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See Revelation 12 as the woman is a vision of God which represents Mary the mother of God one with God in Authority ................,about to give birth represents Jesus and His church , ............... in the light clothed of the sun represents the eternal light of God ,................. with twelve stars represents the twelve Apostles of Christ who had a covenant with God ............... , The moon represents Authority as the moon is a stool for God`s feet over the earth ,............. the red represents a proud nature of the devil ,........... the dragon represent the devil who had the authority of Adam and after the cross became a defeated foe for the world,................ seven heads and ten thorns with crowns represents the liberal spirit which blasphemes with seven deadly sins and blasphemes the ten commandments with victory of the crowns ,.............. .Those who say from heaven ``the accuser of the brethren is caste down`` is people that Jesus saved say this from heaven
See Revelation 12 as the woman is a vision of God which represents Mary the mother of God one with God in Authority ................,about to give birth represents Jesus and His church , ............... in the light clothed of the sun represents the eternal light of God ,................. with twelve stars represents the twelve Apostles of Christ who had a covenant with God ............... , The moon represents Authority as the moon is a stool for God`s feet over the earth ,............. the red represents a proud nature of the devil ,........... the dragon represent the devil who had the authority of Adam and after the cross became a defeated foe for the world,................ seven heads and ten thorns with crowns represents the liberal spirit which blasphemes with seven deadly sins and blasphemes the ten commandments with victory of the crowns ,.............. .Those who say from heaven ``the accuser of the brethren is caste down`` is people that Jesus saved say this from heaven
interesting opinion.
but before we get to far, may I ask you one little Question. you said, "Mary the mother of God one with God in Authority ................,about to give birth represents Jesus and His church".
question, "when was the church birthed?". I thought the church was built.
Verse 5 "And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne".
A male Child,? yes a son. Isaiah 9:6 "For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace”.
what she brought forth was the body of the Lord Jesus who is Spirit. And this child is to rule, scripture, Matthew 2:5 & 6 "And they said unto him, In Bethlehem of Judaea: for thus it is written by the prophet,
Matthew 2:6 "And thou Bethlehem, in the land of Juda, art not the least among the princes of Juda: for out of thee shall come a Governor, that shall rule my people Israel”.
this was foretold by Micah 5:2 "But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting”.
the word “ruler” here is the hebrew word, H4910 מָשַׁל mashal (maw-shal') v.
to rule. Notice how the KJV can translate this word, KJV: (have, make to have) dominion, governor, X indeed, reign, (bear, cause to, have) rule(-ing, -r), have power.
REMEMBER, "HAVE POWER" this is important.
"and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne". the Key word here is "child", and note the Greek word for a male child here, (son which is, G5207, huios). caught up in this verses of scripture means to "come in POWER", of the Spirit. and not some rapture as many use harpazo. Lets examine this word, G726 ἁρπάζω harpazo (har-pad'-zo) v.
1. to seize
{in various applications}
[from a derivative of G138]
KJV: catch (away, up), pluck, pull, take (by force)
Now the derivative, G138 αἱρέομαι haireomai (hai-reh'-om-ai) (Some of the forms are borrowed from a cognate hellomai hel'-lom-ai; which is otherwise obsolete) v.
1. to take for oneself, i.e. to prefer
[probably akin to G142]
KJV: choose
Matthew 11:12 "And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force. SEE ABOVE G726 ἁρπάζω harpazo
Gill commentary on Matthews 11:12: or "comes with force", and power upon the souls of men: it was attended with the demonstration of the Spirit, and of power; as appeared by its being the means of quickening persons that were dead in trespasses and sins;
There’s the coming in power, or in Spirit, John 1:12 "But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:”.
so the woman gives birth to a child that have POWER, the power to convert souls, hence his building, or G726 ἁρπάζω harpazo (har-pad'-zo) the souls of men. meaning by choice. supportive scripture, John 15:16 "Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you".
for it is this child, this son who chooses, 1 Peter 2:9 "But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light".
Verse 6 "And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days".
The woman the remnant, who was looking for the messiah, and brought forth him, is now under his protection or teaching. supportive scripture, Isaiah 1:9 "Except the LORD of hosts had left unto us a very small remnant, we should have been as Sodom, and we should have been like unto Gomorrah".
the they in verse 6 above who shall feed the small remnant is none other than the Lord Jesus, and John the Baptist, the two witness of Chapter 11, which we will get to next, God willing.
and their teaching to the small remnant were a thousand two hundred [and] threescore days. This is the length of the ministry of the two witness, forty two months, or 1260 days, is 3 and 1/2 years, the length of our Lord's ministry.
Verse 7 "And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels”.
First the symbolism,
Michael = the Lord Jesus, not the arch angel.
Dragon = Satan, the Devil.
not conventional warfare, but spiritual warfare. Not in the third heaven, the habitation of God, the seat of the angels and glorified saints, there is no discord and contentions there, nothing but peace, love, and joy; but in the world and the forming church below on earth. this evil generation which is militant, and has in it as it were a company of armies; or rather in the Roman empire, which was the heaven of Satan, the god of this world, and of his angels/demons.
here the word angel is used vs star(s) as previous used in verse 4. this war refers not to the dispute between Michael the archangel and the devil about the body of Moses, Jude 1:9; nor to the of the angels when they rebelled against God, who left their first estate, and were cast down to hell in chains. but of that ancient and stated enmity between the seed of the serpent and the seed of the woman, Ge 3:15, which has appeared in all ages of time, more or less, since the fall of Adam; nor to the combats which Christ personally had with Satan and his powers when here on earth, as in the wilderness, immediately after his baptism, and in the garden, a little before his death, and on the cross, when he spoiled principalities and powers, and destroyed him that had the power of death, the devil; but rather to the conflict which Christ and his people had with the rulers of the darkness of this world, with false teachers during the centuries.
8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.
Christ sends out at once seventy disciples to work miracles, and to preach and they "OVERCAME THE EMENY"
supportive scripture, Luke 10:17 "And the seventy returned again with joy, saying, Lord, even the devils are subject unto us through thy name.
Luke 10:18 "And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven
Luke 10:19 "Behold, I give unto you power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by any means hurt you.
Luke 10:20 "Notwithstanding in this rejoice not, that the spirits are subject unto you; but rather rejoice, because your names are written in heaven.
Luke 10:21 "In that hour Jesus rejoiced in spirit, and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes: even so, Father; for so it seemed good in thy sight.
Luke 10:22 "All things are delivered to me of my Father: and no man knoweth who the Son is, but the Father; and who the Father is, but the Son, and he to whom the Son will reveal him".
Revelation 12:9 "And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
in the seat in heaven he accused the brothers day and night, but now and in his being cast out into the EARTH. his Ire or wrath is directly against the inhabitant of the Earth, hence the scriptures,
Ephesians 6:10 "Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord, and in the power of his might.
Ephesians 6:11 "Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil.
Ephesians 6:12 "For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places
Ephesians 6:13 "Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.
Ephesians 6:14 "Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness;
Ephesians 6:15 "And your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace;Ephesians 6:16 "Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked.
Ephesians 6:17 "And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:
Ephesians 6:18 "Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;
Revelation 12:10 "And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night. Revelation 12:11 "And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.
Salvation has come, the Saviour the King JESUS Christ is now come. to give his own life as a ransom.
the "THEY" who "OVERCAME" is now being revealed in chapter 11, and after our journey back through to chapter 2, we'll pick bak up here in chapter 12 and move forward with the persecution of the church. history is being viewed.
After the Lord Jesus body is born, (the child), chapter 12 and Matthews chapter 2 and the "shared" spirit is given, the Son. now we pick up his ministry with John the baptist, the two witness.
Chapter 11.
First we must establish who the two witness are. I believe the Lord Jesus and Jon the Baptist.
A.They are symbolic, and not the actual Moses, and Elijah, nor Enoch.
B.These two witness are not eschatologically from our nor John’s point of view.
C.These two witness, their witness are in the world today. not the two person themselves, but their witness are in the earth today.
With that said let’s look at these two witness verse by verse, and then give an outline on what the verses states.
Revelation 11:1 "And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein”.
A reed like unto a rod?, a measuring device? No, not a physical measuring device but a spiritual one. Scripture, Romans 12:3 "For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith”. so what John was to measure is the FAITH, but where? He was told to measure the temple of God. Most people think that this temple that John was to measure was an actual physical temple of stone, or wood. No the scriptures are clear as to what, or who the temple of God is, it's the Spirit within you. Listen, 1 Corinthians 6:19 "What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?”. John was to measure the people if they worshiping in spirit and in truth. so clearly what John was to measure is worship service. The alter of sacrifice is our lips, supportive scripture, Hebrews 13:15 "By him therefore let us offer the sacrifice of praise to God continually, that is, the fruit of our lips giving thanks to his name”. For God seek those who worship him in spirit and in truth (see John 4:23 & 24). now as priest we're to be built into a HOLY TEMPLE,
Ephesians 2:20 "And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;
Ephesians 2:21 "In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord:
Ephesians 2:22 "In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.
Scripture, Revelation 3:12 "Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name”.
so clearly what John was to measure is Holiness. as we will see in verse two why Gentiles are given the outer courts.
Revelation 1:1 "The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John".
The book of Revelation, the Revealing of JESUS as Spirit, (I AM, Genesis 1:1). JESUS as a man in Natural flesh, (THAT, John 1:1), and JESUS as a Glorified man, the NEW CREATION, (I AM, Revelation 1.
Other words JESUS is I AM THAT I AM. meaning the book of Revelation is a three fold book, past, present, and future.
How do one Read the Book and where do one start from? ...... Chapter 12 backward, and chapter 12 forward.
I AM THAT I AM is the same as, which is, and which was, and which is to come. three period in history.
I AM, which was, Spirit/Father, (CREATOR, MAKER). dispensation I
THAT, which is, spirit/diversified in flesh, Son, (REDEEMER, SAVIOUR). dispensation II.
I AM, which is to come, Spirit, Holy Spirit, Glorified in flesh and bone, (COMFORTER, MEDIATOR). dispensation III.
the book of Revelation reveals JESUS as the Father, as the Son, Who is the HOLY GHOST/HOLY SPIRIT.
************************************************** ******************************
Understanding the book is difficult, but only a suggestion, if one start in the middle with the Christ birth, Chapter 12, (which is present, "Which is"), then one can work their way backward.
chapter 12 Christ Birth and the start of the church,
Chapter 11, Jesus and John the baptist the two witness, the gospel of GRACE,
Chapter 10-6 the spreading and the difficulty of the gospel of this gospel of GRACE,
Chapter 5 his death and resurrection,
Chapter 4-2 the Growth, the warning, and The danger of*Syncretism in the church.
the transition, back to chapter 12 middle, onward the persecution of the church,
from chapter 13 onward are future events.
so starting at chapter 12, these events are the birth of Christ. if one keep a hand on chapter 12 here in Revelation, and the other on Matthews chapter 2 it's the same event. the Revelation is clear.
if any have a different view of the book please post it. so we'll start to examine this book working with the given suggestion, which could make the book easy to understand if in historical sequence.
There is no passage-- I am that I am in the Hebrew OT--I will be what I will be is correct . A misleading mistranslation. There are many in trinity translations.
Like At Rev 1:1--Any who understand English can see 2 beings there--One the giver= God, one the receiver= not God. There is only one God. The Father--Jesus teaches it-John 17:1-6,26, and Paul teaches it-1Cor 8:6) errors in translation mislead one to think a trinity exists.
There is no passage-- I am that I am in the Hebrew OT--I will be what I will be is correct . A misleading mistranslation. There are many in trinity translations.
Like At Rev 1:1--Any who understand English can see 2 beings there--One the giver= God, one the receiver= not God. There is only one God. The Father--Jesus teaches it-John 17:1-6,26, and Paul teaches it-1Cor 8:6) errors in translation mislead one to think a trinity exists.
first thanks for the reply, U said, "At Rev 1:1--Any who understand English can see 2 beings there--One the giver= God, one the receiver= not God".
ok, if it's two beings, one not God, take the Revelation 1:1 Test.
who sent his angel to John. read Revelation 22:6 first, for the angel there tells us who sent him.
so who sent his angel? answer please.
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