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Kaliningrad is one of 3 Russian enclaves outside of the homeland, the 2nd being the Baykonour cosmodrome and city in Kazakhstan (half Under Kazakh, half Under Russian administration), and the third Transdniestria, officially independent but unrecognized and with strong links to Moscow, albeit not officially a Russian Republic.
Kaliningrad is one of 3 Russian enclaves outside of the homeland, the 2nd being the Baykonour cosmodrome and city in Kazakhstan (half Under Kazakh, half Under Russian administration), and the third Transdniestria, officially independent but unrecognized and with strong links to Moscow, albeit not officially a Russian Republic.
I think that you are not quite right. Kaliningrad - is an official part of Russia. Transdniestria is not an official part of Russia. Russia rented Baikonur cosmodrome from Kazakhstan. At present, Russia is building a new cosmodrome "Vostochny" ("Eastern") in the Far East. This will eliminate the rent of the cosmodrome, which is located in another country.
Petsamo, being the only (former) Finnish coastal area in Barents Sea, should also be considered to be returned to its rightful owners.
Wait a minute, after all I've heard from Finns here how they've "kicked Russians' butt," Russians got these territories after all?
Were these the territories that they originally asked for, or they've got more(less) than that?
Stalin made a land grab at the end of WWII. He got Eastern Prussia (after Lithuania managed to save a slice of it from falling into his hands: the easternmost portion that was heavily populated by Lithuanians), Moldova (Bessarabia, at that time), plus Ukraine and Belarus. Eastern Prussia was war booty for helping win the war against Germany. He then forced all German residents and any descendants of the original ethnic (Balt) Prussians that remained after Germany's ethnic cleansing of the area that began in the 13th Century to walk west into Germany in the middle of winter. He replaced them with Slavs. As you may know, Stalin was big on population transfers of ethnic peoples. Kalinin District provides Russia with a year-round ice-free port, a very precious asset.
We are talking about Königsberg, not "Kaliningrad".
It was ethnic cleansing that USSR/Russia committed, and not the reverse. It can never be forgiven and you are attempting to justify it based on supposed actions in the 13th century not unlike the Serbian's repeated references their loss in Kosovo. Inexcusable and expected from Russophiles.
And one more thing: what the Russians have done to that once beautiful city is shameful. It is now a third world slum I am told.
Last edited by LuvSouthOC; 04-11-2015 at 06:37 PM..
We are talking about Königsberg, not "Kaliningrad".
It was ethnic cleansing that USSR/Russia committed, and not the reverse. It can never be forgiven and you are attempting to justify it based on supposed actions in the 13th century not unlike the Serbian's repeated references their loss in Kosovo. Inexcusable and expected from Russophiles.
And one more thing: what the Russians have done to that once beautiful city is shameful. It is now a third world slum I am told.
During World War II, the western part of Russia transformed not in slum, but in ruins. I think you start to forget under any circumstances Königsberg became part of Russia.
During World War II, the western part of Russia transformed not in slum, but in ruins. I think you start to forget under any circumstances Königsberg became part of Russia.
I agree and the Soviet Union civilian and military loss of life was the highest for WW2 compared to any other country. Plus there was widespread destruction committed by the Nazis in the western Soviet Union. At least 20 million people in the Soviet Union died in that conflict. Plus the treatment of Soviet Prisoners of War was so much worse compared to the prisoners of war captured by the Nazis for the British and French Solders. Taking over Konigsberg was part of the war booty at the end of the dreadful conflict.
Wait a minute, after all I've heard from Finns here how they've "kicked Russians' butt," Russians got these territories after all?
Were these the territories that they originally asked for, or they've got more(less) than that?
They got less than they wanted. They wanted to annex all Finland, make it another Soviet republic. They only got parts of Karelia instead. And they have made it to a third-world slum too.
They got less than they wanted. They wanted to annex all Finland, make it another Soviet republic. They only got parts of Karelia instead. And they have made it to a third-world slum too.
"The Soviet Union ostensibly sought to claim parts of Finnish territory, demanding—amongst other concessions—that Finland cede substantial border territories in exchange for land elsewhere, claiming security reasons, primarily the protection of Leningrad, which was only 32 km (20 mi) from the Finnish border.[27][28][29] Finland refused and the USSR invaded the country."
Now what happened to Leningrad after all? Were Russians' concerns legitimate or not? Did they prove themselves correct? Yes, no?
Now to the second part -
We are talking about Königsberg, not "Kaliningrad".
It was ethnic cleansing that USSR/Russia committed, and not the reverse. It can never be forgiven and you are attempting to justify it based on supposed actions in the 13th century not unlike the Serbian's repeated references their loss in Kosovo. Inexcusable and expected from Russophiles.
And one more thing: what the Russians have done to that once beautiful city is shameful. It is now a third world slum I am told.
Of course it can be.
If ethnic cleansing of Russians on their own land performed by Germans could be forgiven, who cares about some "Konigsberg?" Easy-peasy, unless of course, you are a member of some Stormfront))))
Of course it can be.
If ethnic cleansing of Russians on their own land performed by Germans could be forgiven, who cares about some "Konigsberg?" Easy-peasy, unless of course, you are a member of some Stormfront))))
So, we are supposed to care about the ethnic cleansing of one nation, but not another? Do German lives have no value?
As for Finland, Stalin may have used "wanting to protect Leningrad" at first as a reason for invasion, but once the war started, do you think he would have backed down with anything less than a complete surrender? Unless his forces got a stiff beating, that is.
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