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Much of what He revealed to them they were readily able to accept because they were ignorant and superstitious. They did not have any modern validation paradigms to apply to understand anything. They simply accepted what was said and done with aplomb. They neither had the requisite knowledge or understanding to grasp anything He might have tried to explain to them nor could they even grasp the concept of Spirit and rebirth as Spirit because they were terrified of Spirits. They understood nothing and sought to understand nothing. They simply accepted on faith the carnal milk they were provided.
I forgot how easy it probably was for them to see Jesus do so many things...water to wine...
curing the blind because they probably did believe in 'magic' and were so superstitious.
So you think he wanted to tell them about Spirit or spirits...
I never considered they would be terrified of spirits or Spirits or a Spirit, whatever.
Interesting.
This is an amazing sentence to say at the last supper, after so many years
with these people....what do you think Jesus meant?
John 16:12
They are dead. They never had to bear them, and never will (unless they are the stuff he said right after and with the unrecognizable faces and/or holes in his hands), so I don't think the writer of John meant to say that Jesus would say stuff he didn't write. John, of course, seems to be the latest of the Jesus gospel stories written (which was meant to stand alone and for a long time was used alone by the churches that based themselves on it), and it was written for a specific audience, "Jesus was sending a Comforter that would criticize things and not speak of himself, but only speak what he heard". Muslims say this is Muhammad and not at all Paul. Of course, Jesus' disciples didn't listen to Paul nor Muhammad, and Paul was never a comforter to the disciples Jesus was talking to.
Basically it is saying that Jesus is nuanced and is trying to convert people without revealing too much of the truth. It can be used to say, "Jesus meant that he couldn't tell them of the trinity because they wouldn't bare it." Of course, they supposedly called him god in John, so it is basically a catch 22 to say "if you believe extra stuff, it might still be true, come believe this story" to get a larger following.
Ok, but why do you think they would not be able to 'bear' hearing about all that?
They saw him walk on water and quiet storms....heal servants at a distance...
How could they not be able to bear/grasp a phone? Helping him in the future?
I just do not get any of that being unable to bear.
I mean no offense, tho.
I mean look how crazy man gets with all the stuff already he tells us in there that we do not still understand still ... like humanity needed more things to help us get stuck on stupid? just more majoring on minors ... whole new religions based on the phone and spiritual implications and speaking to open space when no one is there or into a little box and what that might have to do with God and spirituality? just play with that for awhile ... and driving cars and computers and wow talk about getting humanity more confused than they already are , OH then think about the last 2000 years of humanity trying to understand all that .
can you just imagine the atheists of today would be trying to understand why Jesus is speaking about speaking into little boxes that talk back. how it is not accurate .. and how that isn't really what is happening so thus the Bible IS WRONG>. and unreliable just about those conversations over all those ages .. on all those possible subjects !
I think Jesus is very kind to humanity when he just leaves most of it with
"even greater things will you do "
but when he says things like
if you can not understand the things of earth how much less the things of heaven .. you have to know he was right to not say all he could tell. OH yes he was being kind to humanity who really doesn't even understand very much about even earth, history , much less the future.
not when the point of his focus and his coming was to be only our loving God and loving your neighbor and that is about it except too pray for more understanding and more prophesy.... He doesn't need the good stuff written down . not when a vision on a need to know basis is probably good enough.
and not about how they bring up all the other stuff in order to get stuck on stupid and then to argue endlessly about it .. like they are addicted to being thus and so . so maybe he knew that being stuck must be funner than their regular lives.
Much of what He revealed to them they were readily able to accept because they were ignorant and superstitious. They did not have any modern validation paradigms to apply to understand anything. They simply accepted what was said and done with aplomb. They neither had the requisite knowledge or understanding to grasp anything He might have tried to explain to them nor could they even grasp the concept of Spirit and rebirth as Spirit because they were terrified of Spirits. They understood nothing and sought to understand nothing. They simply accepted on faith the carnal milk they were provided.
When i left bible fundamentalism there was no way i was in a place to accept and believe the things i do now. It took letting go of what was deep seated in me first, and that does not happen over night.
Staying simply on the question of, 'What do you think he was not telling them, because
he felt they could not bear (KJV) or grasp (other versions) it'...creates emotions, I see.
I had no idea it would.
So, pcamps, you think they would not have accepted and believed some things...so why bother?
That makes sense...just things they would not have been able to 'grasp'.
I wonder what they could be...but seeing their superstitions, as Mystic made me more aware of...I understand better....and what pinacled said.
I just thought...they have heard him say ...Ask, believe and receive....Say to this mountain...Ask me for anything and I will do it (John 14:14)...those seem like magical concepts...I know they are not grasped today by my friends.
So what could he have thought that they would not understand?
What did he leave out in their 3 year teaching?
That was my initial wonder.
Thank you all for your inputs.
Last edited by Miss Hepburn; 02-19-2017 at 10:52 AM..
Reason: typpos ;)
Much of what He revealed to them they were readily able to accept because they were ignorant and superstitious. They did not have any modern validation paradigms to apply to understand anything. They simply accepted what was said and done with aplomb. They neither had the requisite knowledge or understanding to grasp anything He might have tried to explain to them nor could they even grasp the concept of Spirit and rebirth as Spirit because they were terrified of Spirits. They understood nothing and sought to understand nothing. They simply accepted on faith the carnal milk they were provided.
WHERE do you get this idea that they were terrified of spirits? The whole of the Tanach is full of the fathers of the faith and others having interaction with spirits/angels, or THE Spirit of G-d. Peace
The Trinity would not have been hard 'to bear' or grasp...since
1. Jesus spoke of and to 'the Father'...
2. Said he was a son and he had to die to
3. Send them a comforter..
They believed in spirits...so why not a benevolent, wise Holy Spirit to come after Jesus.
Many of them heard a Voice at the baptism of Jesus...
They could grasp a trinity.
WHERE do you get this idea that they were terrified of spirits?
The whole of the Tanach is full of the fathers of the faith and others having interaction with spirits/angels, or THE Spirit of G-d. Peace
I looked up what the Tanakh was/is...seems there are plenty of fearful encounters with spirits...that would grab one by the 'sinews of the thigh' even just to be sure to be feared!
I think it's fair to say they would be fearful of spirits then, as people are now!
Why, Mary was first afraid...who wouldn't be at first, when Gabriel came to her.
That is not to say there aren't also many peaceful encounters, also, of course.
Staying simply on the question of, 'What do you think he was not telling them, because
he felt they could not bear (KJV) or grasp (other versions) it'...creates emotions, I see.
I had no idea it would.
So, pcamps, you think they would not have accepted and believed some things...so why bother?
That makes sense...just things they would not have been able to 'grasp'.
I wonder what they could be...but seeing their superstitions, as Mystic made me more aware of...I understand better....and what pinacled said.
I just thought...they have heard him say ...Ask, believe and receive....Say to this mountain...Ask me for anything and I will do it (John 14:14)...those seem like magical concepts...I know they are not grasped today by my friends.
So what could he have thought that they would not understand?
What did he leave out in their 3 year teaching?
That was my initial wonder.
Thank you all for your inputs.
Yes, i most certainly do believe there were many things they were not able to receive because of how they viewed God and themselves.
If you are asking me to say something that i think Jesus did not make fully known to them, i would say that all that he was and is, is what we are.
To even consider such a thing never mind see this, the temple of our belief system would first need a huge dismantling. It sounds blasphemous to the mind not renewed.
Yes, i most certainly do believe there were many things they were not able to receive because of how they viewed God and themselves.
If you are asking me to say something that i think Jesus not make fully known to them, i would say that all that he was and is, is what we are.
To even consider such a thing never mind see this, the temple of our belief system would first need a huge dismantling.
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just 
about those conversations over all those ages .. 
