel and what YOU believe.
Here's a hint. Leave other people to be who they are, instead of who YOU want them to be and you might not get so much push back.
You are fighting a losing battle with unreasoning credulity, Ceist. This is a visceral issue that has very little intellectual component. It will not be assuaged by intellectual content or reason. Janelle feels they are icky and not normal and she does not wish to tolerate them being that way. God just provides the excuse for trying to impose her preferences on them.
What is so offensive about a brother and sister wanting to marry each other? They don't bring harm to any other person. See that's why your argument doesn't work. It's about sexual immorality, and I am sure there is one at least one form of sexual immorality that you feel is wrong. But from your standpoint, it would be wrong to condemn them.
Two entirely different things. But quite telling that you need to shift the conversation from one to the other because you have no arguments against the one.
Hi janelle, I don't share your views, but do want to try to understand them. What is it about two people (who are of the same gender) marrying that is so offensive? Why is it such a big deal? Why not just leave people alone and let them walk their own paths in life? If two people are not bringing harm to any other person... what is the issue? I am not looking to ridicule you, mock you or anything else of that nature. I genuinely want to understand why this is such an issue.
peace,
sparrow
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Originally Posted by jeffbase40
What is so offensive about a brother and sister wanting to marry each other? They don't bring harm to any other person. See that's why your argument doesn't work. It's about sexual immorality, and I am sure there is one at least one form of sexual immorality that you feel is wrong. But from your standpoint, it would be wrong to condemn them.
You have no business condemning anyone, Jeff. That is God's role. What we consider moral or immoral has nothing to do with the issue of who can get married. Society has established a lot of social and economic benefits to the status of marriage that has nothing whatsoever to do with God or morality. Those benefits cannot be denied to two people who get married. Society has the right to decide who can and cannot get married for reasons that make sense to society and its interests, period. God has nothing to do with it. What about that do you NOT understand, Jeff???
The Church says it's chastity for everyone unless they are a traditional marriage. Did you miss that part?
If YOU choose to be 'chaste' until you have a 'traditional marriage' or choose to be 'chaste' your whole life, go ahead. No-one is trying to stop you.
Civil secular marriage has nothing to do with your Church and religious marriage ceremonies, so why are you trying to stop gay and lesbian people having a civil SECULAR marriage? They aren't trying to stop you from having a church ceremony or getting a civil secular marriage license.
In fact, why would you even need a civil marriage license yourself if you think marriage is purely religious? You can just choose to have a church marriage ceremony withOUT a civil license. No one is stopping you.
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Originally Posted by janelle144
It's not demonizing to be told to follow the Ten Commandants.
But that's not what you are doing with gay and lesbian people. You are spreading demonising propaganda and lies about them, dehumanising them by reducing them to just sex acts, negatively stereotyping them, and telling them there is something 'wrong' with them, and that they need to 'change' who they are.
How about the second greatest commandment that Jesus spoke of? "You shall love others as you love yourself" What do you think that means? Do you understand what empathy is? Do you truly understand what love is? Because all I'm seeing from you is self-entitled self-righteousness, hypocritical judgement, and hate-filled propaganda campaigns about gay and lesbian people - all while pretending it's 'love'.
You are fighting a losing battle with unreasoning credulity, Ceist. This is a visceral issue that has very little intellectual component. It will not be assuaged by intellectual content or reason. Janelle feels they are icky and not normal and she does not wish to tolerate them being that way. God just provides the excuse for trying to impose her preferences on them.
I agree Mystic. Prejudice that deep is not something that can be reasoned with. But exposing it for what it truly is and challenging it, means they don't get away with spreading it so easily as they have done in the past. I've seen first hand the damage it does to gay and lesbian youth and adults when I was working as an LGBT crisis counsellor years back.
"Stefanowicz warns that in Canada, if you teach in your household that marriage is between one man and one woman, “you run the risk of thought police questioning your beliefs, especially if your children discuss these subjects in the classroom.”
"Stefanowicz warns that in Canada, if you teach in your household that marriage is between one man and one woman, “you run the risk of thought police questioning your beliefs, especially if your children discuss these subjects in the classroom.”
Yep, some people have a crappy childhood or crappy parents whether the parents are gay or straight. So what's your point? You've dug up a person who had crappy childhood and her dad was a crappy parent and she wants to blame everything on the fact that he was gay. Maybe she needs a therapist to help her learn to grow up and take responsibility for her own life now as an adult, as so many children who had crappy heterosexual parents probably need to do as well. There are a heck of a lot more of them.
Your posts are like the Energizer Bunny carrying an "I hate gays!" sign. Your gay-bashing propaganda campaign never stops.
How much does it cost you to keep those batteries going? Metaphorically/karmically/spiritually speaking.
Yep, some people have a crappy childhood or crappy parents whether the parents are gay or straight. So what's your point? You've dug up a person who had crappy childhood and her dad was a crappy parent and she wants to blame everything on the fact that he was gay. Maybe she needs a therapist to help her learn to grow up and take responsibility for her own life now as an adult, as so many children who had crappy heterosexual parents probably need to do as well. There are a heck of a lot more of them.
Your posts are like the Energizer Bunny carrying an "I hate gays!" sign. Your gay-bashing propaganda campaign never stops.
How much does it cost you to keep those batteries going? Metaphorically/karmically/spiritually speaking.
I imagine it must be exhausting, this obsession with gay people that certain people seem to have. I worry enough about my own (somewhat traditional) family, what I'm doing right or wrong with my own kid. So many of these stories provided by Janelle sound like plain old-fashioned whining. Guess what? No family is perfect. No childhood is perfect.
I feel bad for the kids that are being raised by gay parents. It is not because I think gay couples can not provide a loving home. I feel bad for them because there are still people out there who feel the need to judge these gay couples. How do you think that makes the kids feel? Do you think these kids don't get hurt when people talk about how their parents are not normal or are living in sin or comparing their relationship to incest?
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She Was Raised By A Gay Father. It Took Her 30 Years To Admit What It Did To Her.
