Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I vote Pittsburgh as having a better future, only because Saint Louis has never made a smart urban planning decision since it destroyed its historic core in the white flight era. So I have little confidence the city will be able to do anything productive.
St. Louis has been a dying city ever since it destroyed its heritage in the name of 'progress.'
I disagree. St. Louis built a rather large light rail system (with plans for expansion), has one of the largest greenway/bike trail systems in the country, continued expansion and redevelopment of cultural and educational institutions, a crapload of gentrified neighborhoods since urban renewal. I think you have a very limited or uniformed view of St. Louis. There are A LOT of positive urban developments going on in the region. St. Louis has just as much redevelopment if not more than Pittsburgh. Urban renewal was surely cruel to St. Louis, but I have no idea what you mean when you say we destroyed our heritage. There is still an abundance of urban culture in St. Louis and the history is pretty much in your face compared to a lot of cities.
St. Louis has more potential than other similar cities but has to get past some bad civic decisions and it suffers from being the stepchild and whipping-boy for Missouri.
Thanks for setting the record straight, goat314. For purported "city enthusiasts" who populate this forum, a lot of them sure seem to eat up whatever stereotypes are spoon-fed to them by frivolous click-bait websites. Makes me question their knowledge and experience of cities.
St. Louis did have a pretty intense bout of urban renewal though which included large tracts close to downtown. Highway construction also tore up neighborhoods to a very large extent, and unlike some other cities such as Pittsburgh, there were no successful major highway revolts to curb those plans. I think were these at least somewhat mitigated, then St. Louis would be more like Boston or Philadelphia in terms of intact urbanity. Pittsburgh also had urban renewal projects that didn't end up going so well, but they were smaller in scale though they did occur right next to downtown. Pittsburgh also had freeway construction, but community opposition was able to check some of it including the Oakland Crosstown Expressway and the East Liberty Expressway which would have torn through and made disjointed some of the most active and vibrant neighborhoods in Pittsburgh today. This isn't to say there aren't great intact neighborhoods in St. Louis, because those certainly exist, but that it's arguable that St. Louis went further with policies that were ultimately destructive for the city core.
However, it's already been done so now it just makes sense to think of what can be done to improve the city as is. It seems like there's been promising developments.
Last edited by OyCrumbler; 07-02-2017 at 08:12 AM..
However, it's already been done so now it just makes sense to think of what can be done to improve the city as is. It seems like there's been promising developments.
I'm in your city twice a year here's what I think: Make a growth and revitalization plan say 5 and 10 years out with a goal of what kind of city you want to be. Image and perception is everything. Make it beautiful, make your city a destination, a place people want to go for work and play a place companies want to invest in. Many cities spend without any plan with sporadic and scattered improvements that when people visit they never see. Make it a safer place. Right now it's not that.
Keep improving the airport and rail and keep making connections and improvements.
You have a lot of cool things to offer and I'm sure the city can be a great people destination-it's got an advantageous central location.
Now I'm sure the natives that frequent this forum know way more than me and can chime in and maybe you have, I just don't have time to search.
I tend to agree that it's all about image. Pittsburgh's annual homicide rate is usually >20/100,000 people (among the worst in the country due to our large black underclass), but most people don't think "Pittsburgh = Violence" whereas that's what a lot of people think about St. Louis, which IS more violent than Pittsburgh but not usually by a significant margin.
I tend to agree that it's all about image. Pittsburgh's annual homicide rate is usually >20/100,000 people (among the worst in the country due to our large black underclass), but most people don't think "Pittsburgh = Violence" whereas that's what a lot of people think about St. Louis, which IS more violent than Pittsburgh but not usually by a significant margin.
How can St. Louis shake its violent image?
Pittsburgh is beautiful-its geographic location with the hills, rivers and all the green everywhere. The beautiful downtown buildings especially when you emerge from the tunnel it's breathtaking. The vantage points are awesome, it's a cool place that's my perception.
As far as the crime thing...I wish I knew. More cops and more getting to know the communities and people in them would be a start. But getting to the kids is paramount, better schools and teachers is so important. It's also economics and racial equity. If people feel good about themselves and have jobs and a purpose there's less idle time to get in trouble. You can't stop all crime but in my small town there's practically no crime. NYC changed from dangerous, I was scared to go to some places years ago, to what it is now.
Thing is more people are moving into cities and if yours isn't perceived "good" then it'll just stagnate and be forgotten.
Polls like this are more a reflection of who posts on this site more than anything ...
I am noting that it does seem to be the same old faces/posters who are dissing St Louis ...
I don't know if you're referring to me but I'm pretty new here and I don't diss anyplace. I'm saying what I see when I visit the city from a point of view of once or twice a year kind of a first impression thing. No offense intended!
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
