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Old 04-18-2015, 03:40 AM
 
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Colleges grapple with cheating in the digital age - LA Times
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Old 04-18-2015, 09:22 AM
 
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Funny that little of the article actually had anything to do with the digital age, but with the age old definition of cheating. I'd say there are a couple of more things going on beyond the high stakes pressure (which I do think pushes more to "cheat" since a failure is so much less recoverable today).

For example, in so much of the work world today, we're told that our "work" is not "ours." Not just in terms of IP that belongs to the company that paid for it, but even within a team where we're told not to have "pride in authorship" where no one gets credit. Or where the boss takes credit for the work of team members because, well, being in charge gives them credit. I've had bosses insist their names go first on papers they had actually nothing to do with, and couldn't understand because simply because they are "the boss."

So the definition of cheating starts to fade because the academic definition exists only within academia today.
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Old 04-19-2015, 01:14 PM
 
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What's especially distressing for me is the report from the Cal Poly professor stating that engineering students cheat more than humanities students. This is huge regarding public safety issues.
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Old 04-20-2015, 07:55 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sideman View Post
What's especially distressing for me is the report from the Cal Poly professor stating that engineering students cheat more than humanities students. This is huge regarding public safety issues.
No it isn't. Of coarse engineering students cheat more than humanities students. Humanities classes aren't exactly rocket science, whereas engineering classes can literally be rocket science. Also, recognize that only a very very small percentage of what an engineer learns in school is directly applicable to their career, its more of a task just to prove you can do hard stuff.
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Old 04-20-2015, 08:19 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Smooth23 View Post
No it isn't. Of coarse engineering students cheat more than humanities students. Humanities classes aren't exactly rocket science, whereas engineering classes can literally be rocket science. Also, recognize that only a very very small percentage of what an engineer learns in school is directly applicable to their career, its more of a task just to prove you can do hard stuff.
So since there is a small amount of studies that future engineers take that actually contribute to what they will eventually do in real world applications, then you condone and support their cheating?
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Old 04-21-2015, 06:42 AM
 
25,556 posts, read 23,980,472 times
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Originally Posted by Smooth23 View Post
No it isn't. Of coarse engineering students cheat more than humanities students. Humanities classes aren't exactly rocket science, whereas engineering classes can literally be rocket science. Also, recognize that only a very very small percentage of what an engineer learns in school is directly applicable to their career, its more of a task just to prove you can do hard stuff.
Humanities classes at the upper level are NOT easy. Some people take whatever distribution requirements for the humanities (freshmen classes) and decided the humanities are easy. They aren't.

The higher up you go in history (particularly for those seeking phds) you often have to proven reading knowledge of one or two other languages in history (better to read primary sources in the original language). Writing a thesis and doing research (even in upper level undergraduate classes) is a lot more work than writing a simple 2 to 5 page paper (as is often the case in distribution courses). And some professors can be very picky.
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Old 04-21-2015, 10:34 AM
 
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It's like steroids in baseball, eventually people feel they have to cheat because everyone else is. This starts in Middle and HS.

The people in your class cheating are gonna be the ones your competing with for jobs and career opportunities after school in the future.
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Old 04-21-2015, 01:37 PM
 
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The thing with what is considered cheating in academia is not reflective of the real world. No boss/manager is ever going to give an employee a project and say "No notes, no books, no internet, no collaborating, etc". It's stupid to have these condition in schools. Students just put stuff into their short term memories and forget it a week after exams. It's more important to know how to use resources to find the information than to know the information itself.

Do Engineer's jobs consist of sitting alone in a room with nothing but a pencil and paper? No. They use lots of software, textbooks, human resources, other engineers, online tools, etc. It's stupid to test Engineering students to these conditions, it doesn't properly prepare them for their jobs.
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Old 04-21-2015, 02:11 PM
 
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Originally Posted by sideman View Post
So since there is a small amount of studies that future engineers take that actually contribute to what they will eventually do in real world applications, then you condone and support their cheating?
I see what you did there....

So because they were cheating you think they should be executed? That's pretty harsh.
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Old 04-21-2015, 02:29 PM
 
Location: Florida
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Originally Posted by NyWriterdude View Post
Humanities classes at the upper level are NOT easy. Some people take whatever distribution requirements for the humanities (freshmen classes) and decided the humanities are easy. They aren't.

The higher up you go in history (particularly for those seeking phds) you often have to proven reading knowledge of one or two other languages in history (better to read primary sources in the original language). Writing a thesis and doing research (even in upper level undergraduate classes) is a lot more work than writing a simple 2 to 5 page paper (as is often the case in distribution courses). And some professors can be very picky.
....I dont think you understand the difference between arts "net easy" and engineering "not easy." Im getting my Masters in Accounting and wouldnt even dare put it on the same level as my dads Masters in Mechanical Engineering.

And it doesnt surprise me at all that harder degrees have higher cheating rates. Theres more riding on it for these students.
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