05-13-2012, 10:54 PM
16,393 posts, read
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Reputation: 25501
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Cleverfield
Cleveland, and several other Ohio cities are opening casinos very soon (Cleveland's is opening on Monday). On the one hand, these casinos create jobs, bring in tourists, and generate tax revenue for the city and state. But on the other hand, they draw money away from people that live in the city, giving them nothing but a few hours of entertainment in return. Many of the people gambling at the casinos will undoubtedly be poor, and some will be addicts. So I don't know if I think casinos are really good for cities in the end or not. What do you all, especially those who live in cities that already have casinos, think.
Here are my reasons for NOT supporting legalized gambling. For the record, I have no moral qualms about gaming in general.
First, MANY of the casino employees that I have encountered in Midwest casinos come from other gaming venues rather than the local labor pool.
Second, what experience do the Ohio regulators have in managing a casino? There is no Nevada Gaming Commission with years of regulatory experience.
Third, I would strongly recommend that you look at the relationships between the casino interests and the local politicians. Look at the Missouri and Illinois situations for all the corruption.
Fourth, if you are expecting a "increase in tourism", it is illusionary. All activity occurs at the casino. If you own a restaurant down the street, you will see people heading to the casino BUT they generally will NOT leave the casino.
Fifth, you will see increased activity at places like the welfare office, credit counseling and the other social service agencies. You will see more families at the various food banks in the city.
Finally, you will see the already meager savings of many wiped out. A family member is dealing with that currently. His MIL turned 65 and had a completely paid for home. She started borrowing a lot of money for trips to the riverboats and not has more debt than equity.
05-14-2012, 08:02 AM
Location: Cincinnati
4,479 posts, read
6,232,680 times
Reputation: 1331
If someone is a gambling addict they will gamble whether or not it's legalized.
05-14-2012, 08:30 AM
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
16,544 posts, read
19,679,952 times
Reputation: 13326
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Cleverfield
Many people don't understand how casinos work, and believe that they can easily get rich. Those are the same people who don't have a good education, or good jobs, and can least afford to lose the money.
Seriously?
I don't know any one that thinks "O man, I am totally getting rich when this opens"... and I know a lot of "poor dumb people"...
05-14-2012, 08:42 AM
Location: Akron, soon to be CLE again!
20 posts, read
53,434 times
Reputation: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jlawrence01
Here are my reasons for NOT supporting legalized gambling. For the record, I have no moral qualms about gaming in general.
To me it doesnt sound like you are local to Cleveland. Id like to try and counter your points here from my point of view.
First, the overwhelming majority of the 1600 Cleveland casino employees are local.
Second, what experience did the Nevada Gaming Commission have when they were first set up? And this ties into your first point, and youre saying it yourself that out of state workers were not brought in for this, as they would have experience, so this must all be made up of locals!
Third, the casino owner, Dan Gilbert, has huge ties to this city. And I would love to see those ties grown and expand and deepen. We need many many many more of him. He has been investing more hope and money into this city than anyone else. Not only with the casino, but bringing hundreds of financial jobs and pouring money into current and new sports teams and the arena. Our politicians need to have stronger connections with him imo, as they could certainly learn alot from him.
Fourth, I go back to my point three. Gilbert knows the importance of a strong downtown, and has made the connectivity of the casino to the city fabric the number one point. Many entrances/exits directly to the city streets and the existing Tower City Mall, floor to ceiling windows, etc. Theres no new hotel, so as to not cannibalize off of existing dt hotels. Same with on site entertainment, as we already have the second largest theater district, and a great music scene. The only restaurants added into the casino are styles that do not currently exist downtown.
Fifth and "finally", I currently work with a lot of the people referred to as "poor and uneducated" (not your words but those of other posters ive seen). Yes, alot of them are very excited about the new casino here and plan to go regularly. But, this is just going to substitute their already regular trips to Detroit and PA and WV. Its no new "loss" of income or savings. Regular gamblers know its a form of entertainment, and have set aside the money they use for that just the same as other people budget for other forms of entertainment
05-14-2012, 10:58 AM
Location: Akron, soon to be CLE again!
20 posts, read
53,434 times
Reputation: 15
Yeah, she says shes "gonna get rich" but she also talks about the people already going and gambling in Detroit. Its nothing new, instead of money on entertainment being spent out of state, the moneys going to be spent right here in downtown Cleveland
05-14-2012, 02:47 PM
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
16,544 posts, read
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Reputation: 13326
She could be referring to Cleveland, too, because that was what she was talking about. If she was referring to Clevelanders, I am sure she was just being giddy about having a casino here and does not seriously expect to "get rich!"
05-14-2012, 02:50 PM
4,361 posts, read
7,173,361 times
Reputation: 4866
Gotta love anecdotal evidence. If you can find one instance in 50,000 then it must be true for everyone.
05-14-2012, 04:14 PM
306 posts, read
821,002 times
Reputation: 169
Quote:
Originally Posted by
TomJones123
If someone is a gambling addict they will gamble whether or not it's legalized.
I'm about as Pro-gaming as you can get but that's a silly comment. I saw multiple family members who became addicts once casinos came to my home state. They don't gamble anywhere else and didn't prior. If the casinos hadn't been built, they would not be addicts today.
To answer the OP, I've lived in multiple places that added gaming while I lived there. The key is to keep expectations to a minimum. It's not a silver bullet and shouldn't be looked at as a cash cow for governments. Relying on casinos for budgets and economic growth isn't very smart.
05-14-2012, 04:55 PM
Location: Chicago(Northside)
3,678 posts, read
7,212,554 times
Reputation: 1697
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Natural510
I know they expect a boom from them in Ohio's cities, and in a way have helped redevelop struggling cities such as Detroit, but I have to agree it's not exactly the healthiest vice to build around. I know locals were tired of seeing their money leave the state for those who like to gamble in Indiana and on riverboats, but I think it will just make a bad problem worse for much of the state's working-class.
I didnt know detroit was in Ohio
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Class of Workers - Federal government workers (%)
Class of Workers - Self-employed workers in own not incorporated business and Unpaid family workers (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Utility gas (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Bottled, tank, or LP gas (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Electricity (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Fuel oil, kerosene, etc. (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Coal or coke (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Wood (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Solar energy (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Other fuel (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - No fuel used (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Utility gas (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Bottled, tank, or LP gas (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Electricity (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Fuel oil, kerosene, etc. (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Coal or coke (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Wood (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Solar energy (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Other fuel (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - No fuel used (%)
Armed forces status - In Armed Forces (%)
Armed forces status - Civilian (%)
Armed forces status - Civilian - Veteran (%)
Armed forces status - Civilian - Nonveteran (%)
Fatal accidents locations in years 2005-2021
Fatal accidents locations in 2005
Fatal accidents locations in 2006
Fatal accidents locations in 2007
Fatal accidents locations in 2008
Fatal accidents locations in 2009
Fatal accidents locations in 2010
Fatal accidents locations in 2011
Fatal accidents locations in 2012
Fatal accidents locations in 2013
Fatal accidents locations in 2014
Fatal accidents locations in 2015
Fatal accidents locations in 2016
Fatal accidents locations in 2017
Fatal accidents locations in 2018
Fatal accidents locations in 2019
Fatal accidents locations in 2020
Fatal accidents locations in 2021
Alcohol use - People drinking some alcohol every month (%)
Alcohol use - People not drinking at all (%)
Alcohol use - Average days/month drinking alcohol
Alcohol use - Average drinks/week
Alcohol use - Average days/year people drink much
Audiometry - Average condition of hearing (%)
Audiometry - People that can hear a whisper from across a quiet room (%)
Audiometry - People that can hear normal voice from across a quiet room (%)
Audiometry - Ears ringing, roaring, buzzing (%)
Audiometry - Had a job exposure to loud noise (%)
Audiometry - Had off-work exposure to loud noise (%)
Blood Pressure & Cholesterol - Has high blood pressure (%)
Blood Pressure & Cholesterol - Checking blood pressure at home (%)
Blood Pressure & Cholesterol - Frequently checking blood cholesterol (%)
Blood Pressure & Cholesterol - Has high cholesterol level (%)
Consumer Behavior - Money monthly spent on food at supermarket/grocery store
Consumer Behavior - Money monthly spent on food at other stores
Consumer Behavior - Money monthly spent on eating out
Consumer Behavior - Money monthly spent on carryout/delivered foods
Consumer Behavior - Income spent on food at supermarket/grocery store (%)
Consumer Behavior - Income spent on food at other stores (%)
Consumer Behavior - Income spent on eating out (%)
Consumer Behavior - Income spent on carryout/delivered foods (%)
Current Health Status - General health condition (%)
Current Health Status - Blood donors (%)
Current Health Status - Has blood ever tested for HIV virus (%)
Current Health Status - Left-handed people (%)
Dermatology - People using sunscreen (%)
Diabetes - Diabetics (%)
Diabetes - Had a blood test for high blood sugar (%)
Diabetes - People taking insulin (%)
Diet Behavior & Nutrition - Diet health (%)
Diet Behavior & Nutrition - Milk product consumption (# of products/month)
Diet Behavior & Nutrition - Meals not home prepared (#/week)
Diet Behavior & Nutrition - Meals from fast food or pizza place (#/week)
Diet Behavior & Nutrition - Ready-to-eat foods (#/month)
Diet Behavior & Nutrition - Frozen meals/pizza (#/month)
Drug Use - People that ever used marijuana or hashish (%)
Drug Use - Ever used hard drugs (%)
Drug Use - Ever used any form of cocaine (%)
Drug Use - Ever used heroin (%)
Drug Use - Ever used methamphetamine (%)
Health Insurance - People covered by health insurance (%)
Kidney Conditions-Urology - Avg. # of times urinating at night
Medical Conditions - People with asthma (%)
Medical Conditions - People with anemia (%)
Medical Conditions - People with psoriasis (%)
Medical Conditions - People with overweight (%)
Medical Conditions - Elderly people having difficulties in thinking or remembering (%)
Medical Conditions - People who ever received blood transfusion (%)
Medical Conditions - People having trouble seeing even with glass/contacts (%)
Medical Conditions - People with arthritis (%)
Medical Conditions - People with gout (%)
Medical Conditions - People with congestive heart failure (%)
Medical Conditions - People with coronary heart disease (%)
Medical Conditions - People with angina pectoris (%)
Medical Conditions - People who ever had heart attack (%)
Medical Conditions - People who ever had stroke (%)
Medical Conditions - People with emphysema (%)
Medical Conditions - People with thyroid problem (%)
Medical Conditions - People with chronic bronchitis (%)
Medical Conditions - People with any liver condition (%)
Medical Conditions - People who ever had cancer or malignancy (%)
Mental Health - People who have little interest in doing things (%)
Mental Health - People feeling down, depressed, or hopeless (%)
Mental Health - People who have trouble sleeping or sleeping too much (%)
Mental Health - People feeling tired or having little energy (%)
Mental Health - People with poor appetite or overeating (%)
Mental Health - People feeling bad about themself (%)
Mental Health - People who have trouble concentrating on things (%)
Mental Health - People moving or speaking slowly or too fast (%)
Mental Health - People having thoughts they would be better off dead (%)
Oral Health - Average years since last visit a dentist
Oral Health - People embarrassed because of mouth (%)
Oral Health - People with gum disease (%)
Oral Health - General health of teeth and gums (%)
Oral Health - Average days a week using dental floss/device
Oral Health - Average days a week using mouthwash for dental problem
Oral Health - Average number of teeth
Pesticide Use - Households using pesticides to control insects (%)
Pesticide Use - Households using pesticides to kill weeds (%)
Physical Activity - People doing vigorous-intensity work activities (%)
Physical Activity - People doing moderate-intensity work activities (%)
Physical Activity - People walking or bicycling (%)
Physical Activity - People doing vigorous-intensity recreational activities (%)
Physical Activity - People doing moderate-intensity recreational activities (%)
Physical Activity - Average hours a day doing sedentary activities
Physical Activity - Average hours a day watching TV or videos
Physical Activity - Average hours a day using computer
Physical Functioning - People having limitations keeping them from working (%)
Physical Functioning - People limited in amount of work they can do (%)
Physical Functioning - People that need special equipment to walk (%)
Physical Functioning - People experiencing confusion/memory problems (%)
Physical Functioning - People requiring special healthcare equipment (%)
Prescription Medications - Average number of prescription medicines taking
Preventive Aspirin Use - Adults 40+ taking low-dose aspirin (%)
Reproductive Health - Vaginal deliveries (%)
Reproductive Health - Cesarean deliveries (%)
Reproductive Health - Deliveries resulted in a live birth (%)
Reproductive Health - Pregnancies resulted in a delivery (%)
Reproductive Health - Women breastfeeding newborns (%)
Reproductive Health - Women that had a hysterectomy (%)
Reproductive Health - Women that had both ovaries removed (%)
Reproductive Health - Women that have ever taken birth control pills (%)
Reproductive Health - Women taking birth control pills (%)
Reproductive Health - Women that have ever used Depo-Provera or injectables (%)
Reproductive Health - Women that have ever used female hormones (%)
Sexual Behavior - People 18+ that ever had sex (vaginal, anal, or oral) (%)
Sexual Behavior - Males 18+ that ever had vaginal sex with a woman (%)
Sexual Behavior - Males 18+ that ever performed oral sex on a woman (%)
Sexual Behavior - Males 18+ that ever had anal sex with a woman (%)
Sexual Behavior - Males 18+ that ever had any sex with a man (%)
Sexual Behavior - Females 18+ that ever had vaginal sex with a man (%)
Sexual Behavior - Females 18+ that ever performed oral sex on a man (%)
Sexual Behavior - Females 18+ that ever had anal sex with a man (%)
Sexual Behavior - Females 18+ that ever had any kind of sex with a woman (%)
Sexual Behavior - Average age people first had sex
Sexual Behavior - Average number of female sex partners in lifetime (males 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of female vaginal sex partners in lifetime (males 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average age people first performed oral sex on a woman (18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of woman performed oral sex on in lifetime (18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of male sex partners in lifetime (males 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of male anal sex partners in lifetime (males 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average age people first performed oral sex on a man (18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of male oral sex partners in lifetime (18+)
Sexual Behavior - People using protection when performing oral sex (%)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of times people have vaginal or anal sex a year
Sexual Behavior - People having sex without condom (%)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of male sex partners in lifetime (females 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of male vaginal sex partners in lifetime (females 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of female sex partners in lifetime (females 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Circumcised males 18+ (%)
Sleep Disorders - Average hours sleeping at night
Sleep Disorders - People that has trouble sleeping (%)
Smoking-Cigarette Use - People smoking cigarettes (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ having problems with smell (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ having problems with taste (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ that ever had wisdom teeth removed (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ that ever had tonsils teeth removed (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ that ever had a loss of consciousness because of a head injury (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ that ever had a broken nose or other serious injury to face or skull (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ that ever had two or more sinus infections (%)
Weight - Average height (inches)
Weight - Average weight (pounds)
Weight - Average BMI
Weight - People that are obese (%)
Weight - People that ever were obese (%)
Weight - People trying to lose weight (%)
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