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Your right. MSA/CSA designations don't apply in the state of NJ because you said so.
They do. But "sphere of influence" or "CSA" or even "MSA" means little to me when the fact is that NJ beaches, used plenty by both New Yorkers and Pennsylvanians, are NJ's only. Your "sphere of influence" can extend halfway to Africa across the ocean... but the beaches are still neither in PA or NY... they're in NJ. Can there be ONE positive thing that NJ is actually allowed to claim as our own without our metros pouncing on it?? Can that one thing be our beaches?? NJ is defined by its 2 metros, really, like it or not. I'd appreciate it if the Jersey Shore isn't. We try to be our own in this state, and people even from both states near us ask why we don't try more to be our own, but the problem is it's kind of hard to when our big cities we border by river want us to be theirs. Can't have it both ways.
Regardless of whose beaches they are or whose "sphere of influence" (I just love that term, can't you tell?) they fall under, I still much prefer ocean beaches over lake beaches and I do find the Philly metro better than Chicago's in pretty much every way. But the lake beach vs ocean beach thing has been done a trillion times and it's kind of exhausting. People used to the ocean claim there is nothing like it (... and there isn't) and people used to the lakes try to tell us the lakes are JUST like the ocean and the beaches are basically the same in every possible category or way (they aren't...). There is nothing like an ocean beach.
Of course. The geographical Delaware Valley does not include anything coastal. The city of Cape May, for example, is not geographically the Delaware Valley, it is part of the vast east coast coastal plain that extends from Long Island to Florida.
I am quite sick of seeing Philadelphia posters refer to the Jersey Shore as "theirs." You don't see New Yorkers do this. I've explained why. I know that south Jersey shore counties are in Philly's CSA but before anything it is NJ. Some people forget that.
PHILADELPHIANS do this? Or just the regular 5 or 6 posters on CD?
Location: East Central Pennsylvania/ Chicago for 6yrs.
2,535 posts, read 3,282,012 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Summersm343
Ayo bud. Read the title. This isn't just city proper. This is Chicagoland vs Delaware Valley. The entire areas.
I think we all agree Chicago city is better than Philadelphia city by a wide margin. Delaware Valley however may just be better than Chicagoland.
Someone answered this.... the Delaware Valley does not go all the way to the Jersey Shore. It is a River Valley. That surely includes the New Jersey side of the River. Just not all the way to the Ocean.
Location: East Central Pennsylvania/ Chicago for 6yrs.
2,535 posts, read 3,282,012 times
Reputation: 1483
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyGirl415
They do. But "sphere of influence" or "CSA" or even "MSA" means little to me when the fact is that NJ beaches, used plenty by both New Yorkers and Pennsylvanians, are NJ's only. Your "sphere of influence" can extend halfway to Africa across the ocean... but the beaches are still neither in PA or NY... they're in NJ. Can there be ONE positive thing that NJ is actually allowed to claim as our own without our metros pouncing on it?? Can that one thing be our beaches?? NJ is defined by its 2 metros, really, like it or not. I'd appreciate it if the Jersey Shore isn't. We try to be our own in this state, and people even from both states near us ask why we don't try more to be our own, but the problem is it's kind of hard to when our big cities we border by river want us to be theirs. Can't have it both ways.
Regardless of whose beaches they are or whose "sphere of influence" (I just love that term, can't you tell?) they fall under, I still much prefer ocean beaches over lake beaches and I do find the Philly metro better than Chicago's in pretty much every way. But the lake beach vs ocean beach thing has been done a trillion times and it's kind of exhausting. People used to the ocean claim there is nothing like it (... and there isn't) and people used to the lakes try to tell us the lakes are JUST like the ocean and the beaches are basically the same in every possible category or way (they aren't...). There is nothing like an ocean beach.
The thread is on CHICAGOLAND and DELAWARE VALLEY . I live in PA. Been to the Jersey and Maryland Shore many times. No one compared, or preferred a lake beach over a ocean one? Utilize the River beaches for the Delaware Valley I surely love Florida Beaches. I could note Jersey ones don't match those? That is not CHICAGOLAND though? But again Chicago is on Great Lake and within the boundaries of CHICAGOLAND are my pictures of beaches. It can't be said of the Jersey Shore is in the boundaries of Philly or Delaware Valley.
But CHICAGO'S lake beaches are awesome in their own right for a asset in CHICAGOLAND's favor. I surely would prefer a Florida beach or Caribbean Island one in a topic on beaches.
Frankly...I am tired of the ignorance of the Indiana side of the Chicago area's Shoreline. The Indiana Dunes sprawls for a dozen miles and contains a stunning one of a kind National Park, with the third highest level of plant and animal diversity of all of America's National Parks. I challenge anyone to watch this video and deny that Chicagoland pales in comparison to ANY ocean fronting metro. And for what it's worth the Dunes are accessible to Chicago via the South Shore at Miller, Ogden Dunes, Dune Park, Beverly Shore and Michigan City Staitions.
And in terms of Atlantic City...the closest parallel would be Michigan City...even the names are parallel. But Michigan City is nicer IMO...with a better beach. there is also a casino there, and there are water-based casinos in Hammond, East Chicago, and Gary.
JerseyGirl....I don't want to get into the whole ocean vs. Great Lakes thing again...we've been down that road enough...but curious if you watched the video of the Indiana Dunes? The beach, the dunes, the forests, swamps, and bogs are truly stunning. If you ever take another road trip to Chicago...be sure to explore the National Lakeshore....just 10 minutes or so from I-80
I don't have to. Does it makes Philly feel better that those beaches are "the Philly area"? You don't see New Yorkers obsess over the northern NJ shore counties. That difference is telling to me.
Cape May is no more "Philly's" than it is mine - all the way up here in north Jersey, in New York country. All of the Jersey Shore is NJ's first and foremost.
1. Treads lightly but who wants to take bragging rights for the North Jersey Beaches? Now the South Jersey beaches area completely different story. Historically(this is where you should do some homework)Cape May- Atlantic City have always been associated with the Philadelphia metro.
2.You have to blame NJ politicians/leadership over the past 3 centuries for not providing a competent power center to compete with NYC and Philadelphia. Whether you like it or not North Jersey is basically a suburb pf NYC. South Jersey suburb of Philadelphia. Honestly they should probably due away with the state entirely. Area N of RT 1 NY. South of Rt 1 Pennsylvania.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyGirl415
^ For some more misinformed posters. This is what I was getting at.
Perhaps it is you who is misinformed.
One more time from DVRCP data. DVRPC refers to a muti-state regional committee based on planning and transportation related issues along the tidal regions of the Delaware River and Bay.
Nearly every single goods and service provided from Atlantic City to Cape May originates from Philadelphias msa.
Counties making up the Delaware Valley
Map of the Delaware Valley region
Delaware
Kent County
New Castle County
Maryland
Cecil County
New Jersey
Atlantic County
Burlington County
Camden County Cape May County
Cumberland County
Gloucester County
Salem County
Pennsylvania
Berks County
Bucks County
Chester County
Delaware County
Montgomery County
Philadelphia County
They both have very nice suburbs in their surrounding areas, both quaint and cookie-cutter. For overall natural beauty, the Deleware valley is more diverse, but Chicagoland has some really nice areas, too (Lake county IL and IN; Chain O Lakes region). The biggest knock against Chicagoland is its adjacency to farmland, which is always slammed as less interesting or beautiful than other topography. In the end, you can find a great suburb that's urban, dense, and lush in either.
The thread is on CHICAGOLAND and DELAWARE VALLEY . I live in PA. Been to the Jersey and Maryland Shore many times. No one compared, or preferred a lake beach over a ocean one? Utilize the River beaches for the Delaware Valley I surely love Florida Beaches. I could note Jersey ones don't match those? That is not CHICAGOLAND though? But again Chicago is on Great Lake and within the boundaries of CHICAGOLAND are my pictures of beaches. It can't be said of the Jersey Shore is in the boundaries of Philly or Delaware Valley.
But CHICAGO'S lake beaches are awesome in their own right for a asset in CHICAGOLAND's favor. I surely would prefer a Florida beach or Caribbean Island one in a topic on beaches.
Okay so now Philadelphia isn't allowed to use areas that are included in its CSA as a part of it's area for comparison? But Chicago can include areas outside of the MSA or CSA? Oh okay, makes sense?
Remember. The Philadelphia area is 5,000 sq miles. Chicagoland? Over 10,000.
It doesn't matter what you "think" or what you want, but the ACTUAL census designation puts the entirety of Southern New Jersey within the Philadelphia area, whether a part of the MSA or CSAT.
Right. And many times NJ posters brag about this fact. Often, they consider their state better because of this fact. And, many look down upon rural areas and people from places like Central PA and other secluded areas.
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Can't have it both ways. 
