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You're seeing it from a detached viewpoint of the individual. That obviates socialism. Instead, try seeing it as participation. You sit with your coworkers and discuss the subject and the final decisions are implemented. "Failing so miserably in so many places" has nothing to do with any "difficulties" with making decisions.
Heh heh heh. There it is again. Individuals providing solutions for themselves. "I'm gonna get mine!" That doesn't fix any of the problems we're facing today.
No, what's happening is the "socialization" of risk (costs) to allow a greater privatization of profits. Example: 20 or 30 or more years ago your employer subsidized your health insurance and your cost was about $2/month. Today the employer is more and more opting for part-time help so that he can avoid all health insurance costs. Now you have to buy it for yourself and your family in many cases.
Try discussing and debating your idea instead of characterizing me and my ideas which you clearly don't understand yet.
Defeatism solves nothing. And you're the one calling it "ideal", not me.
If I don't agree, I'm defeatist and don't understand. I think you're the one who's defeatist and doesn't understand.
You're seeing it from a detached viewpoint of the individual. That obviates socialism. Instead, try seeing it as participation. You sit with your coworkers and discuss the subject and the final decisions are implemented. "Failing so miserably in so many places" has nothing to do with any "difficulties" with making decisions.
Heh heh heh. There it is again. Individuals providing solutions for themselves. "I'm gonna get mine!" That doesn't fix any of the problems we're facing today.
No, what's happening is the "socialization" of risk (costs) to allow a greater privatization of profits. Example: 20 or 30 or more years ago your employer subsidized your health insurance and your cost was about $2/month. Today the employer is more and more opting for part-time help so that he can avoid all health insurance costs. Now you have to buy it for yourself and your family in many cases.
Try discussing and debating your idea instead of characterizing me and my ideas which you clearly don't understand yet.
Defeatism solves nothing. And you're the one calling it "ideal", not me.
OK, you win, I lose. I just don't feel like arguing the point any more. You don't need to worry. More and more people think like you and you will get your socialist paradise soon enough.
And where/when was there a "Free Market System" for most of human history?
I was referring to the reality and quality of health care services... not the free market.... for most of human history. Totally or largely unregulated.
I wouldn't eliminate patent law by any means.... because I don't advocate for totally unrestrained anarchy in the markets. For the good of society, law and order must be maintained for maximum benefit... and patents are a worthy thing in that regard.
Changes to the economic paradigm don't happen without a fight. The people who own & who are invested in the system never give in easily...
... which is why we have not been able to do away with the scourge of Public Sector Employee Unions with their-Gold Plated Pensions & Cadillac Health Care.
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Individuals can move up or down within that system, but regardless of that, there will always be some poverty, about 1/6th to 1/5th of the population more or less.
Oh No! Next you're going to tell me that half the people will be below average. There ought to be a law that everyone is above average.
Location: East of Seattle since 1992, 615' Elevation, Zone 8b - originally from SF Bay Area
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SportyandMisty
... which is why we have not been able to do away with the scourge of Public Sector Employee Unions with their-Gold Plated Pensions & Cadillac Health Care.
Union or not, those are either gone or going away soon. My employer faced a 3 million dollar penalty for our generous (non-union) plan because of the Cadillac Tax. Now we have a high-deductible with Health Savings Account. My annual out of pocket in 2014 was about $300, in 2015 about $3,000, so far this year almost $5,000 (for just my wife and I) not counting the premiums coming out of my paycheck. I expect to see a few strikes in the near future as unions negotiate their next contracts, because the excise tax of 40% starts in 2018 on health plans whose value is more than $10,200 for individual coverage and $27,500 for a family.
Union or not, those are either gone or going away soon.
In the private sector, you're right. The Public Sector is another beast altogether. There is no mechanism to switch public sector employees to a system comparable to the private sector.
"Give us big increases in our pensions & health care benefits," said the Public Sector Union Bosses to elected officials with whom they negotiate, "and we will donate to your re-election campaign. Fail to give us those increases and we will donate to your opponent in the next election and launch a massive get-out-the-vote effort to vote you out of office. Besides, what do you care? 20 years from now in far-off 2016 when the bill comes due, you will have moved on to bigger and better elected positions and will have retired to Florida. You get the benefit of union support and you incur absolutely none of the costs."
That negotiation does not occur in the private sector, as employees do not select their managers via elections.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemlock140
My employer faced a 3 million dollar penalty for our generous (non-union) plan because of the Cadillac Tax. Now we have a high-deductible with Health Savings Account. My annual out of pocket in 2014 was about $300, in 2015 about $3,000, so far this year almost $5,000 (for just my wife and I) not counting the premiums coming out of my paycheck.
Yeah, it sux. We spend about $25K per year for health insurance, plus deductables.
The reality is what you and I experience is the intended result of Obamacare. Do a google search on Grubergate.
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