Housing Market for $500k+ Homes (Cleveland, Shaker Heights: sale, real estate market, mortgage)
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My family and I will be relocating to Cleveland soon from out of state. Specifically, I will be working in the Independence area. It is likely that we will only be in Cleveland for 2-3 years before relocating again, however it is possible we will stay for longer if we are really enjoying the area.
In light of this, what suburbs have the best housing market for 500k-800k homes? I just want to be able to sell the house quickly and for the same price I paid if I end up leaving in a few years. I am not concerned with accounting for commissions/closing costs, as these are covered by my employer. Also, if I sell down the road I do not want to have the property on the market for 6+ months.
Some of the neighborhoods we like the most based on our research are Pepper Pike, Shaker Heights, Hudson, Chagrin Falls, and Rocky River. There are a number of other suburbs which we are considering as well. Are we looking in the right areas for this price range? I have seen quite a few properties that are selling for less than they were purchased for 3-5 years ago, which concerns me.
My family and I will be relocating to Cleveland soon from out of state. Specifically, I will be working in the Independence area. It is likely that we will only be in Cleveland for 2-3 years before relocating again, however it is possible we will stay for longer if we are really enjoying the area.
In light of this, what suburbs have the best housing market for 500k-800k homes? I just want to be able to sell the house quickly and for the same price I paid if I end up leaving in a few years. I am not concerned with accounting for commissions/closing costs, as these are covered by my employer. Also, if I sell down the road I do not want to have the property on the market for 6+ months.
Some of the neighborhoods we like the most based on our research are Pepper Pike, Shaker Heights, Hudson, Chagrin Falls, and Rocky River. There are a number of other suburbs which we are considering as well. Are we looking in the right areas for this price range? I have seen quite a few properties that are selling for less than they were purchased for 3-5 years ago, which concerns me.
Cleveland Magazine annually produces a "Rating the Suburbs" issue. Highly rated, more expensive suburbs convenient for Independence would include Richfield and Peninsula. Solon is a possibility and likely has the best public schools in Greater Cleveland, if that is a concern.
Hudson and Rocky River both are within 30-minute commutes of Independence. Both have good schools, but they are very different communities. Rocky River is heavily oriented to Lake Erie, the Rocky River Reservation, downtown Cleveland and University Circle. Rocky River has much better mass transit access to Cleveland (e.g., check Google Transit for options between a prospective address and Tower City, which provides access to downtown sporting venues), and is much more convenient for Cleveland Hopkins. Pepper Pike is Greater Cleveland's wealthiest large suburb and would offer you more options in your housing price range, and has perhaps a slightly shorter commute to Independence than Solon or Rocky River.
The "Rating the Suburbs" issue must be purchased. I don't believe it's available online. A Cleveland Magazine subscription would be very worthwhile; even purchase back issues (perhaps they have a deal for purchasing back issues).
Have you read through this thread, beginning with post 3?
Shaker Hts. is much more convenient to University Circle's great cultural attractions and offers great rail transit service to downtown. Shaker Square has some of the area's best and most unique restaurants, such as EDWINs, the Balaton, and Fire, not to mention the many options in Cleveland Hts. and even downtown. If cuisine is important, it's tough to beat the SH area. It also offers some expensive housing options, but $800,000 there might buy you more house than you desire. I also wonder about relative housing price stability in SH given the relatively high tax rates and the impact of the state and local income tax limitation in the current federal tax law, but that may be reversed quickly if the Democrats control the federal government come November.
It's very uncertain how the COVID-19 epidemic will reshape Greater Cleveland, but there will be a significant impact, especially for the next 2-3 years.
Many macroeconomic factors likely will influence Cleveland housing prices in coming years, IMO likely much more than local market differences. Higher mortgage rates, higher inflation, and climate change are issues discussed in the above thread.
Thanks for the reply WRnative. Would you see Shaker Heights as a city that is more stable to market fluctuations due to the unique housing stock and proximity to University Circle / Cleveland Clinic? Recognizing that my housing budget attracts a more limited buyer pool, are there other suburbs that have consistent demand at that price range and likely will continue on that trajectory in the next few years?
Thanks for the reply WRnative. Would you see Shaker Heights as a city that is more stable to market fluctuations due to the unique housing stock and proximity to University Circle / Cleveland Clinic? Recognizing that my housing budget attracts a more limited buyer pool, are there other suburbs that have consistent demand at that price range and likely will continue on that trajectory in the next few years?
Your price range is well above the median for Shaker Heights, which always is problematic. However, you really need to spend some time looking at the housing stock in different communities. Unless you have a monstrous family, you can buy a lot of house for $400k in SH, but there are areas of the city with much more exclusive properties than you'll find in most of Greater Cleveland (with the exception of Hunting Valley and very nearby areas and lakefront properties). Probably many of the homes in SH at your price range sell well below replacement cost; they normally are artisan built with exquisite materials.
You can't appreciate SH without walking. Walk up and down North and South Park Boulevards. Take the Green Line the length of Shaker Blvd. Take a walk to Horseshoe Lake Park. Visit the Nature Center. Buy a day pass and take the rapid to Shaker Square, and from there to Tower City. Take the Waterfront Line to visit the Rock Hall and the U.S.S. Cod. From Tower City, take the Red Line to West 25th St. and visit the West Side Market and the Market District. Perhaps take the Red Line to Cleveland Hopkins to get a feel for the convenience. Then take the Red Line east to Little Italy. Take a walk to Wade Oval and the Cleveland Botanical Garden, the Western Reserve Historical Center, the Cleveland Museum of Art and certainly walk around the Fine Arts Garden and Wade Lagoon. Don't miss a visit to the new Van Aken Center on the Blue Line rail rapid tansit.
Then use Google Transit to find a bus to return to Shaker Square from University Circle.
These experiences are unique to Shaker Heights in Greater Cleveland. I would rather buy an above market home in SH than many communities, especially as the neighborhoods offering such homes are quite large.
Anyway, if you're just focused on house price stability/appreciation potential, perhaps examine the housing value index charts available at Zillow.com and look for a market with homes more typically in your indicated price range.
I suspect you don't understand how much home you can buy for $500-800,000 in the Cleveland market, although with current mortgage rates, housing prices here likely have had a boost in recent months. Unfortunately, Zillow hasn't updated its home value pages since March.
To answer your base question, given the economic trauma being inflicted on the U.S., I doubt if anybody can provide you with honest assurance that any house you buy anywhere will maintain its value for the next 2-3 years. I truly believe that Cleveland is very attractive relative to much of the country as climate change moves into high gear if we enter a new solar cycle in the months ahead.
Consider how fast the exodus from New York City and New Jersey has materialized since the passage of the SALT federal income tax provision. Consider the impact on coastal areas of a major category 5 hurricane strike or obvious acceleration of sea level rise.
My family and I will be relocating to Cleveland soon from out of state. Specifically, I will be working in the Independence area. It is likely that we will only be in Cleveland for 2-3 years before relocating again, however it is possible we will stay for longer if we are really enjoying the area.
In light of this, what suburbs have the best housing market for 500k-800k homes? I just want to be able to sell the house quickly and for the same price I paid if I end up leaving in a few years. I am not concerned with accounting for commissions/closing costs, as these are covered by my employer. Also, if I sell down the road I do not want to have the property on the market for 6+ months.
Some of the neighborhoods we like the most based on our research are Pepper Pike, Shaker Heights, Hudson, Chagrin Falls, and Rocky River. There are a number of other suburbs which we are considering as well. Are we looking in the right areas for this price range? I have seen quite a few properties that are selling for less than they were purchased for 3-5 years ago, which concerns me.
Hello OP,
Rather than solicit speculative and non-professional opinions through this thread, I suggest you utilize cleveland.com's database of real estate transfers to assess the $500,000-$800,000 market throughout Cuyahoga County (https://www.cleveland.com/datacentra..._property.html). The database provides you with the ability to tailor your query to specific time frames and communities, among other variables. Then, when you'd like to review previous purchase prices of your shortlist, you can visit the Cuyahoga County Fiscal Officer database (https://myplace.cuyahogacounty.us/) for transfer histories.
If you want a quick, spatial snapshot of the $500,000-$800,000 market in Northeast Ohio to help you curate your search, simply enter those price parameters in Zillow.com or realtor.com and view the map.
NOTE: Be wary of advice or studies that try to draw differences between communities based on tax rates. While tax rates do vary across communities in Northeast Ohio, that doesn't mean you can buy the same house in the lower tax rate community for less than that house in the higher tax rate community. The reality is that the market accounts for the tax rate difference and you typically spend more on the purchase price of comparable homes in the lower tax rate communities. Don't rely on my counsel; examine the data for yourself and make an informed decision.
I would question where you are coming from. $500k-$800k is well into the high end market here...the median home is $149k here. Maybe you already know that, but I just wanted to point it out.
In any case, I think you'll face some trouble selling it quickly when you move. Being at the higher end means fewer potential buyers.
I would question where you are coming from. $500k-$800k is well into the high end market here...the median home is $149k here. Maybe you already know that, but I just wanted to point it out.
In any case, I think you'll face some trouble selling it quickly when you move. Being at the higher end means fewer potential buyers.
My thoughts exactly...I would think selling a home that high priced quickly is not going to be easy anywhere in this area...
I also don't understand the logic of paying that much for a house that you will only be in for a few years. I would look to spend less if I weren't planning on staying in any area for very long.
That said, another area to look at if you are working in Independence is Brecksville...that would be the closest suburb w/ good quality housing stock and great schools...beyond that, I'd definitely recommend Solon, Pepper Pike, Moreland Hills, Gates Mills, Beachwood, or Shaker Hts. Chagrin Falls is great if you like the smaller town feel and charm it provides but it would be a bit longer drive to Independence. Rocky River is a great community but the drive to Independence would not be easy, as you'd have to go through Downtown to get there
We just moved here from out of state for my wife's job. We had same price range, even a little higher. We found the housing stock here for the most part is crap compared to the rest of the country.
Your three options are:
(1) Century plus old house with radiators, no or limited ac (window units or mini splits to certain roons), knob and tube wiring, asbestos present, lead paint under layers of paint. But the home has great "character" or "bones" they will tell you. As someone that grew up in a historic victorian era home in Chicago I can tell you - NOPE! Outdated money pit.
(2) 1960s-70s homes in various states of condition. I like to refer to these as "Grandma's house" as they are one or two owners over 50-60 years with someone aging and dying in the home before the family liquidates to a flipper or sells as is.
(3) 80s/90s McMansions in original condition. Yesterday's home at tomorrow's price. There are some real museums to the 1980s/90s out there. Esepecially in Pepper Pike.
We went well under our budget and bought for $400K in Shaker. It's not ideal as we have a 1960s house that was updated but it's still a lot of work and taxes are outrageous. It's temporary because longer term if we stay we will buy land and custom build to get what we want, probably in the Pepper, Moreland, Orange area with lower taxes and better schools. We've looked up to $1M even higher and there is just nothing our style. This will be more pronounced if you have lived in more attractive areas of the country.
My advice would be to buy under budget in a "desirable to buyers" inner ring community that will be easy to unload so you can move on to something else or out of the area, whatever your needs end up being.
I would disagree there is no market for expensive homes. Some take longer to sell for sure as there is a limited buyer pool here of primarily doctors. I'm on the MLS daily, and they sell every day, but in a place like Shaker it's a much tougher sell as some of them have property taxes in excess of $30K per year. I've seen $50K on a 800K house. Roughly, expected to get hosed to the tune of $54K per acre in SH. Some areas like main roads are taxed a bit less. That's a big drag going into a black hole that I'm sure you would be better off keeping for your needs.
Last edited by cubsguy81; 08-07-2020 at 08:19 AM..
We just moved here from out of state for my wife's job. We had same price range, even a little higher. We found the housing stock here for the most part is crap compared to the rest of the country.
Your three options are:
(1) Century plus old house with radiators, no or limited ac (window units or mini splits to certain roons), knob and tube wiring, asbestos present, lead paint under layers of paint. But the home has great "character" or "bones" they will tell you. As someone that grew up in a historic victorian era home in Chicago I can tell you - NOPE! Outdated money pit.
(2) 1960s-70s homes in various states of condition. I like to refer to these as "Grandma's house" as they are one or two owners over 50-60 years with someone aging and dying in the home before the family liquidates to a flipper or sells as is.
(3) 80s/90s McMansions in original condition. Yesterday's home at tomorrow's price. There are some real museums to the 1980s/90s out there. Esepecially in Pepper Pike.
We went well under our budget and bought for $400K in Shaker. It's not ideal as we have a 1960s house that was updated but it's still a lot of work and taxes are outrageous. It's temporary because longer term if we stay we will buy land and custom build to get what we want, probably in the Pepper, Moreland, Orange area with lower taxes and better schools. We've looked up to $1M even higher and there is just nothing our style. This will be more pronounced if you have lived in more attractive areas of the country.
My advice would be to buy under budget in a "desirable to buyers" inner ring community that will be easy to unload so you can move on to something else or out of the area, whatever your needs end up being.
I would disagree there is no market for expensive homes. Some take longer to sell for sure as there is a limited buyer pool here of primarily doctors. I'm on the MLS daily, and they sell every day, but in a place like Shaker it's a much tougher sell as some of them have property taxes in excess of $30K per year. I've seen $50K on a 800K house. Roughly, expected to get hosed to the tune of $54K per acre in SH. Some areas like main roads are taxed a bit less. That's a big drag going into a black hole that I'm sure you would be better off keeping for your needs.
Thanks for the insight. I agree that perhaps we should lower our budget or expand our focus to the South Side or West Side which seem to be growing faster than the East. The sprawling McMansion suburbia in those areas (with the exception of Rocky River) is not really our style though and the proximity to shopping areas is not as good as the east side.
We recently took a trip to Cleveland to get a feel for the area and was definitely charmed by Shaker in a lot of respects. I do share your concerns for the lack of AC and updates to the “guts” of the housing stock there. The taxes are absurd but it does seem like the housing prices are held down by this inconvenient fact. I have to wonder if Shaker’s tax base would remain relatively constant if they just eased off on taxes, precipitating a rise in housing values which would allow homeowners to gain some equity. It’s almost like Shaker is frozen in time with home values almost stagnating despite increases in other suburbs that are more in line with what has gone on in the national real estate market over the past 10 years.
I also wasn’t as impressed with Pepper Pike as I thought I would be considering the high average sale price. Sure there are some extravagant properties there but there are a lot of dumpy split levels and ugly 50s / 60s colonials. Definitely “Grandma’s House” as you aptly called it. The general lack of sidewalks and a neighborhood feel is a negative for me as well.
Chagrin Falls was nice, albeit a little far from things and dominated by flippers commanding ridiculous prices for their shoddy remodel jobs. The suburban areas around Chagrin seem to be an ok option.
All in all I am just not very impressed with what that budget can buy in what is billed as a cheap metro area.
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