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Old 07-28-2013, 07:33 AM
 
11,276 posts, read 19,576,592 times
Reputation: 24269

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Quote:
Originally Posted by runswithscissors View Post
That's a little harsh and not really helpful, the OP no doubt thinks he's giving a good food and even Vets used to sell it. He's probably even feeding their Bulldog brand.

There is no "who knows what" everything is on the label.
Why isn't it helpful? It's quite possible the food is the culprit here. Yep everything is on the label, but not everything is identified in a truthful manner on pet food labels.

Of course vets sell it. They are taught in vet school by these very companies that this is the "best food". Many don't bother to look further. Read the labels indeed. It won't take long to figure out that Royal Canin is not a good food, when reading the label.

It annoys me when vets pump animals full of drugs first, before even considering the diet. Diet is the most important thing in a dog's health. It never seems to occur to them that a diet full of corn (most likely GMO corn, possibly contaminated with molds besides) and other grains and fillers can cause these problems.

Here's the ingredient list for the "medium adult dog" formula. Not even any real meat in it.

Brewers rice, chicken by-product meal, wheat, corn gluten meal, oat groats, chicken fat, natural flavors, dried beet pulp, fish oil, calcium carbonate, grain distillers dried yeast, vegetable oil, potassium chloride, monocalcium phosphate, salt, hydrolyzed yeast, L-lysine, choline chloride, vitamins [DL-alpha tocopherol (source of vitamin E), L-ascorbyl-2-polyphosphate (source of vitamin C), biotin, D-calcium pantothenate, vitamin A acetate, niacin, pyridoxine hydrochloride (vitamin B6), thiamine mononitrate (vitamin B1), vitamin B12 supplement, riboflavin (vitamin B2), folic acid, vitamin D3 supplement], trace minerals (zinc proteinate, zinc oxide, ferrous sulfate, manganese proteinate, manganous oxide, copper sulfate, calcium iodate, sodium selenite, copper proteinate), rosemary extract, preserved with natural mixed tocopherols and citric acid.

Here's the ingredient in the "bulldog" formula. At least this one doesn't have any corn, but it sure has a lot that could cause this problem in this dog.

Chicken meal, rice, brown rice, oatmeal, pork meal, rice flour, chicken fat, natural chicken flavour, dried beet pulp (sugar removed), soy protein isolate, anchovy oil (source of EPA/ DHA), vegetable oil, sodium silico aluminate (zeolite), salt, calcium carbonate, fructo-oligosaccharides, potassium chloride, sodium tripolyphosphate, L-tyrosine, DL-methionine, taurine, potassium citrate, dried egg product,Vitamins [DL-alpha tocopherol acetate (source of vitamin E), inositol, niacin supplement, L-ascorbyl-2- polyphosphate (source of vitamin C), D-calcium pantothenate, biotin, pyridoxine hydrochloride (vitamin B6), riboflavin supplement (vitamin B2), thiamine mononitrate (vitamin B1), vitamin A acetate, folic acid, vitamin B12 supplement, vitamin D3 supplement], choline chloride, glucosamine hydrochloride, marigold extract (Tagetes erecta L.), Trace Minerals [zinc proteinate, zinc oxide, ferrous sulfate, manganese proteinate, copper proteinate, copper sulfate, manganous oxide, calcium iodate, sodium selenite], tea (green tea extract), chondroitin sulfate, rosemary extract, preserved with natural mixed tocopherols (source of vitamin E) and citric acid.

http://www.royalcanin.ca/index.php/P...ucts/Dog-Diets

Last edited by catsmom21; 07-28-2013 at 08:16 AM..
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Old 07-28-2013, 09:40 AM
 
380 posts, read 833,397 times
Reputation: 762
Quote:
Originally Posted by runswithscissors View Post
That's a little harsh and not really helpful, the OP no doubt thinks he's giving a good food and even Vets used to sell it. He's probably even feeding their Bulldog brand.

There is no "who knows what" everything is on the label.
Have to chime in here for my own dogs suffered for years because we believed we could trust vets & commercials when it came to food, and learned it all the hard way.

Yeah, that's the problem. People *Think* they're feeding the best, but are misled, and they have the right to know this.

Also, although not obligate, dogs are (falcutative) carnivores.

I suggest the OP look into all the issues and recalls Royal Canin -- especially the "prescription" foods -- have had, particularly since 2006, and how many animals it has harmed. A quick FDA and/or google search will say plenty -- besides 2007 !
And try to find a vet who knows that dogs shouldn't be eating like cows (or rats.)
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Old 07-28-2013, 09:57 AM
 
11,276 posts, read 19,576,592 times
Reputation: 24269
^^^ ^^^

Quote:
Originally Posted by runswithscissors View Post
That's a little harsh and not really helpful, the OP no doubt thinks he's giving a good food and even Vets used to sell it. He's probably even feeding their Bulldog brand.

There is no "who knows what" everything is on the label.
Oh yes, forgot to address this. Just because the OP "thinks" this is a good food, does not make it a good food.

Presumably the OP would like to be informed that s/he isn't feeding a very good food to the dog. I don't think it is better to live in blissful ignorance when it comes to feeding our pets.

I think people should be told, so they can further educate themselves, if they (hopefully) so desire.

The rest I answered in my above post.
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Old 07-28-2013, 12:38 PM
 
Location: Haverhill/West Palm Beach, FL
302 posts, read 499,683 times
Reputation: 424
When my American Bulldog did this, we found he was allergic to wheat. So far, Deacon is allergic to corn, wheat, peanut butter, pumpkin and dairy. He is getting Merrick Grain-free, buffalo and sweet potato or Taste of the Wild High Prairie. We changed out all his treats and such and he no longer has skin issues and all fur has grown back.
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Old 07-29-2013, 05:15 PM
 
Location: Coastal Georgia
50,374 posts, read 63,977,343 times
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I agree with others. Dinovite and Benedril in case it is allergies
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Old 07-31-2013, 01:33 PM
 
10,599 posts, read 17,896,657 times
Reputation: 17353
Quote:
Originally Posted by catsmom21 View Post
Why isn't it helpful? It's quite possible the food is the culprit here. Yep everything is on the label, but not everything is identified in a truthful manner on pet food labels.

Of course vets sell it. They are taught in vet school by these very companies that this is the "best food". Many don't bother to look further. Read the labels indeed. It won't take long to figure out that Royal Canin is not a good food, when reading the label.

It annoys me when vets pump animals full of drugs first, before even considering the diet. Diet is the most important thing in a dog's health. It never seems to occur to them that a diet full of corn (most likely GMO corn, possibly contaminated with molds besides) and other grains and fillers can cause these problems.

Here's the ingredient list for the "medium adult dog" formula. Not even any real meat in it.

Brewers rice, chicken by-product meal, wheat, corn gluten meal, oat groats, chicken fat, natural flavors, dried beet pulp, fish oil, calcium carbonate, grain distillers dried yeast, vegetable oil, potassium chloride, monocalcium phosphate, salt, hydrolyzed yeast, L-lysine, choline chloride, vitamins [DL-alpha tocopherol (source of vitamin E), L-ascorbyl-2-polyphosphate (source of vitamin C), biotin, D-calcium pantothenate, vitamin A acetate, niacin, pyridoxine hydrochloride (vitamin B6), thiamine mononitrate (vitamin B1), vitamin B12 supplement, riboflavin (vitamin B2), folic acid, vitamin D3 supplement], trace minerals (zinc proteinate, zinc oxide, ferrous sulfate, manganese proteinate, manganous oxide, copper sulfate, calcium iodate, sodium selenite, copper proteinate), rosemary extract, preserved with natural mixed tocopherols and citric acid.

Here's the ingredient in the "bulldog" formula. At least this one doesn't have any corn, but it sure has a lot that could cause this problem in this dog.

Chicken meal, rice, brown rice, oatmeal, pork meal, rice flour, chicken fat, natural chicken flavour, dried beet pulp (sugar removed), soy protein isolate, anchovy oil (source of EPA/ DHA), vegetable oil, sodium silico aluminate (zeolite), salt, calcium carbonate, fructo-oligosaccharides, potassium chloride, sodium tripolyphosphate, L-tyrosine, DL-methionine, taurine, potassium citrate, dried egg product,Vitamins [DL-alpha tocopherol acetate (source of vitamin E), inositol, niacin supplement, L-ascorbyl-2- polyphosphate (source of vitamin C), D-calcium pantothenate, biotin, pyridoxine hydrochloride (vitamin B6), riboflavin supplement (vitamin B2), thiamine mononitrate (vitamin B1), vitamin A acetate, folic acid, vitamin B12 supplement, vitamin D3 supplement], choline chloride, glucosamine hydrochloride, marigold extract (Tagetes erecta L.), Trace Minerals [zinc proteinate, zinc oxide, ferrous sulfate, manganese proteinate, copper proteinate, copper sulfate, manganous oxide, calcium iodate, sodium selenite], tea (green tea extract), chondroitin sulfate, rosemary extract, preserved with natural mixed tocopherols (source of vitamin E) and citric acid.

Royal Canin | Dog Diets
It's not helpful because you just flamed him instead of teaching him anything.

And even THIS post is just reciting ingredients.

IF you WERE trying to be helpful you would have explained ABOUT the topic of ingredients.

But I guess food 101 was just too much trouble - or even posting a link to educate the guy.

Quote:
I think people should be told, so they can further educate themselves, if they (hopefully) so desire
.

But I get it. Tell him off, infer he's stupid, then let him figure it out on his own.
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Old 07-31-2013, 01:40 PM
 
10,599 posts, read 17,896,657 times
Reputation: 17353
Quote:
Originally Posted by HOF4256 View Post
Have to chime in here for my own dogs suffered for years because we believed we could trust vets & commercials when it came to food, and learned it all the hard way.

Yeah, that's the problem. People *Think* they're feeding the best, but are misled, and they have the right to know this.

Also, although not obligate, dogs are (falcutative) carnivores.

I suggest the OP look into all the issues and recalls Royal Canin -- especially the "prescription" foods -- have had, particularly since 2006, and how many animals it has harmed. A quick FDA and/or google search will say plenty -- besides 2007 !
And try to find a vet who knows that dogs shouldn't be eating like cows (or rats.)
The food isn't the point. To ME, flaming a poster inferring he's stupid/ignorant without even bothering to provide any links is not helpful.

It's hilarious how people jump on something I said (not even the OP) like "vets used to sell it" as a side issue when the entire point of the guy posting here was to get some INFORMATION.

I'm fully aware of the history of and ingredients IN dog food having owned my own pet store since 1993.

I have YEARS worth of stories. Like a vet carefully explaining the concept of a "novel protein" "LIKE lamb" and the entire concept of food allergies and then the clients go to the grocery store and pick up anything that has lamb on the label.

LOL bashing vets and prescription foods. Hills ID is a life saving food among others, regardless of what you think about Hills, the evidence is in the outcome and the ONLY SOLUTION to allergies is trial and error. EVERYBODY knows this and it may not even be food but the laundry detergent or even the flax. (while I admittedly blamed food myself based on the symptoms).

Last edited by runswithscissors; 07-31-2013 at 01:51 PM..
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Old 07-31-2013, 02:06 PM
 
380 posts, read 833,397 times
Reputation: 762
You can continue being naive regarding how "helpful" Hill's "prescription" foods are, however the ingredients of such "prescription"/vet-endorsed foods, which Catsmom21 posted the example of, tell the story.
People trust their vets, so don't LOOk at the ingredients. They have the right to know this information, and how are they to find out unless they research via unbiased sources.

Which is what brings people here.

This isn't facebook, where people can pick & choose what *they* wish to read merely beause they post in a thread.
It's a world-wide INFORMATIONAL forum, which thousands+ of people have free access to. And information is what was provided. The actual ingredients. Nothing else NEEDS to be said. Those ingredients are not fitting a carnivorous mammal -- whether obligate or facultative -- and trusting people wonder why their drugged-up dogs never heal!!


ETA:

Here are the ingredients of the i/d:

http://www.hillspet.com/products/pd-...ealth-dry.html

Whole Grain Corn, Brewers Rice, Dried Egg Product, Chicken By-Product Meal, Corn Gluten Meal, Pork Fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols and citric acid), Powdered Cellulose, Lactic Acid, Dicalcium Phosphate, Chicken Liver Flavor, Iodized Salt, Potassium Citrate, Choline Chloride, Calcium Carbonate, Potassium Chloride, Dried Beet Pulp, Soybean Oil, vitamins (L-Ascorbyl-2-Polyph ...

If I could go back in time, I'd ask a vet "prescribing" this stuff why they believe ANY carnivore should be eating this stuff, and then find a lawyer.

But nobody told me. Had to learn it all the hard way.

Sorry if the truthful Information is not always going to be what people WANT to see. Why don't you look into the conflicts of interest of the Vets & the PFI and educate yourself before attacking peple who are trying to spare others of what they learned the HARD WAY?
Here's a start: http://leda.law.harvard.edu/leda/dat...Patrick06.html

As far as vets, family was blessed with a wonderful, honest Vet for decades and he had NO conflicts of interest influencing the care and advice he gave. As with all professions, not all vets are created equal, unfortunately, as we found out the hard way.

Wondering why our own chronically sick-scratching-chewing themselves raw- dogs should be eating sawdust of Pine Tree, salt, glutens & grains is what finally woke me up. This is what a vet "prescribed" the over-drugged dogs eat, until their internals finally couldn't take species-inappropriate "foods" anymore and/or the drugs took their toll.

Last edited by Pamina333; 07-31-2013 at 03:27 PM..
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Old 07-31-2013, 05:16 PM
 
380 posts, read 833,397 times
Reputation: 762
Sorry, forgot to address this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by runswithscissors View Post
The food isn't the point...

I'm fully aware of the history of and ingredients IN dog food having owned my own pet store since 1993.
Then why wouldn't you warn the person about the species-inappropriate ingredients, & recall history, of that particular brand, which they are curently using? Instead you take issue with others for doing so.

The TV "news" isn't going to inform pet owners of this crucial information. They have advertising dollars at stake.

IMO it's up to us pet lovers to look out for each other because the people who we'd expect to (as we are too conditioned to trust) certainly aren't.

Last edited by Pamina333; 07-31-2013 at 05:45 PM..
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