"America is falling out of love with billionaires, and it’s about time" -- LAT

[CaliRestoration]

Originally Posted by 2sleepy

What impresses me is a well thought out argument substantiated with verifiable data

So go ahead and make one. You'll be surprised at how much better the responses to your posts will be here.

[2sleepy]

Originally Posted by aslowdodge

But you would expect that as time goes by you would earn more with experience.
Your son’s first job out of college will pay the least which just happened to be in another state. His next job was out of state. By his third job he should be making more whether in California or the other two states
So that is not a fair comparison. Starting pay in California for his job would have been a fair comparison.
Comparing starting pay for someone fresh out of college in Nevada or Arizona is not a fair comparison to the pay for an experienced accountant in California.
See the flaw in that argument?

Since you posted average pay for two specific jobs , let’s look at all jobs in a state. You are saying the higher pay in California makes up for the higher cost of living and people are farther ahead.
In Arizona factoring in average salary and cost of living the value of a dollar is $1.04
In Nevada it is $1.02
In California it is 88 cents
So while California has higher pay, the cost of living makes it less efficient and more expensive relative to what you earned.
California is only 85 percent of those other two states as far as your standard of living.

I don't see a source for your data, so I am guessing that they factored in the average expenses for the entire state? If you compare two cities that are 100 miles apart, Sacramento and Reno it looks much different. Here's a comparison that looks fairly accurate, the only disagreement I have with it is that they show Sacramento transportation to be higher which tells me they forgot to include the 35 cent per gallon surcharge on Washoe County gas. Having lived in both places I know that auto insurance doesn't vary by more than $100 or so a year. Moderator cut: link removed, competitor site


By the way, it wasn't my son's first job, but that's not really important. What is obvious is that wages in most fields, including teaching are lower in Nevada. The only thing that is 'cheaper' in the COL between Northern Nevada vs Sacramento is that Nevada has no income tax but the income tax in California for a married couple earning 60k a year is 1.78%. Food costs the same or a bit more in Nevada, gas is the same price, rent is the same, what else is there?

And there aren't a lot of decent jobs in Northern Nevada, The most common jobs are at warehouses. They pay $12-18 an hour and with the average rent for a 1 bedroom apartment @ $1077 that's not viable for most people. The advice given to someone who is thinking about moving to Reno from a resident of the area almost always includes the admonishment "don't move here unless you find a job first". That's not to say that no one gets paid well, my husband did, he was recruited away from a fortune 500 in the SF bay area to another fortune 500 in Nevada and made really good money, but that's not very common.

[aslowdodge]

Originally Posted by 2sleepy

I don't see a source for your data, so I am guessing that they factored in the average expenses for the entire state? If you compare two cities that are 100 miles apart, Sacramento and Reno it looks much different. Here's a comparison that looks fairly accurate, the only disagreement I have with it is that they show Sacramento transportation to be higher which tells me they forgot to include the 35 cent per gallon surcharge on Washoe County gas. Having lived in both places I know that auto insurance doesn't vary by more than $100 or so a year. Moderator cut: link removed, competitor site


By the way, it wasn't my son's first job, but that's not really important. What is obvious is that wages in most fields, including teaching are lower in Nevada. The only thing that is 'cheaper' in the COL between Northern Nevada vs Sacramento is that Nevada has no income tax but the income tax in California for a married couple earning 60k a year is 1.78%. Food costs the same or a bit more in Nevada, gas is the same price, rent is the same, what else is there?

And there aren't a lot of decent jobs in Northern Nevada, The most common jobs are at warehouses. They pay $12-18 an hour and with the average rent for a 1 bedroom apartment @ $1077 that's not viable for most people. The advice given to someone who is thinking about moving to Reno from a resident of the area almost always includes the admonishment "don't move here unless you find a job first". That's not to say that no one gets paid well, my husband did, he was recruited away from a fortune 500 in the SF bay area to another fortune 500 in Nevada and made really good money, but that's not very common.

The whole point is that on the average people make less than they do in Ca, yet their money goes farther. Sure you can pick and choose a job that pays more in Ca, but overall people are ahead in the other states. You can pick and choose cities too if you like to prove your point. But overall by state they are ahead.

This was addressing your comment that people don't get paid the same in Ca as they do elsewhere so therefore you were implying that they were in worse shape by getting lower wages in the other state.

[2sleepy]

Originally Posted by aslowdodge

The whole point is that on the average people make less than they do in Ca, yet their money goes farther. Sure you can pick and choose a job that pays more in Ca, but overall people are ahead in the other states. You can pick and choose cities too if you like to prove your point. But overall by state they are ahead.

This was addressing your comment that people don't get paid the same in Ca as they do elsewhere so therefore you were implying that they were in worse shape by getting lower wages in the other state.

Of course it varies from state to state, but I don't think there is such a thing as a state with super housing prices and high median salaries, there is always some relationship.

This article calculates the number of years salary it would take to buy a home across the US.
Price-to-Income Ratios are Nearing Historic Highs - Blog | Joint Center for Housing Studies of Harvard University

If you look at the map you can see that Sacramento, Reno, Missoula Mt, Prescott & Flagstaff Az, and several other areas require about the same number of years of median salary to buy a home. Other factors could well influence the cost of living, i.e. taxes, utilities, etc. But just looking at the cost of housing and median salary it's obvious that it's not always smart to move to a place simply because housing is cheaper.

[aslowdodge]

Originally Posted by 2sleepy

Of course it varies from state to state, but I don't think there is such a thing as a state with super housing prices and high median salaries, there is always some relationship.

This article calculates the number of years salary it would take to buy a home across the US.
Price-to-Income Ratios are Nearing Historic Highs - Blog | Joint Center for Housing Studies of Harvard University

If you look at the map you can see that Sacramento, Reno, Missoula Mt, Prescott & Flagstaff Az, and several other areas require about the same number of years of median salary to buy a home. Other factors could well influence the cost of living, i.e. taxes, utilities, etc. But just looking at the cost of housing and median salary it's obvious that it's not always smart to move to a place simply because housing is cheaper.

I think there’s still some places with good ratios, but they are slipping. Here in Atlanta houses were pretty cheap but like many areas have really gone up.

[2sleepy]

Originally Posted by aslowdodge

I think there’s still some places with good ratios, but they are slipping. Here in Atlanta houses were pretty cheap but like many areas have really gone up.

I agree