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It does sound like your dog is dehydrated and I, myself, always liked to see a concentrated urine, because that's actually the highest hurdle that a kidney has to clear with respect to fluid balance. If the kidney can make concentrated urine, then dilute urine is a SNAP.
I might have gotten something confused - I am an infectious diseases physician (and use that every day in my work) but I don't take care of patients, so renal disease is something I haven't dealth with in a while....
hey, one more question. i read that a heavy protein diet could dehydrate a dog.
is it possible, then, that diet could affect the BUN number? i've been mixing his regular food with a lot of canned chicked, scrambled eggs, royal canin vet prescribed soft food, and cheese in an attempt to get him to eat twice a day to take the doxycyline tp treat the rocky mountain spotted fever.
is it possible that the heavy levels of protein could have driven up the BUN number? or am i reaching?
sorry, one last question b/c i'm sitting here biting my nails. i can't stop thinking about this one thing.
in november, the BUN level was 29 and last week (six weeks later) it had tripled to 83. i specifically asked the first vet in november if it was safe to wait six weeks for the re-test and she very casually said that it was, and so i did wait.
but i have been thinking about that triple increase now ever since thurs when i learned about the new number...and i think i might have made an awful mistake believing her.
with kidney issues and a BUN number that seems to be pretty rapidly increasing, how much room for error time-wise does a dog have?
If it were my dog, I would not wait 6 weeks. Any time something's off, especially something as important as BUN, I re-test in 2 weeks. But that's just me. I'm a worry-wart when it comes to my dog.
I have seen references to protein affecting BUN, but I have not heard of high protein diets causing dehydration. Maybe someone else (viralmd?) knows something about this.
Some proteins are harder on the kidneys than others, because of the phosphorus content. If your dog does have kidney problems, you'll have to watch the phosphorus content of foods more than the protein content. Some vets disagree and say to restrict protein, but many vets that are not of the "old school" ways feel that protein is usually not a problem if it's in a form that's easy on the kidneys. For example, egg whites (no yolk) can increase the protein level without adding too much phosphorus. This is where the k9kidneydiet group would come in handy. They can explain the protein thing better than I can.
Viralmd said
Quote:
I, myself, always liked to see a concentrated urine, because that's actually the highest hurdle that a kidney has to clear with respect to fluid balance.
I agree with this. It's when urine is dilute that I get concerned. The fact that your vet said your dog's urine was too concentrated, I would take that as good news concerning the kidneys.
Did your vet do a Urine Protein Creatinine Ratio and a Microalbuminuria test? Those tests are good to run, because they will show kidney disease in earlier stages than blood tests. By the time it shows up in the BUN and Creatinine in a blood test, a lot of damage can already have been done. The sooner kidney disease is detected, the better the chance of treating it. I always have a UPC ratio and Microalbuminuria done every time I have a full workup done, or every couple of weeks along with a full urinalysis if he's showing signs of kidney distress. That helps me keep a closer watch on it. The urine used should be first urine of the day, after the dog has held it for 8 or 9 hours.
Last edited by themudpuppy; 01-18-2009 at 07:26 PM..
When Dash was fighting his last nasal infection in OCT. His BUN was 38 ( high)Creatinine was 1.0( Normal) and the BUN/creatinine Ratio was 38 ( high) He also had a Urinalysis done and the specific Gravity was normal so my vet felt it was from the fact that he was eating a high protein diet (EVO) as during that infection all he would eat was protein so we got him back to a lower protein diet and everything returned to normal so yes Proetin can be hard on some older dogs kidneys and drive that BUN up. Hope that proves to be the case as it is a easy fix. We will be thinking about you and sending positive thoughts your way!
so my vet felt it was from the fact that he was eating a high protein diet (EVO) as during that infection all he would eat was protein so we got him back to a lower protein diet and everything returned to normal so yes Proetin can be hard on some older dogs kidneys and drive that BUN up.
Unfortunately EVO does not contain kidney-friendly proteins. None of the commercial foods do. Prescription foods are kidney-friendly, but they are very low protein and are no good if your dog is sensitive to grains. If you have a dog with kidney problems and want to feed high protein without much grain, you pretty much have to make it yourself with low phosphorus proteins. I wish one of the companies that makes higher protein foods would make one with kidney-friendly proteins. It would make life a lot easier on those of us who who are disasters in the kitchen.
update -- barnaby was given a working diagnosis on wednesday of having a stomach ulcer caused by his arthritis med, previcox. his vet specialist checked his blood pressure, which was fine, and listened to his heart, which also sounded normal. this vet spec believes that the ulcer is bleeding into the stomach and the blood is being digested. according to him, blood is a pure protein and is driving that BUN number up significantly.
we have a medicinal treatment plan in place and another vet visit scheduled in two weeks to run an echocardiogram on his heart just to be sure, also to re-run the blood work and make sure the numbers are staying steady or decreasing.
so, new question: anyone with a dog with stomach ulcers on the board?
or: those of you with dogs with kidney problems? what do you think about this diagnosis?
viral -- great questions! and unfortunately i don't know the answers. i had no idea what questions to ask since i wasn't expecting the ulcer issue to arise. so, i will do what i did before and write down just what you said and ask the vet spec about these things. thank you so much for posting here...i wish i could rep you again!
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