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Old 05-07-2017, 02:50 PM
 
Location: Near Luxembourg
1,891 posts, read 1,685,896 times
Reputation: 1392

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Quote:
Originally Posted by botticelli View Post
Where did Le Pen say she wants to evictin all foreigners? Nobody ever said that, not le pen, not trump, not anyone.

Why are people using the same logic that was used on Trump?? (tough on illegal immigrants = hating immigrants = racism: what kind of retarded logic here?)

Le Pen was against 1) mass immigration. She wants to cut immigrants by 90%. 2) Islamic Fundementalists.

She repeated them many times and never once did she say she wants to evict foreigners.

Have you ever listened to her speech even once? Probably not. You listen to the liberal fear mongering media.
I heard her absolutely AWFULL performance at the debate, that was enough for a no-no. Damn during the debate she was just pure hate, nothing close to a president.
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Old 05-07-2017, 02:55 PM
 
Location: Plague Island
779 posts, read 596,393 times
Reputation: 1265
Quote:
Originally Posted by botticelli View Post
Where did Le Pen say she wants to evictin all foreigners? Nobody ever said that, not le pen, not trump, not anyone.

Why are people using the same logic that was used on Trump?? (tough on illegal immigrants = hating immigrants = racism: what kind of retarded logic here?)

Le Pen was against 1) mass immigration. She wants to cut immigrants by 90%. 2) Islamic Fundementalists.

She repeated them many times and never once did she say she wants to evict foreigners.

Have you ever listened to her speech even once? Probably not. You listen to the liberal fear mongering media.
The political classification nowadays:
1. Against (illegal) mass immigration=far right extremist
2. Previous point + against Islam=literally Hitler.
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Old 05-07-2017, 03:08 PM
 
Location: Manhattan, NYC
1,274 posts, read 979,370 times
Reputation: 1250
Quote:
Originally Posted by botticelli View Post
Where did Le Pen say she wants to evictin all foreigners? Nobody ever said that, not le pen, not trump, not anyone.

Why are people using the same logic that was used on Trump?? (tough on illegal immigrants = hating immigrants = racism: what kind of retarded logic here?)

Le Pen was against 1) mass immigration. She wants to cut immigrants by 90%. 2) Islamic Fundementalists.

She repeated them many times and never once did she say she wants to evict foreigners.

Have you ever listened to her speech even once? Probably not. You listen to the liberal fear mongering media.
Let's see her points on immigration.

1. National preference on all jobs, social lodging and social helps - no equality in term of human beings.
2. Suppression of the medical help for clandestine immigrants.
3. No more Jus soli, no dual citizenship, and making it harder to become French by naturalisation.
4. Loss of citizenship for naturalised persons who've been naturalised for less than 10 years in case of serious crime (how serious?).
5. Reduce legal immigration from 200k to 50k in 5 years.
6. Out of Schengen to get boarder controls.
7. Fight the clandestine immigration with increased means.
8. No more family unification allowed.
9. Reduce the resident card from 10 years to 3 with strict control.
10. Evict all multi-recidivist offenders who are foreigners.
11. Change the law to forbid any regularisation for clandestine immigrants.
12. Evict all illegal immigrants.
13. All funding for development granted to immigrants' birth countries conditioned by their cooperation for the control of immigration.
14. Euro / Africa conference to improve coordination against illegal immigration.
15. Reduce the number of asylum granted for France.

What is that? Create 2 class of people in the country, French above the foreigners? Are they considered human beings? And then create 2 class of citizens in France, for those who've been naturalised in less than 10 years, those who have dual citizenship through the parents, personal life...

My wife who has a 10 years resident card would need to go and see the administration every 3 years? For what, for fun?

If you believe this is not equivalent to evicting all those people, I am quite curious. Just because it's not literal doesn't mean that it's not real. What she says doesn't mean much, because if you analyse what she wants, it's pretty clear. And don't even get me started on the people who work with her on a daily basis in her political party.

It's not an invention of the media, it's just herself.

Any political person who aims to create divisions in the population is not worth being called a politician. And that's what she does through her propositions. I don't even talk about her bitterness during the last "debate": that's a lot of violence and hate.
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Old 05-07-2017, 03:12 PM
 
Location: Manhattan, NYC
1,274 posts, read 979,370 times
Reputation: 1250
Quote:
Originally Posted by survivingearth View Post
Last time i checked the "left" was responsible for that...
The left didn't bankrupt first, it was Sarkozy who made a mistake with the social security system and then, it accelerated.

Nevertheless, this is nothing compared to going out of the Eurozone and trying to become "better" alone, without the EU partners.
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Old 05-07-2017, 03:15 PM
 
4,798 posts, read 3,509,747 times
Reputation: 2301
Via obamas ways, print Mo Money
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Old 05-07-2017, 03:20 PM
 
Location: Bologna, Italy
7,501 posts, read 6,293,418 times
Reputation: 3761
It is not like borders are free. Border controls are numerous and almost automatic since pretty much 2015 and the attacks.

Also, during the debate it was clear that she had no clue about this either. As if "closing borders" was so easy and would have solved everything, especially when we live in a world where young people favor a flight to Syria to plot a suicide bomb over trying to make a living while having a French citizenship. Macron at least acknowledged that, even if he does not provide solutions yet.
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Old 05-07-2017, 03:50 PM
F18
 
542 posts, read 529,541 times
Reputation: 424
Quote:
Originally Posted by botticelli View Post
Where did Le Pen say she wants to evictin all foreigners? Nobody ever said that, not le pen, not trump, not anyone.

Why are people using the same logic that was used on Trump?? (tough on illegal immigrants = hating immigrants = racism: what kind of retarded logic here?)

Le Pen was against 1) mass immigration. She wants to cut immigrants by 90%. 2) Islamic Fundementalists.

She repeated them many times and never once did she say she wants to evict foreigners.

Have you ever listened to her speech even once? Probably not. You listen to the liberal fear mongering media.
Why are you defending her so much? If she was elected you would be one of the first to be affected by her policies.
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Old 05-07-2017, 05:37 PM
 
4,698 posts, read 4,075,331 times
Reputation: 2483
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gasolin View Post
A change means that there needs to be an analysis on why France is not able to produce more and better in term of wealth, and maybe, rethink the social contract in term of redistribution of wealth. But by no mean is the redistribution of wealth more important than producing the actual wealth: if there's nothing to redistribute, none of this matters.

I think France took the right choice and has to be ready to take the difficult commitment to work "together", everyone needs to focus on producing and helping each others, and the future will be bright for the country of the reason and the Declartion of the Human Rights.
How? Macron says whatever people want to hear, he is going to lower taxes, and increase public spending. And like any populist he will fund it by decreasing bureaucracy and getting people off unemployment.

The problem with a centrist candidate like Macron is that he has no base. If he increases taxes, then he will lose his right wing supporters. If he tries to make it easier to fire workers, then he will lose his left wing supporters. Its impossible to predict what is going to happen, but I think the French will soon be disappointed. I believe he was the best of the two choices, but he was not the right choice.

Last edited by Camlon; 05-07-2017 at 05:54 PM..
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Old 05-07-2017, 07:05 PM
 
Location: Cannes
2,452 posts, read 2,382,164 times
Reputation: 1620
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pokitobounto View Post
Like leaving euro Union, ie Schengen and Euro?
She also has a leftist policy (like putting age of retirement at 60 HAHAHAHA) and that's not how you attract talents.
That would've been great!!!
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Old 05-07-2017, 08:23 PM
 
58 posts, read 45,448 times
Reputation: 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gasolin View Post
Let's see her points on immigration.

1. National preference on all jobs, social lodging and social helps - no equality in term of human beings.
2. Suppression of the medical help for clandestine immigrants.
3. No more Jus soli, no dual citizenship, and making it harder to become French by naturalisation.
4. Loss of citizenship for naturalised persons who've been naturalised for less than 10 years in case of serious crime (how serious?).
5. Reduce legal immigration from 200k to 50k in 5 years.
6. Out of Schengen to get boarder controls.
7. Fight the clandestine immigration with increased means.
8. No more family unification allowed.
9. Reduce the resident card from 10 years to 3 with strict control.
10. Evict all multi-recidivist offenders who are foreigners.
11. Change the law to forbid any regularisation for clandestine immigrants.
12. Evict all illegal immigrants.
13. All funding for development granted to immigrants' birth countries conditioned by their cooperation for the control of immigration.
14. Euro / Africa conference to improve coordination against illegal immigration.
15. Reduce the number of asylum granted for France.

What is that? Create 2 class of people in the country, French above the foreigners? Are they considered human beings? And then create 2 class of citizens in France, for those who've been naturalised in less than 10 years, those who have dual citizenship through the parents, personal life...

My wife who has a 10 years resident card would need to go and see the administration every 3 years? For what, for fun?

If you believe this is not equivalent to evicting all those people, I am quite curious. Just because it's not literal doesn't mean that it's not real. What she says doesn't mean much, because if you analyse what she wants, it's pretty clear. And don't even get me started on the people who work with her on a daily basis in her political party.

It's not an invention of the media, it's just herself.

Any political person who aims to create divisions in the population is not worth being called a politician. And that's what she does through her propositions. I don't even talk about her bitterness during the last "debate": that's a lot of violence and hate.
There is overreach and racist undertones there I agree. But I think many people want to keep access to pensions and health care. All over Europe the access to jobs, education and the social insurance system is precarious and defacto being denied to ever increasing numbers of ordinary people. The basic function of the state and society is threatened . Insurance providers need to have someone paying into the system. Maybe it is in France like elsewhere in Europe they get many people who can barely read and write. Others want to undermine all basic services for their own benefit or ideological reasons. I see the main policies are some cheap populism ( criminals most likely only make a small dent on the budgets) and then more importantly salvaging the sustainability of all social systems.

The government's loyalty has to be primarily to its own citizens. French citizens and legalised residents above foreigners in France is wrong how? Can I get a pension from the French taxpayer now if I turn up down there. Who do you think should have access to services of any country? Do you support medicare and medicaid etc in the US? Who should have access to that in your opinion?
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