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In regards to the person you responded to, colleges are not anti-capitalism. They are modern capitalism.
College is a real pain in the butt if you ask me; however, I did suffer through it. From what I could see college is for masochists. It is for people who like pain. They like the pain of being bored to death by lectures, frustrated with tedious assignments, confined to jail-like dorms, confined to associating with the same type of people again and again, and aggravated with catty professors.
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Originally Posted by Braunwyn
Of course people that attend college are going to be pro-college. Keep in mind, tho, that most people do not go to college. IIRC 6 out of 10 college freshman drop out (or some obscene number). You're not a lone wolf.
As far as measuring your social status via money, I don't know if that's the best route to take either. Quality not quantity.
From a brilliant article by Charles Murray in the WSJ: "For Most People, College Is a Waste of Time"
First, we will set up a single goal to represent educational success, which will take four years to achieve no matter what is being taught. We will attach an economic reward to it that seldom has anything to do with what has been learned. We will urge large numbers of people who do not possess adequate ability to try to achieve the goal, wait until they have spent a lot of time and money, and then deny it to them. We will stigmatize everyone who doesn't meet the goal. We will call the goal a "BA."
I disagree with this author's proposition that certification is the way to go. I've seen that trend take over info tech. About all it does is add to the cost of getting work.
I did the 4 year degree and that gave me the foundation of the science. Certifications, as I encounter them, are just profit generators for the companies that churn them out.
The first problem, at least with technology certs. is the problem of picking the right one(s)... since they are often expensive. By the time you have the cert. that skill may no longer be in demand, LOL!
The second problem with certifications is that you can *cram* for them.
If you believe that this is OK, then the Law Bar needs to be disbanded and Law Schools closed, as all one really needs to do is seriously cram the Bar-Bri Bar Exam Prep materials and go take the test, right?
Well at least that what most budding lawyers end up doing anyway. So if the bar exam is the final arbiter of who should be a lawyer, then heck, let's close the schools, right?
OK, maybe you can make that arguement for Law. Didn't Andrew Jackson, at one point try to do something similar?
But how about Medicine? Do you want someone who crammed the "Appendix Removal Certification Exam Materials" to take a scalpel to you?
Trust me, as a working class person who worked a full time job for almost 12 years while also doing a degree, I'd have loved someone to repeal the need for degrees for upward mobility. But to replace them with certifications driven by a desire to pull in certification course and exam revenues? Screw that, LOL!
I believe fully in the part where they say by the time the student gets to the 3rd year, half of what they learn their first year is outdated. A non college guy like me has had to teach too many college grads how to do their jobs!
I believe fully in the part where they say by the time the student gets to the 3rd year, half of what they learn their first year is outdated. A non college guy like me has had to teach too many college grads how to do their jobs!
College isn't about teaching you to do a job. It's expected you'll learn that on the job after you graduate. It's about preparing you to continue ot learn. Laying a foundation that lasts a lifetime. I've gone way farther in life because I have an education than I ever could have without one and I didn't use 10% of what I learned in college. What I used is the thought processes I learned because I went to college.
I believe fully in the part where they say by the time the student gets to the 3rd year, half of what they learn their first year is outdated. A non college guy like me has had to teach too many college grads how to do their jobs!
While looking at some programs, I saw several that had a policy on this, for people entering grad programs or doing another degree. Any science or technology course that was taken 7 years ago would not be counted.
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Originally Posted by Ivorytickler
College isn't about teaching you to do a job. It's expected you'll learn that on the job after you graduate. It's about preparing you to continue ot learn. Laying a foundation that lasts a lifetime. I've gone way farther in life because I have an education than I ever could have without one and I didn't use 10% of what I learned in college. What I used is the thought processes I learned because I went to college.
True, but who paid for it? What about people who it puts them in to a repayment plan for 20 years. I'm sure many times they would be better off not going. Not everybody needs to go to college. And if they do, it should be funded like many European countries.
I'm in Human Resources so I see alot of resumes and can usually tell who can be good where. But what drives me nuts are the people with multiple degrees and virtually no quality experience! Education for the sake of learning is fine, but in many cases it is at the expense of contributing to society (ie. working). Too much time away from the workplace can really stunt one's growth.
You can be and should be learning everyday from a variety of sources, not just 'formal' education. To insist that education is you sitting in a desk in front of an overpaid lecturer, points to a narrow mind.
I see this concept in a micro way in the office: there are those who insist on getting paid training to learn something... so they go, come back and often never practice it. Better are those who know they can learn the same things on-the-job, from friends, from the internet, from books. These are the people who will learn it and do it.
I for one, am glad we are trending toward a devaluing of formal education.
I'm in Human Resources so I see alot of resumes and can usually tell who can be good where. But what drives me nuts are the people with multiple degrees and virtually no quality experience! Education for the sake of learning is fine, but in many cases it is at the expense of contributing to society (ie. working). Too much time away from the workplace can really stunt one's growth.
You can be and should be learning everyday from a variety of sources, not just 'formal' education. To insist that education is you sitting in a desk in front of an overpaid lecturer, points to a narrow mind.
I see this concept in a micro way in the office: there are those who insist on getting paid training to learn something... so they go, come back and often never practice it. Better are those who know they can learn the same things on-the-job, from friends, from the internet, from books. These are the people who will learn it and do it.
I for one, am glad we are trending toward a devaluing of formal education.
Hear hear!, let experience and meritocracy reign...I have been told by my peers, w/ masters and in doctoral programs that I know way more than them on certain subjects, even if they have, or are getting a degree in it. Sorry I want to actually live my life, have my own place, have a girlfriend I can make happy, explore other countries, start a family and don't have rich parents to fund this stuff... not worried about a damn pay grade. The thing is, a lot of people feel they HAVE to go to college, it is long since been about creating a better society, they want your MONEY! and they get plenty of it through government backed loans, so the more students and more grade deflation for some happy faces, the merrier! Too bad these programmed aren't curbed to the actual jobs available in the field.
That being said, I'd like to have one, but really it is more about respect for the pay grade or entry into a job I'm sure I could pick up. I've yet to find a subject I can't learn without some basic beginning information, of course it might take me longer to pick up a concept, but it can be done...
Perfect example... Free Online Course Materials | Courses | MIT OpenCourseWare
now go learn, certainly with a little elbow grease applied to your brain, you can learn more than a TA is going to teach you.
I'm in Human Resources so I see alot of resumes and can usually tell who can be good where. But what drives me nuts are the people with multiple degrees and virtually no quality experience! Education for the sake of learning is fine, but in many cases it is at the expense of contributing to society (ie. working). Too much time away from the workplace can really stunt one's growth.
You can be and should be learning everyday from a variety of sources, not just 'formal' education. To insist that education is you sitting in a desk in front of an overpaid lecturer, points to a narrow mind.
I see this concept in a micro way in the office: there are those who insist on getting paid training to learn something... so they go, come back and often never practice it. Better are those who know they can learn the same things on-the-job, from friends, from the internet, from books. These are the people who will learn it and do it.
I for one, am glad we are trending toward a devaluing of formal education.
Can't get experience unless someone hires you. No one will hire you, because you don't have experience. Vicious circle.
In regards to the person you responded to, colleges are not anti-capitalism. They are modern capitalism.
Agreed.
Quote:
College is a real pain in the butt if you ask me; however, I did suffer through it. From what I could see college is for masochists. It is for people who like pain. They like the pain of being bored to death by lectures, frustrated with tedious assignments, confined to jail-like dorms, confined to associating with the same type of people again and again, and aggravated with catty professors.
It sucks that you had such a bad experience. My dh doesn't like school much either. I enjoyed and found it much easier to deal with than life outside uni.
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Just don't become a "professional student"
