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Well guess what - they are still Germans.
Both in Switzerland AND in Austria.
(Southern Germans that is, really, at least when it comes to Austria.)
From what point of view? Genetically, culturally?
Neither Swiss nor Austrians see themselves as Germans. Same for Luxembourgers, Liechtensteiners and Belgians. Fact is, the history of these countries diverge greatly and they all have their unique culture.
Why is it that people seem to deny the Austrian nation? National socialism? That was a mere 7 years in history and the first time Austria and Germany were truly united. The Holy Roman Empire? That can hardly be a uniting factor given that it was politically irrelevant and a constant reason for conflict.
That leaves language. But why does no one call the US or Canada British. Who'd call Brazil Portuguese?
I'd say culturally ( and probably genetically as well.)
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Neither Swiss nor Austrians see themselves as Germans.
Well I am no Swiss or Austrian, so I consider Austrians to be Germans)))
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Same for Luxembourgers, Liechtensteiners and Belgians.
Never met ppl from first two and who consider Belgians "Germans?"
I hear it for the first time.
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Fact is, the history of these countries diverge greatly and they all have their unique culture.
Why is it that people seem to deny the Austrian nation?
"Austrian nation?" There is nothing wrong with that. It's just that "nation" is based on Germans as a "unifying glue."
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National socialism? That was a mere 7 years in history and the first time Austria and Germany were truly united. The Holy Roman Empire? That can hardly be a uniting factor given that it was politically irrelevant and a constant reason for conflict.
I don't even think about that one - I keep on forgetting that Austria and Germany in fact WERE unified at certain point in time. No, it's just overall Austria gave me a feeling of "one of the German tribes" going its own way and including *other people* in its domain. That's all to it.
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That leaves language. But why does no one call the US or Canada British.
I'd say ONLY because of the size and the MULTITUDE of people they currently include. But if you go back in time - I'm sure they were both quite "British" back then. Austria was relatively small, with limited number of other ethnicites included, that's why it still remained more German in spirit ( closer to its roots.)
Never met ppl from first two and who consider Belgians "Germans?"
I hear it for the first time.
Liechtenstein and Luxembourg are German-speaking countries and Belgium is trilingual like Switzerland. French, Flemish, German.
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Originally Posted by erasure
I don't even think about that one - I keep on forgetting that Austria and Germany in fact WERE unified at certain point in time. No, it's just overall Austria gave me a feeling of "one of German tribes" going its own way and including *other people* in its domain. That's all to it.
There was more than one occasion where you reminded me publicly about our shared seven years.
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Originally Posted by erasure
Austria was relatively small, with limited number of other ethnicites included, that's why it still remained more German in spirit ( closer to its roots.)
Austria was the sixth largest country by population back in 1907. Only 24% of the population spoke German in 1910. I count 11 main ethnic groups.
Liechtenstein and Luxembourg are German-speaking countries and Belgium is trilingual like Switzerland. French, Flemish, German.
So does anyone consider Belgians to be Germans?
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There was more than one occasion where you reminded me publicly about our shared seven years.
I reminded you "publicly"?
The problem is, as embarrassing as it might be, I didn't even know that Austria and Germany were unitedfor seven years. So what could I have reminded you publicly - I don't even know, sorry)))
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Austria was the sixth largest country by population back in 1907. Only 24% of the population spoke German in 1910. I count 11 main ethnic groups.
A bit more than I expected, but still no match for Brazil-US, Canada - sorry)))
You tell me. You are the one who considers everyone who speaks German to be German.
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Originally Posted by erasure
I reminded you "publicly"?
The problem is, as embarrassing as it might be, I didn't even know that Austria and Germany were unitedfor seven years. So what could I have reminded you publicly - I don't even know, sorry)))
Well, a couple of months ago you didn't hesitate to play the Nazi card on this board.
You tell me. You are the one who considers everyone who speaks German to be German.
OK, I'll look into Belgium and its three languages and tell you.
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Well, a couple of months ago you didn't hesitate to play the Nazi card on this board.
You mean in History section?
Because I rarely posted anything of this kind here, unless it was connected to Russia's history/background somehow.
But I realized with time that you were closely watching my posts apparently, and taking it quite close to your heart. Never thought about that one before.
You mean in History section?
Because I rarely posted anything of this kind here, unless it was connected to Russia's history/background somehow.
But I realized with time that you were closely watching my posts apparently, and taking it quite close to your heart. Never thought about that one before.
No, here on the Europe forum. Most of it got deleted, because I reported it.
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Originally Posted by erasure
You mean Austrian-Hungarian Empire?
Why, I've heard a thing or two, but...the language, the culture ( be that Hungarians or Czecs) - nope, sorry, those relations were not "special" enough. Besides, is it a first time when Germans ( ugh, sorry - Austrians ) unite under their umbrella someone/something else?
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Originally Posted by erasure
That's what you'd like to believe ( and I can't blame you,) but something is telling me that things are not as easy as they look on a surface.
#1 -The stereotypes don't show up without any base for it,
#2 -Check out the "genetics" section here;
And the last but not least - if Czechs were so long in "Western Europe" and didn't have anything to do with "Eastern Europe," why would the *Western world* turned the blind eye to annexation of Czechoslovakia and then yet again - to partition of Poland? Both still happened to be Slavic countries, even if they were not of Orthodox religion. ( Only please don't point at Austria for similarity, because we all know where Hitler was originally from.)
So any thoughts on it?
P.S. No, Eastern Europe was never homogeneous, but what difference does it make? It still falls into the definition of the "West and the *rest*" rather nicely.
So, yeah. You are usually rather quick to point out that Austrians are Germans. And you usually mention Hitler at some point.
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but...the language, the culture ( be that Hungarians or Czecs) - nope, sorry, those relations were not "special" enough. 
) unite under their umbrella someone/something else? 
