Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Hello, I am new to this forum. I am very excited and happy that we can have differences of opinion and not be excommunicated from here or moderated for it. In the process of writing a dissertation, I was placed on moderation on another forum. A dear brother in the Lord told me I would not experience that here. So I am excited about sharing The Blessed Hope of the Believers with you.
So over the next few weeks, perhaps months, Lord willing, we will be discussing the second coming of our Lord. This event should not be considered a negative one; though it appears to carry much pain, trouble, and suffering for the saint. Often times, when discussing this event, people think, why discuss something so negative. Others incorrectly think,why discuss it, afterall he could come at any moment, with no qualifying signs or factors to preceed. In actuality, The Blessed Hope is the only hope we have as believers in this world. Therefore it is absolutely imperative we know what the hope is. We hope for something we do not see, and by faith, we know God will bring it to pass. That is faith in action. Without knowing the hope it is impossible to have the faith to stand or to have the spiritual eyes to see. Our Hope is not in the local church or mission boards; nor is it in our governments. Solely the only hope we have as believers is The Word of God and our Savior. As the day approaches, and it is approaching rapidly, it is imperative that we as believers know the truth and cling to it.
I have studied this doctrine of the return of Christ for some thirty two years, since I was 12. My knowledge has grown over the years. Hopefully this knowledge will touch the hearts of some or many here; in hopes of bringing the doctrine of the return of Christ as a challenge to the hearts and minds of the people here detail will be discussed perhaps as never seen before. Many, especially in the pre-tribulation rapture camps, attempt to exclude the second coming from being a doctrine of Christ or of the Word of God, which He Is. As we will discover, not only is it a doctrine, but it is as crucial to recognize it as a doctrine as it is to recognize its timing. Recently, one wrote, that there could be two belief systems with the Revelation or Second coming of Christ; the ideal this person presented was if we missed the pre-tribulation rapture because of our disbelief in it, than we could be redeemed at the end of the tribulation, or at the Second part of the second coming; now that does not make any sense at all.. So now they are willing to admit that there will be a great redemption of souls, as never seen before, at the end of The Great Tribulation, through translation (as Enoch) and through resurrection (As Lazarus and Christ). Yet, we see nothing of the sorts recorded in scripture; we do not see two, first resurrections or second comings in scripture, only one of each The only resurrection of the righteous we see or translation we see is at the end of the Great Tribulation. This means we must be prepared and knowledgeable of the events that will transpire, as most likely they will occur in this generation.
So now we will carry on to The Blessed Hope of the Believers.
Before we do that, we must have some recognition of who Babylon, the harlot is.
Last edited by Gideon7620; 11-03-2009 at 06:13 AM..
I am set to demonstrate that there will be no pre-tribulation rapture, but also to convey a message of what I believe to be fact, that being, America is modern Babylon. This makes it crucial to understand why this false doctrine of Pre-tibulationism is prevalent in most all churches. Realizing America is Babylon, makes it easier to understand why we have a strong false doctrine prevailing in most local churches. This should come as no surprise to us, as the bible tells us, the prophets and teachers of God's word in Modern Babylon would prophecy falsely saying, "Thus sayeth the Lord", when God has not said. In this case, the largest error found in most churches is a wishful thinking that Jesus is secretly, mysteriously, returning to deliver the churches from the wrath of Satan; this is the thus sayeth the Lord, that we do not see in scripture at all. So as stated in scripture, the prophets have prophesied falsely with regards to his return. Later we will learn why it is so important to know and believe the truth. This process could take several weeks or even months, depending on the responses we get.
What is modern Babylon? Modern Babylon is a system of Religious freedom for all religions; it is a unification of all faiths, cultures, ideals, and philosophies. It is as in ancient times a unification of all races, under one embrella, a sea of racial diversity as seen in scripture; One out of many, epruribus unum. We also must note that modern day Babylon has the largest seaports in the world; it is the center of world trade. Modern Babylon has the strongest military in the world. Another important note to note of Babylon is the fact that it has the largest economy in the world and has prospered more so than any Nation. The Modern day Babylonian system also has many councils and counselors. Notice we could pull thousands of verses to prove the US fits prophecy to a tee, but we won't; covering the main aspects should easily prove, America is modern day Babylon. Other important factors to add on to this too are the facts that America has spread its filth of materialism, idolatry, false religions, economics, and Hollywood filth to all the nations of the world. The nations have become drunk with the wine and excess of her fornication; take note, America is a lady. We even have the Babylonian idol, known as Ishtar in New York Harbor, known as Lady Liberty. Ironically, Ishtar, the bearer of light and freedom for all immigrants, also had her place in ancient Babylon. He place was to light the way for all immigrants seeking freedom and liberty through the Babylonian system. So as America has openings for all immigrants so did ancient Babylon. The ideal behind Babylon was to unite all races and cultures under one umbrella, and unify them to one. As you recall God did not want a one world system; he wanted nations to be separate and sovereign in all ways.
Many think modern Babylon is the Papacy. What we will discover is the papacy does not have the largest economy in the world. Nor does it have the largest seaports in the world. Further, it is not the place where the kings of the earth meet to make global changes and embargos against nations. The papacy does not spread Hollywood filth around the world, setting the culture of the world. Though many estimate the papacy to be Babylon, these few items of importance exclude this religious body from being the politcal beast system we see in Revelation 17 and 18. Only one city and nation fits that discription we see in Revelation, that is New York City and America.
Here just a few verses that demonstrate the United States of America is Babylon, Jeremiah 51:51, (Jeremiah 50:6),(Habakkuk 1:6), (Isaiah 13:19), (Isaiah 47:5), (Jeremiah 51:33), (Isaiah 47:1) .
Now, I understand that nature human instinct would be, this is preposterous. America, Babylonhttp://dailycrossesforums.com/forum/images/smilies/huh.gif (broken link) Give me a break. Consider for a moment that she is the financial capital of the world. New York City is considered the hub or capital of the world, by the entire world. Located in the center of NY's commerce in none other than the United Nations Security Council, a diplomatic arm or force used by corporate American interest to sway the nations to compliance; refusal to comply brings sanctions, trade embargos, and military invasions by allied nations belonging to the council, led by special interest. When looking at all the scriptural references given, consider that America is a perfect representation of what is recorded in scripture about Modern Day Babylon, The Mother of Harlots or the mother of the secular and corrupt establishments of Governments in History, in other words the worst case scenario of all corrupted governments..
Last edited by Gideon7620; 11-03-2009 at 09:09 AM..
You can most certainly be moderated here, have no doubt on that subject. Also, if you have topics based on Christian religions, they'll be better suited to being posted over in the Christianity sub-forum. You'll be less likely to have your Christian opinions debunked in there than out here. Of course, in there they spend a lot of time arguing about what "true" Christian is, so good luck.
Fair warning
Moderator cut: Deleted comments pertaining to moderation With the post I have made thus far, I would have been excommunicated elsewhere. I think I will stay here, I enjoy having debates with people in this topic erea. It seems to fit religion and philosophy well. It probably would have been better suited for prophecy, maybe not, but I am still trying to find my way. Though as I stated, it is suited well here, because Christianity and Judaism are the only true religions that can be proven extremely acurate, as such in these areas: historically, scientifically, prophetically, and geographically.
Modern day philosophies and prophetic interpretations in modern Christianity have presented a false hope for the world, Christendom, and Judaism. They have presented a hope of deliverance through an escapist mentality. They actually believe Jesus is coming to fly them away to escape all the horrors that will soon come upon this world: Such as the New World Order, The Mark of the Beat (RFD or microchip implantations), and even martyrdom for refusal to receive the mark or chip. All these areas they falsely claim to escape are recorded in scripture as a true experience the church will witness and be subject to. Nowhere in scripture do we see that God will pull the church out before Satan commits these atrocities against the church. The scriptures tell us the contrary. None can deny the prophetic order of events that are already transpiring and being fulfilled. As believers and interpreters of the Word of God, we already see many prophecies being fulfilled. With that being said, we should expect the remainder to be fulfilled and our presence must be here in order to see those remainders come to pass. Yet the majority of Christians have chose to blindly follow blind leaders that teach contrary to what is recorded in scripture. The excuse they give for the contradiction is dispensational, or their, the ruling Sheppard’s single ability to interpret God’s Word, while excluding the lay people from having that ability. In an effort to do this, they twist the Holy Bible to say something it clearly does not. This is a mere modern form of Papal rule as seen in ancient days, when the church or papacy was to be the sole interpreter of God’s Word. They have chosen to dress it up a bit in modern times by referring to it as dispensational or dispensationalism.
...Welcome Gideon......looking forward to taking this journey with you. I'm glad you're here...this should be very interesting.
I believe, as well, that we (believers) will be here to experience the terror of it...thus, God's Word warning us over and over again to be prepared...How?...By making sure we are strong and solid in our faith in Him, and make sure that we are walking in the Spirit and not in the flesh...our lamps full of the oil of the anointing...plus keeping "reserves" of the "oil" onhand......
...because faith is all we're going to have to sustain us and keep us through what is inevitably coming our way, and I believe with all of my heart it is...and we are going to be here in the midst of it....to endure.
...Welcome Gideon......looking forward to taking this journey with you. I'm glad you're here...this should be very interesting.
I believe, as well, that we (believers) will be here to experience the terror of it...thus, God's Word warning us over and over again to be prepared...How?...By making sure we are strong and solid in our faith in Him, and make sure that we are walking in the Spirit and not in the flesh...our lamps full of the oil of the anointing...plus keeping "reserves" of the "oil" onhand......
...because faith is all we're going to have to sustain us and keep us through what is inevitably coming our way, and I believe with all of my heart it is...and we are going to be here in the midst of it....to endure.
God Bless you,
Verna.
Gideon said, Precisely; I think God will give us strenghth when we most need it; that is the reserve tank. Currently we live on faith from day to day; but there seems to be goals of faith that are long term ones as well. In a sense God has showed us the future in his Word, through The Spirit and by faith. The fellowship we have with God and the seriousness we take his commmands and leading determine where we may fit in his plan. I so want to be there, because I know there is nothing he can not conquer; after all He is El Elion, The Master and Creator of the universe.
Gideon said, I am in agreement with you, in that the papacy is the religious harlot whom shall commission the false prophet we see working side to side with the antichrist. However it is impossible for Jerusalem to be the physical aspect of Babylon. Christ will reign out of Jerusalem one day, on the throne of David when he returns. Also he will return and defend her from the antichrist and nations of the world as they gather against Israel and Jerusalem after Babylon's or America’s destruction. Israel shall hot be destroyed; the nations only gather against her after Babylon is destroyed, as they think it is open game. Nor does she, Israel, possess the attributes, cultures, geography, trade ports, center of world Government as America does. This makes sense, as America has been the keeper of Jerusalem since God reestablished her. Once America is gone, there is no Christian nation to protect Israel. But little do they know this all falls into prophecy and God's perfect plan. Hence they are tempted to gather around Israel to attack her. Yet God in his prophetic sovereignty has predetermined this in order to gather her ememies for destruction. We will cover this in a bit more detail, later.
Last edited by Gideon7620; 11-03-2009 at 07:19 PM..
Gideon said, Precisely; I think God will give us strenghth when we most need it; that is the reserve tank. Currently we live on faith from day to day; but there seems to be goals of faith that are long term ones as well. In a sense God has showed us the future in his Word, through The Spirit and by faith. The fellowship we have with God and the seriousness we take his commmands and leading determine where we may fit in his plan. I so want to be there, because I know there is nothing he can not conquer; after all He is El Elion, The Master and Creator of the universe.
...You mention the fellowship we have with God, and the seriousness we take in recognizing, keeping, and obeying His commandments and leading...I take God's Word literally to mean exactly what He says. I don't have any problems with reading my Bible and understanding clearly what He is saying to me wihin it. I don't have to change any wording...or search any other book, everything I need to know is in the Scriptures...plain and simple. I am not making the claim, however, that I understand everything, I do not, but what I do understand, I do understand...if you can understand that...
I am a Commandment Keeper...I am a Sabbath Keeper. I do not commit willfull sin. I am a sinner saved by grace through faith in the redemptive power of Jesus' precious blood, and I am a work in progress...as I am being lead and taught by the Holy Spirit 24/7...I am never condemned...although I am lovingly convicted in my heart when I mistakenly think or say or do something wrong that I shouldn't have, where I immediately repent of it and learn from it...I am a work in progress, and I do not claim to have "arrrived," by no means. God knows my heart...my motives are pure and my heart is full of love for my brothers and sisters in Christ Jesus. The relationship I have with God is an intimate one...He is The husband I look forward to, with great expectation, to becoming one who will be among many to be His Beautiful Bride...and I so want to be there...more than anything in this world.
I received Jesus as my Savior in 1988, and it wasn't until 9 months ago that I came to the knowledge of the truth, and was baptized with the indwelling Spirit of Christ...since then I can say that I am truly a born again child of God...I have truly repented of my sins once and for all time.
...just some background on where I stand spiritually...and if you would...I would like to know a little more about you...where you stand spiritually...Thank you.
...You mention the fellowship we have with God, and the seriousness we take in recognizing, keeping, and obeying His commandments and leading...I take God's Word literally to mean exactly what He says. I don't have any problems with reading my Bible and understanding clearly what He is saying to me wihin it. I don't have to change any wording...or search any other book, everything I need to know is in the Scriptures...plain and simple. I am not making the claim, however, that I understand everything, I do not, but what I do understand, I do understand...if you can understand that...
I am a Commandment Keeper...I am a Sabbath Keeper. I do not commit willfull sin. I am a sinner saved by grace through faith in the redemptive power of Jesus' precious blood, and I am a work in progress...as I am being lead and taught by the Holy Spirit 24/7...I am never condemned...although I am lovingly convicted in my heart when I mistakenly think or say or do something wrong that I shouldn't have, where I immediately repent of it and learn from it...I am a work in progress, and I do not claim to have "arrrived," by no means. God knows my heart...my motives are pure and my heart is full of love for my brothers and sisters in Christ Jesus. The relationship I have with God is an intimate one...He is The husband I look forward to, with great expectation, to becoming one who will be among many to be His Beautiful Bride...and I so want to be there...more than anything in this world.
I received Jesus as my Savior in 1988, and it wasn't until 9 months ago that I came to the knowledge of the truth, and was baptized with the indwelling Spirit of Christ...since then I can say that I am truly a born again child of God...I have truly repented of my sins once and for all time.
...just some background on where I stand spiritually...and if you would...I would like to know a little more about you...where you stand spiritually...Thank you.
God Bless you,
Verna.
Gideon said,
I too take God's words seriously and literally. I maintain an expository, literal verbal plenary interpretation of the events enclosed in scripture. However to arrive at some effectiveness in interpreting the scriptures, it is more affective to utilize books, as a concordance, and a Greek and Hebrew dictionary to unfold meanings which can not be arrived at by just reading the Word. At times they are thinly vealed in a cloud so to speak, but to clearly and vividly see them we must use these other sources at times.
At age 5 I accepted Christ as Savior and did not grow up in a Christian home. I was filled with the spirit at five but lost fellowship with my savior as I had no direction in a non Christian home; Though I know, I never lost salvation. Under the leadership of a spirit filled missionary, I rededicated my life to Christ at about age 19. I have found we are at war with Satan.
I am confused when you state you were saved in 1988 but did not come to the knowledge of the truth until 9 months ago. Jesus is the truth, life and the only way; I came to the knowledge of the truth at age five. I will never forget the day he imputed his righteousness on me to cover my sins. I will never forget the day he sanctified me as a saint. I will never forget the day he regenerated me as a saint of the Most high God. As time went on I grew in his grace and knowledge but I found the truth at age five.
Now you mentioned that you keep the Sabbath. Are you a seventh day Adventist? That is my immediate guess. If so then you think I have already accepted the Mark of the beast as I do not go to church on Saturday or anyday for that matter. When I came back into fellowship with God, it was during the week for the most part. Further, if you are then you also believe that when the Mark of the Beast does come out, that it will not be the mark, but rather not going to church on Saturday is the mark. It appears you are saying that water baptism saves you. We see this nowhere in scripture. As an example, the thief on the cross was never baptized. The Ethiopian Eunich believed and then was baptized. I am not saying this is the case with you. Finally you seem to have been saved twice: once in 1988 and again 9 months ago. I am just asking if it is. If you can help clear this up, I WILL move forward either way. As you know, once a saint is saved they are always saved. Nothing can undo that.
Thanks,
Gideon
Last edited by Gideon7620; 11-03-2009 at 11:44 PM..
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
...looking forward to taking this journey with you. I'm glad you're here...this should be very interesting.
...
Thanks for the welcome Verna...
