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What ever happened to " WE RESERVE THE RIGHT TO REFUSE SERVICE TO ANYONE" ? Since when should the Government be able to tell a private business how they should conduct business ?
You can't reserve a right you don't have. Since you can't run a business without the protection of society, lest you fall prey to brigands, you must obey the rules society places on your business. And that's that.
Feel free to do so, the size of the award was not because they refused to sell them a cake, it was because of their actions afterwards.
Where is that new rationale for the punishment coming from ? The bakers were fined for the alleged emotional and mental distress the couple suffered because the business didn't sell them the cake.
I don't think it would be that easy. The proprietors would have to explain why they refused to bake that particular cake when they are in the business of taking special orders for cakes.
But, nice duck and dodge!
Now, can you explain why those proprietors should be free to discriminate (I'm assuming you believe they should be free to discriminate) but the proprietors in the instance case should not?
Don't have the time/capacity.
Explanation over.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Salmonburgher
Hmmmm.
But, the Oregon cake bakers were operating a private business, not operating as public officials.
The first amendment of the US Constitution clearly states that Congress shall make no law ... prohibiting the free exercise [of religion]; or abridging the freedom of speech...
You stated that law trumps opinion. I agree (even though many of our laws are indeed made by opinion of the courts).
I assume that you will agree that the Constitution is the prime and supreme law of the United States, and that as such, it obviously trumps all other laws and opinions!
Thus, why should... How can the Federal Government enforce a law that prohibits the Oregon bakers from freely exercising their religion and clearly abridges their right to freedom of speech?
The gay customers could easily have gone to another bakery, one that would have been happy to bake the cake for their same sex marriage. Had they done so, they would have had their cake and they could have eaten it, too! And the religious bakers could have freely exercised their religion and their right to freedom of speech.
I dunno. I am in favor of same sex marriage.
But, I am not in favor of obvious violations of our most primary and cherished (well, they used to be cherished) rights. These are FIRST Amendment rights, for goodness sake! The very first rights that our Founding Fathers felt necessary to explicitly stipulate were inalienable to us and that the Government could not take away.
Because protection from discriminates trumps those. Says right in the Constitution your religion doesn't have to be my religion.
No kidding. I'm sick of them. I have plenty of gay friends and lots of them are inclined to agree,
There's this fast food chain called "Chick-a-Fila" that refuses to grant benefits to same sex partners. Awww, shame on them. At the same time, they close on Sunday. After all, the Lord said to do so. But also, their employees get a day off to spend with their kids, maybe.
Odd, I have not heard any chorus of indignation from the "gay community" (whatever that is) about how companies that make their employees work on Sundays, and Thanksgiving, and even Christmas are discriminating against families. That's kind of what it amounts to. Lots of those same companies love to tout how "gay friendly" they are.
Want people to stick up for you? Try sticking up for them. Seems pretty obvious to me. But then, I am not some kind of professional victim.
Chik-Fil-A has good chicken sandwiches and the worst "French Fries" in the universe. My guess is that when they started the business, closing on Sundays was simply a ploy to gain access to a particular market. And, if they opened at 1 p.m. on Sundays, people could still go to church AND unemployment would be reduced and/or worker's families would have greater income.
What ever happened to " WE RESERVE THE RIGHT TO REFUSE SERVICE TO ANYONE" ? Since when should the Government be able to tell a private business how they should conduct business ?
I swear, the inmates are running the asylum !
Don
That's right! Anyone should be allowed to be racist pig if they want to!
You can't reserve a right you don't have. Since you can't run a business without the protection of society, lest you fall prey to brigands, you must obey the rules society places on your business. And that's that.
You're right Tom, and people who claim that "right" are probably the same people who go around pointing out that the only rights some people have are those directly referred to in the Constitution.
Good for them, I would fight it every way possible. THe best way to fight all this court ordered social justice nonsense is to simply disobey it. These folks get it, Kim Davis gets it and its time we all get it. We conservatives should obstruct, stand in the way, refuse to comply and then eventually rebel. Time to demand our rights, and demand the real America be restored. There is at least 100-150 million of us, they cant put us all in jail.
What exactly do you consider "the real America" and why does it have to be "restored"?
What exactly do you consider "the real America" and why does it have to be "restored"?
Probably the "real America" where Blacks and women weren't uppity and working people "knew their place" and approached their betters cap in hand. This guy expresses a contempt for his fellow countrymen and for their will as expressed in free elections and wishes to rebel against the results of free elections. I think that's treasonous.
Just be honest and say that you are unable to explain your point or answer my questions.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordSquidworth
Because protection from discriminates trumps those.
Where do you get the idea that anything trumps the Constitution?
And once again, the bakers were not discriminating against gays. They were simply declining to participate in the SSM celebration.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordSquidworth
Says right in the Constitution your religion doesn't have to be my religion.
How were the bakers forcing the gay couple to observe the bakers' religion?
Anyway, the Constitution does not say what you think it does. The Constitution (1st Amendment) says that the Congess shall not establish a national religion and Congress shape not interfere with the People's exercise of their own respective religions.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordSquidworth
Again, it's all how you word things.
Haha! No! Its how you read the clear language of the Constitution. You should give it a try!
Where do you get the idea that anything trumps the Constitution?
...
Anyway, the Constitution does not say what you think it does. ...
Haha! No! Its how you read the clear language of the Constitution. You should give it a try!
In a sense, the Supreme Court trumps the Constitution because it is their responsibility to interpret it when there are legal disagreements. So until you become a member of the Supreme Court, perhaps you should rely on that legally appointed branch of the judiciary for its interpretation. You should give it a try!
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