Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I hate going to the circus and the zoo.
The zoo isn't so bad *if* the animal habitats are large enough and varied enough for the animal. Rarely is that case plus there is unfailingly one ahole who feels the need to tease the caged animals.
The circus I truly cannot stand. I don't find anything exciting about watching lions jump through hoops. I'd much rather watch paint dry.
To quote Temple Grandin "Nature is cruel - we don't have to be"
Last edited by camping!; 03-07-2011 at 05:47 PM..
Reason: added quote
You don't know a whole lot about horses, do you?
I have horses. They do not have to be confined. I can let them out to pasture and they unfailingly return to the barn (actually, horses are famous for that - If you're ever riding in a blizzard and get lost, all the old cowboys swear by just letting go of the reins. The horse will go home, with no help from you)
Thats not his argument. Of course they will return to their shelter where they get fed. As Im sure Elephants that are cared for and used like horses would too. Once an animal is accustomed to being fed as opposed to forging for food it will return. Put you horse out on the BLM land and see what their range boundary will be. The point is we take an animal that is a naturally herding grazing animal with a very large home range (horse) and keep it stalled 2/3 of the time and turn out on an acre the other 1/3 of the time and it is acceptable because we call it domesticated. How is that different than an elephant?
I dont like the circus or the zoo and I dont think it is wise to keep wild animals as pets, but I get Charlesdicken's point.
Animals aren't put on this earth to entertain humans. People are disgusting by levels of animal cruelty. You know these animals are abused, but you take your brats their anyway. As long as Timmy is happy, so who cares the elephant is hit and kicked.
As far as pets. Allow all the animals to run free. I don't care. It's a difference between having a dog/cat in the home and having a caged animal. I do know people with house dogs/cats. They won't allow the pet outside. That's crazy to me.
I don't own any animals.
Humans started this enslaving animals. Dog or gorilla. Humans started this madness.
If these animals are so domesticated, then why do they attack the handlers.
Animals aren't put on this earth to entertain humans. People are disgusting by levels of animal cruelty. You know these animals are abused, but you take your brats their anyway. As long as Timmy is happy, so who cares the elephant is hit and kicked.
As far as pets. Allow all the animals to run free. I don't care. It's a difference between having a dog/cat in the home and having a caged animal. I do know people with house dogs/cats. They won't allow the pet outside. That's crazy to me.
I don't own any animals.
Humans started this enslaving animals. Dog or gorilla. Humans started this madness.
If these animals are so domesticated, then why do they attack the handlers.
Would you go to a Circus if you knew animals were abused?
Of course not! but.....as a general rule I avoid any circus like the plague. After that year I spent in W. Africa, if I never have to see another Elephant up close and in person again, it will suit me just fine. I no longer see them as cute or attractive. I do wish people would quit killing them for their teeth, but, I have no interest in seeing one up close, been there, done that, ain't gonna do it again!!!
Thats not his argument. Of course they will return to their shelter where they get fed. As Im sure Elephants that are cared for and used like horses would too. Once an animal is accustomed to being fed as opposed to forging for food it will return. Put you horse out on the BLM land and see what their range boundary will be. The point is we take an animal that is a naturally herding grazing animal with a very large home range (horse) and keep it stalled 2/3 of the time and turn out on an acre the other 1/3 of the time and it is acceptable because we call it domesticated. How is that different than an elephant?
I dont like the circus or the zoo and I dont think it is wise to keep wild animals as pets, but I get Charlesdicken's point.
That is exactly my point!
Just because an animal returns to where you feed it every day doesn't mean it loves being confined or deserves it. lol
A pasture is a far cry better than an acre assuming you define a pasture as a respectable amount of land for an animal that has the range of a horse, say at least 20 acres. Keeping a horse on an acre or two or even less or keeping locked in a barn the majority of the day is no worse than the circus confining the elephants. Actually its probably worse because elephants are more docile and don't cover the amount of territory a horse naturally does.
This thread proves my point on how American society makes a distinction between what they consider "domesticated" animals and what they consider wild animals. I did an argumentative research paper on this topic back when I was in college and the instructor absolutely loved it. There have been numerous threads on this topic on several forums and it always goes the same way. The majority of people draw a distinction between the two groups and just cannot wrap their head around the fact that the animals they consider "domesticated" are still animals and do not deserve to be confined in habitats that do not accommodate their needs. They consider it atrocious that the circus has elephants and haul them in railroad cars but they consider it acceptable to load a horse up in a tiny trailer in the summer and haul it around. Some find it acceptable to keep great big dogs inside their house and it never gets any exercise or at best they let it out or take it for a walk for 30 minutes when they get home. You can argue all you want that your dog is domesticated but it still does not negate the fact that a two or three thousand square foot home is not an adequate habitat for your German shepherd and a 30 minute walk in the afternoon does not make up for the poor habitat. Sure the dog wants back in the house, life is easy in there, that's where they get fed, and they are accustomed to it but it still doesn't make it right. We could bicker about this for months and unfortunately some just are not going to ever get past making that distinction between the two groups.
I don't go to the circus because I find it very annoying the way they try to pander all of the grotesquely over priced cheap junk and snacks. I mean, $10 for cotton candy just because it includes a 50 cent cheap ass hat included.....really? lol
Thats not his argument. Of course they will return to their shelter where they get fed. As Im sure Elephants that are cared for and used like horses would too. Once an animal is accustomed to being fed as opposed to forging for food it will return. Put you horse out on the BLM land and see what their range boundary will be. The point is we take an animal that is a naturally herding grazing animal with a very large home range (horse) and keep it stalled 2/3 of the time and turn out on an acre the other 1/3 of the time and it is acceptable because we call it domesticated. How is that different than an elephant?
I dont like the circus or the zoo and I dont think it is wise to keep wild animals as pets, but I get Charlesdicken's point.
My apologies. I was thinking about African Elephants, who, so far as I know, do not like people very much.
Asian elephants, on the other hand, are considered domesticated (and I assume these are the ones used in circuses? I don't know, I haven't been to the circus since I was 6).
Still, you missed my point as well. Domesticated animals (especially non-food ones) choose to stay and work, because it makes their lives easier.
It's not so different from people, really. We choose to remain in society even though it restricts what we can and can't do because it's considerably safer than venturing off into the wild to fend for ourselves.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
