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Why is Manasseh among the 12 tribes of Israel? Compare Revelation 7:6 and Genesis 49.
There is something really off about the 12 tribes as described in Genesis and then Revelation. I hope to get to the bottom of it at some point. I don't know why Levi is listed in Revelation when they were set apart as priests. So I question whether they should be among the 12 tribes in Revelation. When Jacob blessed his sons, he said Dan was to provide justice for his people (Genesis 49:16). So I'd think he'd definitely be among the tribes listed in Revelation. The only sons I can see not being accounted for in Revelation are Levi, because of the priesthood, and Reuben, because Jacob said he would no longer excel (Genesis 49:4). That would open up slots for Manasseh and Ephraim, whom Jacob said would become a group of nations (Genesis 48:19). So then that would mean the 12 tribes in end times would be:
Simeon
Judah
Issachar
Zebulun
Gad
Asher
Dan
Naphtali
Joseph
Benjamin
Ephraim
Manasseh
It doesn't make sense that Manasseh is listed in Revelation 7:5-8 and Ephraim isn't. Something isn't adding up between Genesis and Revelation.
There is something really off about the 12 tribes as described in Genesis and then Revelation. I hope to get to the bottom of it at some point. I don't know why Levi is listed in Revelation when they were set apart as priests. So I question whether they should be among the 12 tribes in Revelation. When Jacob blessed his sons, he said Dan was to provide justice for his people (Genesis 49:16). So I'd think he'd definitely be among the tribes listed in Revelation. The only sons I can see not being accounted for in Revelation are Levi, because of the priesthood, and Reuben, because Jacob said he would no longer excel (Genesis 49:4). That would open up slots for Manasseh and Ephraim, whom Jacob said would become a group of nations (Genesis 48:19). So then that would mean the 12 tribes in end times would be:
Simeon
Judah
Issachar
Zebulun
Gad
Asher
Dan
Naphtali
Joseph
Benjamin
Ephraim
Manasseh
It doesn't make sense that Manasseh is listed in Revelation 7:5-8 and Ephraim isn't. Something isn't adding up between Genesis and Revelation.
Just go to Genesis and you begin bad as Rueben but this progressively gets better as you begin to move through each side of the temple. You are moving through 3 names at a time because at each side of the temple 3 tribes camp at each, and you are progressively moving from 3 names to the next 3 names.
This progression can EASILY be seen, but what you are missing is all the ancient stories about the purpose of all these tribes. If you are reading the story of Peter jumping out of the boat, you are reading a very well known ancient story about what Isaachar and Zebulun are, and Judah is the man in the boat that when the two brothers have finished their mission, Judah jumps from the boat, and then he moves up to Gad. Peter's whole life is simply showing him as he moves through each tribe.
Revelation has so much to do with merchant sailors in a boat upon the sea because of the fact that it is showing a level of where a person stands with God and being in a boat as a merchant upon the sea is not a good position to be in, you have to jump from the boat and this is what many do not want to do.
One side of the boat is for Gold, and the other side of the boat is for the study to become a priest. Zebulun sells his wares in a boat upon the seas that he makes enough money to support his brother Issachar that Issachar can study in order to become a priest, and so when a person is standing in the east in a boat upon the sea witnessing and thinking to be priests already, they have yet to jump from the boat to become a Jew in Judah who becomes food for the nations and this is why we see Pater jump the boat, and EXCATLY why we see Messiah already grilling a fish BECAUSE Peter had graduated, become a true Jew when he jumped from that boat and now he was walking in God, and about to perform, the works of Naphtali.
This is the way of all sides of the temple, it is two brothers who struggle or help each other and YOU ARE EACH ONE, the two brothers fight between them and then there is an outcome.
Learning the meanings of these tribes is a hard thing, but even the Koran knows what a boat means, and how the two sides of a boat represents something in particular,but the Koran states,'' Issachar is a man with a million books that he never read.''
When you get to know all these ancient stories about the meanings of tribes, you begin to find out just how much the New Testament is teaching a person to move from level to level and these levels are through the tribes.
Revelation is written to the Gentile, not the Jew, those 144,000 are Gentiles, not Jews. The spirit of Elijah does not come to a Jew, it comes to a Gentile.
If Jesus is telling you to cast on the other side of the boat, he is being extremely specific in the KNOWLEDGE that one side of the boat is for making gold, and the other side of the boat is a priest.
This was common knowledge when the Koran was written and now it is lost to Christianity, but to learn these things is to learn a whole new view on the stories of the New Testament, of Revelation speaking of the merchant sailors.
YOU are the boat, and there are two sides of a boat, you live your life working an humble job to spend your off time in study.
Genesis 49 Jacob Blesses his Sons 1And Jacob called unto his sons, and said, Gather yourselves together, that I may tell you that which shall befall you in the last days.
Whoever becomes the son of Jacob, these things written will shortly come to pass.
Hannibal, your posts are very confusing to me. Also, I am not concerned with the Jews (a name that was apparently derived from Judah, which is only one tribe of Israel). I'm concerned with all the Israelite tribes. I appreciate you adding to the discussion, but you are very hard to follow.
There can NEVER be an Ephraim, Ephraim is appointed to die, and SURELY, he is going to die, God hates Ephraim. God hates Esau, God hates Ishmael, God hates Cain, and why does God hate all of these?
Because they are all first born sons and all the first born sons represent flesh. Ephraim is appointed to die, and his only salvation is to become one with Judah just as Paul was of Ephraim and he became of Judah.
Messiah only brings a covenant for Ephraim and Judah, and there can be no Ephraim. Gentiles are grafted through the promise of Ephraim until at some point, the door is closed, and just because millions claim an inheritance as Ephraim, it doesn't mean they are Ephraim, have they died?
If they have not died, then they are pretenders, and they could not possibly be Ephraim, there can be no Ephraim. Messiah took two and he made the two, ONE MAN, and Ephraim represents the flesh that we must overcome, Ephraim is appointed for death because a day will come when there shall no longer be two kingdoms, but only one kingdom, and this can only come true at the death of Ephraim, and so we see the 7000 of Ephraim die in Revelation because that is their portion, DEATH, and if they will not die, they will not die, but then a day comes when the door is closed and everyone still in Ephraim will say,'' OMG, I will die, LET ME DIE, NOW I am ready, OPEN THE DOOR TO ME, and they will beg for death but death will not come because they ran from sure death, they were too afraid to put a target on their back that somebody might confuse them with a Jew.
Ezekiel 37 One Nation with One King 15The word of the LORD came again unto me, saying, 16Moreover, thou son of man, take thee one stick, and write upon it, For Judah, and for the children of Israel his companions: then take another stick, and write upon it, For Joseph, the stick of Ephraim, and for all the house of Israel his companions: 17And join them one to another into one stick; and they shall become one in thine hand. 18And when the children of thy people shall speak unto thee, saying, Wilt thou not shew us what thou meanest by these? 19Say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will take the stick of Joseph, which is in the hand of Ephraim, and the tribes of Israel his fellows, and will put them with him, even with the stick of Judah, and make them one stick, and they shall be one in mine hand. 20And the sticks whereon thou writest shall be in thine hand before their eyes. 21And say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will take the children of Israel from among the heathen, whither they be gone, and will gather them on every side, and bring them into their own land: 22And I will make them one nation in the land upon the mountains of Israel; and one king shall be king to them all: and they shall be no more two nations, neither shall they be divided into two kingdoms any more at all: 23Neither shall they defile themselves any more with their idols, nor with their detestable things, nor with any of their transgressions: but I will save them out of all their dwellingplaces, wherein they have sinned, and will cleanse them: so shall they be my people, and I will be their God.
24And David my servant shall be king over them; and they all shall have one shepherd: they shall also walk in my judgments, and observe my statutes, and do them. 25And they shall dwell in the land that I have given unto Jacob my servant, wherein your fathers have dwelt; and they shall dwell therein, even they, and their children, and their children's children for ever: and my servant David shall be their prince for ever. 26Moreover I will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant with them: and I will place them, and multiply them, and will set my sanctuary in the midst of them for evermore. 27My tabernacle also shall be with them: yea, I will be their God, and they shall be my people. 28And the heathen shall know that I the LORD do sanctify Israel, when my sanctuary shall be in the midst of them for evermore.
There will no longer be a king of Ephraim or a king of the house of Israel and there will no longer be a Gentile under the name of Ephraim if he has not already become one with Judah, there will no longer be a Gentile or a Philistine in the house of the Lord and David shall be king over them all, EVEN THE KING OF JUDAH, AND NO OTHER NATION SHALL STAND.
People are claiming that they are in the new covenant with Ephraim and Judah, but where do you see a Gentile under the rule of David? Where do you see a Gentile who despises the law?
You don't, and yet, here we are looking to the day that there shall only be one kingdom, not two kingdoms, and Judah shall be king, nobody else.
Hannibal, your posts are very confusing to me. Also, I am not concerned with the Jews (a name that was apparently derived from Judah, which is only one tribe of Israel). I'm concerned with all the Israelite tribes. I appreciate you adding to the discussion, but you are very hard to follow.
Are you supposing that any tribe out there is not of Judah?
I am saying "Jews" means something very specific, and I want to be clear when I am speaking about the entire nation of Israel. "Israel" and "Jew" are not interchangeable to me. Israel = the 12 tribes; Jew = a word whose origins are from the name "Judah".
I am saying "Jews" means something very specific, and I want to be clear when I am speaking about the entire nation of Israel. "Israel" and "Jew" are not interchangeable to me. Israel = the 12 tribes; Jew = a word whose origins are from the name "Judah".
Any Jew you find is of Judah no matter what Tribal blood they may have in them, they are of Judah because there was only Judah.
And I heard the number of those who were sealed. One hundred and forty-four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel were sealed:
Rev 14:1
Then I looked, and behold, a Lamb standing on Mount Zion, and with Him one hundred and forty-four thousand, having His Father's name written on their foreheads.
this means having access to the Father meaning they have to be holy and trained as Jesus was to be "the sons of God " to walk in the Path Jesus walked in, To be trained by Jehovah / Now Jesus
144000 youth of every clan of Israel ( not the land, but the man clans ) who will be raised and trained BY the Father and the Son. to basically take the Son's Place and to walk in his footsteps meaning walk the same holy road before the Father in service for their nations and their clansmen.
These Youth are the first fruits of the nations.. Just as the disciples were the first fruits of the church. so the 144000 will be the first fruits Offering of their nations and their clans redeemed from the world. Meaning there will probably be many many more " first fruits (eldest sons)" youth ) who will be offered for service to the Father's
Kingdom ( Thy kingdom come, thy will be done)and temple services after that and over the ages at least for the millennium.
These will follow in the footsteps and be trained as Jesus was trained.
the rest of this chapter is John seeing the 144000 youth who are in service to the Father .. He heard the 144000.. then he saw the 144000. and it him it looked to many to count. but it is the same youth who were redeemed to stand and serve the Father.
Rev 14:4
These are the ones who were not defiled with women, for they are virgins. These are the ones who follow the Lamb wherever He goes. These were redeemed[fn] from among men, being firstfruits to God and to the Lamb.
when you look at the words in greek it can means to walk the same righteous paths.
STRONGS NT 190: ἀκολουθέω
ἀκολουθέω, (ῶ; future ἀκολουθήσω; imperfect ἠκολούθουν; 1 aorist ἠκολούθησα; perfect ἠκολούθηκα (Mark 10:28 L T Tr WH); (from ἀκόλουθος, and this from a copulative and κέλευθος road, properly, walking the same road);
the rest of that chapter says
Rev 7:9
¶
After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, with palm branches in their hands,
Rev 7:10
and crying out with a loud voice, saying, “Salvation belongs to our God who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb!”
Rev 7:11
All the angels stood around the throne and the elders and the four living creatures, and fell on their faces before the throne and worshiped God,
Rev 7:12
saying:
“Amen! Blessing and glory and wisdom,
Thanksgiving and honor and power and might,
Be to our God forever and ever.
Amen.”
Rev 7:13
¶
Then one of the elders answered, saying to me, “Who are these arrayed in white robes, and where did they come from?”
Rev 7:14
¶
And I said to him, “Sir,[fn] you know.” So he said to me, “These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
Rev 7:15
“Therefore they are before the throne of God, and serve Him day and night in His temple. And He who sits on the throne will dwell among them.
Rev 7:16
“They shall neither hunger anymore nor thirst anymore; the sun shall not strike them, nor any heat;
Rev 7:17
“for the Lamb who is in the midst of the throne will shepherd them and lead them to living fountains of waters.[fn] And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes.”
John heard the number then saw the number of Youth serving the Father, those with His name on their foreheads
There is something really off about the 12 tribes as described in Genesis and then Revelation. I hope to get to the bottom of it at some point. I don't know why Levi is listed in Revelation when they were set apart as priests. So I question whether they should be among the 12 tribes in Revelation. When Jacob blessed his sons, he said Dan was to provide justice for his people (Genesis 49:16). So I'd think he'd definitely be among the tribes listed in Revelation. The only sons I can see not being accounted for in Revelation are Levi, because of the priesthood, and Reuben, because Jacob said he would no longer excel (Genesis 49:4). That would open up slots for Manasseh and Ephraim, whom Jacob said would become a group of nations (Genesis 48:19). So then that would mean the 12 tribes in end times would be:
Simeon
Judah
Issachar
Zebulun
Gad
Asher
Dan
Naphtali
Joseph
Benjamin
Ephraim
Manasseh
It doesn't make sense that Manasseh is listed in Revelation 7:5-8 and Ephraim isn't. Something isn't adding up between Genesis and Revelation.
could it be that Ephriam is the Father of Israel clans ... the king clan on earth might be Judah and the ruling clan of the clans of Israel is actually Ephriam..in the same way that
so Before the Father Jesus represents Judah as King but is on earth .. but before the Father Ehpriam was a double blessed son of Israel from Joseph his favorite son.The Father doesn't forget such things about Jacob or Joseph's heart folks.
He is not left out I believe he is Father of that list and of the clans and will be quite busy in those duties as the leading clan . just as clan Judah will be in the duties of kingship on earth . and as levi is with their temple duties on earth .. but that list isn't about kingship or the priesthood going on in earth... it is about youth serving their clans and tribes nations as priests as in the same way Jesus is now ..serving before the Father in His realm ..
I Bet Ephriam is the Father clan of all that activity going on before the Father clan and it is the Father's preistly clan of all the saved and purified of Israel( like Levite is in the land of Israel) thus Ephriam the priestly class( Joseph) in the heavenlies.. and the 14400 other's are priests of their own nations that they clearly representative of there as shown in that chapter . and all of those first fruits of that clan will be appointed in the same way levite priests will be on earth, they will be appointed and assigned and probably inheritated but approved within families lines.
exactly in the same way both have a mother clan and a mother church making a total of 12 daughters . mother church clan is Phillidelphia ( Alaşehir A =6 churches = city state of gentile clan https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elishah of the great Murdered kings AKA Alicione( aka the Bull constellation) mother of the 7 sisters/A+ 6 clans in the stars AKA (AE)LYCIANS world wide trading people of 10 nations of Jobs family, see Narmer's palette for the deaths shown on the first two " mythological kingdom" ( that aren't myths that on the Sumerian kings list. ) thus 6 clans and the 6 churches and the same other clans .... churches that are modeled after the 6 clans system . all have the same mother clan.
it is and will be a two dimensional and worldwide kingdom folks.. meaning stop thinking so little .. Israel is not a postage stamp size peice of ground forever .. it is going interdimensional and world wide . and probably on the God side and the bad side before it is over .. so think larger..
Last edited by n..Xuipa; 06-12-2018 at 10:01 AM..
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