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There's lots of "affordable" places to live in Florida. They just aren't near the beaches and theme parks and popular tourist hotspots. You'll need to look at the rural areas and exurbs outside the metropolitan areas. You may have to commute an hour to a major city for employment to have good job prospects as well as dirt cheap housing costs.
Good point.
However, most people are not going to want to live in Chiefland Florida or Live Oak and drive 50 miles each way to work. Plus, if you're single that must be horrid as well trying to date in those types of rural areas.
There's lots of "affordable" places to live in Florida. They just aren't near the beaches and theme parks and popular tourist hotspots. You'll need to look at the rural areas and exurbs outside the metropolitan areas. You may have to commute an hour to a major city for employment to have good job prospects as well as dirt cheap housing costs.
That description also fits California or New York or even Italy for that matter, or dozens of other places around the globe, especially in countries of early industrialization now facing global competition over the past 25-30 years.
That description also fits California or New York or even Italy for that matter, or dozens of other places around the globe, especially in countries of early industrialization now facing global competition over the past 25-30 years.
California for the most part yes, in New York not so much outside of the immediate NYC region. Parts of the state such as Albany-Schenectady-Troy, Rochester, Buffalo, Syracuse and others are actually quite affordable. Other large metros that's certainly not the case in either with examples such as Chicago, Dallas/Fort Worth, Houston, Atlanta, Phoenix, St Louis, Charlotte, Pittsburgh, Cincinnati, Kansas City, Columbus, Indianapolis, Cleveland, Raleigh-Durham and many more NOT seeing the Rent to Income issues and general unaffordability seen in Orlando. Economists have long stated Orlando's growth is unsustainable when factoring who is moving here and the jobs most are forced to accept.
Even then there is still competition. There are only so many nursing jobs. Like for example a few years ago when the economy wasn't good you had everyone trying to get into nursing school, radiology, etc. Many colleges there was a waiting list to get in because the lack of spots open. A lot of working age adults who were laid off or underemployed went to nursing school. then you started hearing about how it was hard to get a job in that field because so many people were applying for those jobs.
The problem with Florida, at least the major metro areas and costal areas is that a lot of industry is tied to service. Even educated jobs in those fields like chefs, managers and such. When something like Covid hits, big hurricanes or a major recession like in 2008, Florida gets hit hard and you saw what happened in 2008 here in FL. FL and Nevada get hit the hardest.
You bring up a good point on the nursing school thing, which is the argument I make against the current trend of bashing college in favor of trade school. If everyone dumps college and starts training to be welders and plumbers, then the oversupply of workers in those fields will drive down the wages that are praised nowadays and up the value of college-dependent jobs. You're basically replacing one addiction with another. Instead of making people aware of the myriad of paths they can take and showing that there is dignity in all kinds of work, which was the problem this whole time as we elevated the social status of college graduates, we demonize the thing that's kind of expensive right now or who's environments are hostile to our political beliefs.
Anyway, you are right that our issue is too many jobs tied to service. Also, we love the idea of luring existing companies here (that will pay its Florida workers much less than they do in similarly priced metros) instead of cultivating a climate where companies can start here, grow here, and stay here.
People do it all the time. Every metro in Florida has these commuter type exurb counties/outyling areas where people trade off the cheaper housing with a long commute. They will probably gain in popularity after the pandemic if people are able to WFH full time or even a hybrid schedule only going into the office 2 days a week.
Tampa --> Pasco County, Polk County, Hernando County
Orlando --> Lake County, Marion County, Polk County, Volusia County
Jacksonville --> Clay County, Putnam County
Miami--> Homestead
West Palm Beach --> Port St. Lucie
Quote:
Originally Posted by MOforthewin
Good point.
However, most people are not going to want to live in Chiefland Florida or Live Oak and drive 50 miles each way to work. Plus, if you're single that must be horrid as well trying to date in those types of rural areas.
You bring up a good point on the nursing school thing, which is the argument I make against the current trend of bashing college in favor of trade school. If everyone dumps college and starts training to be welders and plumbers, then the oversupply of workers in those fields will drive down the wages that are praised nowadays and up the value of college-dependent jobs. You're basically replacing one addiction with another. Instead of making people aware of the myriad of paths they can take and showing that there is dignity in all kinds of work, which was the problem this whole time as we elevated the social status of college graduates, we demonize the thing that's kind of expensive right now or who's environments are hostile to our political beliefs.
Anyway, you are right that our issue is too many jobs tied to service. Also, we love the idea of luring existing companies here (that will pay its Florida workers much less than they do in similarly priced metros) instead of cultivating a climate where companies can start here, grow here, and stay here.
The other reason why I can see companies and some of them not relocating here is the talent pool. I hate to say this but a lot of the population down here is not as educated and the public school system is not very good down here. That's a huge complaint I hear in SWFL. It's improved some since I've been in school years ago. A lot of the locals, especially younger ones I hate to say it but don't seem very bright, many don't even have anything past a HS degree.
When Hertz moved down here and brought high paying jobs most of those jobs were filled because most of the NJ workers moved here. The media pimped Hertz a lot. Now they're belly up and laying people off.
Most of the growth I see being built here in southwest FL is hotels, hotels, hotels and resorts or condos. Other than the managers at places like hotels, most of the workers are low paid, near min wage jobs with many being filled by immigrants.
Orlando I don't know what the deal is and why anyone would want to live there unless they have a good job with Universal or Disney. It's a tourist based town geared towards vacations and people driving who don't know where they're going. Just doesn't seem appealing to me. However a lot of these young college graduate girls are literally obsessed with Disney and maybe that's why they move there lol. My 27 year old cousin is obsessed with it and has season passes and she goes like every other week lol.
The other reason why I can see companies and some of them not relocating here is the talent pool. I hate to say this but a lot of the population down here is not as educated and the public school system is not very good down here. That's a huge complaint I hear in SWFL. It's improved some since I've been in school years ago. A lot of the locals, especially younger ones I hate to say it but don't seem very bright, many don't even have anything past a HS degree.
When Hertz moved down here and brought high paying jobs most of those jobs were filled because most of the NJ workers moved here. The media pimped Hertz a lot. Now they're belly up and laying people off.
Most of the growth I see being built here in southwest FL is hotels, hotels, hotels and resorts or condos. Other than the managers at places like hotels, most of the workers are low paid, near min wage jobs with many being filled by immigrants.
Orlando I don't know what the deal is and why anyone would want to live there unless they have a good job with Universal or Disney. It's a tourist based town geared towards vacations and people driving who don't know where they're going. Just doesn't seem appealing to me. However a lot of these young college graduate girls are literally obsessed with Disney and maybe that's why they move there lol. My 27 year old cousin is obsessed with it and has season passes and she goes like every other week lol.
I don't "hate to say it." In fact, I feel it should be said, and often.
If you choose not to give quality education to all of your state's children, then you will have to accept that many of them will not be capable of or qualified to have careers, or get decent-paying jobs that keep them out of the welfare system.
There are stories about "this one guy" or "my family" or "the CEO of..." scraping themselves up from poverty and ending up successful.
But the same people who tell you these stories, are the ones complaining about all the OTHER people who are stuck in poverty. The less education you have, the fewer opportunities you are given.
The ones who make it out of poverty are the exceptions to the rule. If you put ANY family into a poverty environment, they have a higher risk of becoming the family you expect to see there. The struggle just of being poor is hard enough. Add to that the struggle of being considered "second class" by virtue of your skin color. There's other struggle of being considered "second class" by virtue of their family size, or the habits of their parents, whether or not they accept funding for housing or food, the primary language spoken in the home. All of these things count against the kids living in this situation. Add to that a really REALLY bad education system in those areas, severely underserved and underfunded, and the result is a majority of those living in poverty, staying in poverty and continuing to need our tax dollars to keep them alive because human rights require it.
Now - shift all that by funneling money into decent education, and suddenly everything changes. Kids will graduate. They will know that a future exists for them. They might still have to try harder. All those OTHER pressures exist. But they have the means to push through them and into something better than slinging hash or selling drugs on the other side.
The other reason why I can see companies and some of them not relocating here is the talent pool. I hate to say this but a lot of the population down here is not as educated and the public school system is not very good down here. That's a huge complaint I hear in SWFL. It's improved some since I've been in school years ago. A lot of the locals, especially younger ones I hate to say it but don't seem very bright, many don't even have anything past a HS degree.
When Hertz moved down here and brought high paying jobs most of those jobs were filled because most of the NJ workers moved here. The media pimped Hertz a lot. Now they're belly up and laying people off.
Most of the growth I see being built here in southwest FL is hotels, hotels, hotels and resorts or condos. Other than the managers at places like hotels, most of the workers are low paid, near min wage jobs with many being filled by immigrants.
Orlando I don't know what the deal is and why anyone would want to live there unless they have a good job with Universal or Disney. It's a tourist based town geared towards vacations and people driving who don't know where they're going. Just doesn't seem appealing to me. However a lot of these young college graduate girls are literally obsessed with Disney and maybe that's why they move there lol. My 27 year old cousin is obsessed with it and has season passes and she goes like every other week lol.
Orlando works out well if you are an engineer or in some aspect of medicine as far traditional college degree jobs are concerned. And you don't have to be an M.D. With the good mix of defense contractors and two major hospital chains and the obvious clusters of doctors offices, labs, etc nearby, I think jobs and competitive incomes are available in those fields. It still may be less than what they would make elsewhere, but they are still high enough to afford to live here and enjoy some of what the area has to offer for leisure.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghaati
I don't "hate to say it." In fact, I feel it should be said, and often.
If you choose not to give quality education to all of your state's children, then you will have to accept that many of them will not be capable of or qualified to have careers, or get decent-paying jobs that keep them out of the welfare system.
There are stories about "this one guy" or "my family" or "the CEO of..." scraping themselves up from poverty and ending up successful.
But the same people who tell you these stories, are the ones complaining about all the OTHER people who are stuck in poverty. The less education you have, the fewer opportunities you are given.
The ones who make it out of poverty are the exceptions to the rule. If you put ANY family into a poverty environment, they have a higher risk of becoming the family you expect to see there. The struggle just of being poor is hard enough. Add to that the struggle of being considered "second class" by virtue of your skin color. There's other struggle of being considered "second class" by virtue of their family size, or the habits of their parents, whether or not they accept funding for housing or food, the primary language spoken in the home. All of these things count against the kids living in this situation. Add to that a really REALLY bad education system in those areas, severely underserved and underfunded, and the result is a majority of those living in poverty, staying in poverty and continuing to need our tax dollars to keep them alive because human rights require it.
Now - shift all that by funneling money into decent education, and suddenly everything changes. Kids will graduate. They will know that a future exists for them. They might still have to try harder. All those OTHER pressures exist. But they have the means to push through them and into something better than slinging hash or selling drugs on the other side.
Sorry to get political, but Republicans nationwide love to talk about the "Florida miracle" in education (aka Jeb Bush's reforms involving increased testing and "choice," which has resulted in numerous consulting gigs in other Republican-governed states ever since), which isn't entirely true and seemingly hasn't changed the the K-college system's reputation in the eyes of the general national population.
I’m more curious to know what these degrees are.
There are numerous jobs one can get with just an associates degree that pay over $20/hr to start.
in 2020?
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