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I couldn't stand all the weeds growing and taking over the yard. So, I've killed the grass and everything else that was growing, except some moss that still lingers. It will be 3 weeks at the end of the week since the initial spraying with Roundup.
How do I kill off the moss?
What is your opinion on whether to till the soil or not? Will tilling activate the deeper dormant weeds in the soil?
The zone is near NYC. So cool season grass is the best. The yard is located behind the home on the northside of the house and gets about 4-5 hrs of direct sunlight depending which part of the yard gets direct sunlight. So, it can get shady on parts of the yard. There are maple trees in the yard as well. I will use Titan RX Turf tall fescue. I have tried KBG but it did not do very well because of the amount of light the yard was getting, so now I will try turf tall fescue.
Any other suggestions with the plan?
Here's the plan:
1. Kill any living vegetation in the lawn.
2. Mow the dead grass down low. DO NOT TILL, IT WILL ACTIVATE DORMANT SEEDS.
I'm debating on whether to till or not. Right now, I feel I have to till in order to expose more soil for the seed to have soil contact. I really don't want to buy soil from the big box store because it's back breaking to carry all that soil and if I order from a landscaper it gets very expensive.
3. Rake the soil, rake all dead debris, then rake with steel rake to expose soil.
4. Drop gypsum with dropper to loosen the impacted clay soil and improved drainage. (I notice that the drainage is not very good, there's puddles in certain sections. Is this why moss is growing, besides the lawn being located in the north side of the house.
5. Use Scott's seed dropper evenly and perpendicularly. Will use Titan RX turf tall fescue.
6.Cover the seeds with peat moss. ( Can I use the dead grass clippings from the lawn to cover the seeds so they won't fly away and also prevent birds eating them (I have lots of birds in my yard) or will this introduce weed seeds from the clippings even though they are technically dead.
7. Water the seed at least 2-3 times a day or make sure soil is most.
you have moss because of the ph of the soil and if you kill it you will still have the same problem unless you take steps to change the ph. Moss gardens are beautiful and folks pay big bucks to purchase moss.
You are undertaking a big project with what seems to me very little knowledge. You will have to add organic matter to improve drainage and texture of soil. Believe me-I gardened in Georgia clay for more than 30 years.You can till up - or have somebody plow it up- because you WANT to expose dormant seeds. Let them germinate once they hit sun, kill them off and till again. I don't think you have much chance of success without tilling up the soil. You still have time before fall seed sowing. But if a nice and healthy lawn is what you are looking for I would stretch my budget as far as possible to have it done professionally. Have sod laid and be done with it. Remember - when you go to move the sprinkler- I assume you do not have a yard wide system, you will sink up to your knees in wet and tilled soil and you will have a huge mess. Ask me how I know.
ETA: If you think it is back breaking to "move all that soil" you don't want to buy think about how backbreaking it is to stand behind a tiller hours on end. And you will have to handle amendments too which can be extremely labor intensive. Unfortunately there is not an easy way to have a nice lawn from scratch.
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There are granulated moss killers that you spread, water in and in a day or two it turns black and is dead. Then rake it off.
The hard thatch from the dead grass roots will prevent your seed from doing well, you really do need to till. What I would do is till, then treat with a pre-emergent weed killer, then rake smooth and plant sod, which won't be affected by the pre emergent.
If you use seed, you have to wait a period of time after using it before seeding, according to the manufacturer instructions, usually 4-6 months. Rather than use it, You could till now, and again (or rake) often all winter as any weeds appear, then roll and seed in spring when hopefully many of the weeds will have germinated and been uprooted or tilled in.
I'm not sure I would till. Burying a bunch of dead plant matter will deplete the soil of nitrogen.
The better course would probably be removing the grass with a sod cutter or maybe just a heavy raking to break up the thatch and aerating. It doesn't look like you're dealing with a fifty year old St. Augustine lawn or anything; you can probably rake your way out of this. You may need to top dress.
I'm not sure I would till. Burying a bunch of dead plant matter will deplete the soil of nitrogen.
The better course would probably be removing the grass with a sod cutter or maybe just a heavy raking to break up the thatch and aerating. It doesn't look like you're dealing with a fifty year old St. Augustine lawn or anything; you can probably rake your way out of this. You may need to top dress.
Agree with Cleonidas, since I also did this once to get rid of annual goosegrass.
Killed the existing with Round-Up, removed the sod with a sod cutter (you can rent these pretty cheaply), raked away the dead sod. But then I actually laid rolls of fresh sod over the ground so as not to disturb the soil. Once the sod rooted, I never had the goosegrass problem again since the seed was never exposed to enough light to germinate or thrive. And Voila, a nice, attractive grassy area where once chaos reigned.
Agree with Cleonidas, since I also did this once to get rid of annual goosegrass.
Killed the existing with Round-Up, removed the sod with a sod cutter (you can rent these pretty cheaply), raked away the dead sod. But then I actually laid rolls of fresh sod over the ground so as not to disturb the soil. Once the sod rooted, I never had the goosegrass problem again since the seed was never exposed to enough light to germinate or thrive. And Voila, a nice, attractive grassy area where once chaos reigned.
I can see doing this shortcut for sod but certainly not for seed which is what OP is planning to do.
you have moss because of the ph of the soil and if you kill it you will still have the same problem unless you take steps to change the ph. Moss gardens are beautiful and folks pay big bucks to purchase moss.
You are undertaking a big project with what seems to me very little knowledge. You will have to add organic matter to improve drainage and texture of soil. Believe me-I gardened in Georgia clay for more than 30 years.You can till up - or have somebody plow it up- because you WANT to expose dormant seeds. Let them germinate once they hit sun, kill them off and till again. I don't think you have much chance of success without tilling up the soil. You still have time before fall seed sowing. But if a nice and healthy lawn is what you are looking for I would stretch my budget as far as possible to have it done professionally. Have sod laid and be done with it. Remember - when you go to move the sprinkler- I assume you do not have a yard wide system, you will sink up to your knees in wet and tilled soil and you will have a huge mess. Ask me how I know.
ETA: If you think it is back breaking to "move all that soil" you don't want to buy think about how backbreaking it is to stand behind a tiller hours on end. And you will have to handle amendments too which can be extremely labor intensive. Unfortunately there is not an easy way to have a nice lawn from scratch.
I'm not a landscaper so yes, I'm a novice when it comes to landscaping a lawn. If it's a ph problem then my assumption is that the ph of the soil is acidic probably somewhere in the range between pH 5-6 since moss likes acidic, shady and wet areas.
I only see the moss grow in the shadies part of the yard eg. directly behind the shed and the house where there's practically no direct sunlight.
Rain in the east tends to be more acidic as well and along with the poor drainage compacted clay soil. Now this seems to be the right recipe for growing moss.
There is also reduced nitrogen transformation.
If I do add organic matter as suggested, I have to be careful because adding more organic matter will ultimately increase the soil acidity and lower the ph.
I can add lime to the soil to modify the ph. The lime can reduce the harmful effects of low pH (aluminum or manganese toxicity) and to add calcium and magnesium to the soil.
I think I have to till first if I do add lime because lime is relatively insoluble in water so maximum contact with the soil is necessary to neutralize the soil acidity. Lime will not move into the soil like water-soluble fertilizers. I will have to thoroughly mix the recommended amount of lime with the top 4 to 6 inches of soil. So till first, add lime and then mix.
O course you will do several soil tests with your extension service so you will know how much of everything to till into the soil.
I know you are not in Ohio but you may find the link interesting. Gypsum is not the best amendment for heavy clay soil. Stick with composted manure, builders sand, compost, mushroom compost and top soil. Again this is a huge job. Good luck,
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