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I have heard some make this statement before if one takes government aid they should have to meet some some requirements birth control, and Drug testing. At one time they were forced to come in and look for a job I don't think that is required any longer.
NO, and NO. I'll tell you why:
If you condone this kind of intrusion of personal freedoms for recipients of gov't aid, you are setting a precedent for the gov't to expand that "force" to other groups. Someday, this may even come around and bite YOU in the butt! Of course, we know that gov't never expands its authority...right??
Last edited by Oldhag1; 01-22-2015 at 03:20 PM..
Reason: Removed icon
Our welfare system is so screwed up that it WON"T pay for voluntary sterilization until the woman is at least 21 years old - leading to women who are begging to get their tubes tied since they already have 5 kids by age 20, all on welfare, and Medicaid says they have to wait another year (and another baby). But it WILL pay for reversal of vasectomy or tubal ligation, so that the dependent person can produce MORE babies to be raised on welfare!
It seems that our welfare system is backwards.......we reward women for having more children rather than for not bringing more kids into the world than they can afford to pay for themselves.
I've told this story before. Years ago I was in the loan business and a repeat male customer came in to renew his loan. When I asked why he needed the loan he said he was going to get married and then he said he was going to quit his job ! I asked him why, and he said, because his fiance' has 8 kids, and he said "Do you know how much money she gets a month for 8 kids ? I don't have to work any more !"
My District Manager ok'd the loan because he said it was the most stable income a person can have ! Tell me THAT isn't backwards of the way it should be !
Don
Don, I have an extremely hard time believing this (the bolded part). What state are you in? It should be easy enough to check the MAXIMUM benefit for a single mom with 8 kids (not to mention that her status would change once she was married).
Here's an actual link to a fact-checking web site about a similar story that made the rounds on the Internet:
In addition, the welfare reform bill in the 1990s changed the rules in a number of ways, including setting a lifetime limit on the number of years families can be on welfare AND not giving extra money for additional kids born while the mom was on welfare. States can override those rules but not all do.
Any requirement to force women on welfare to go on birth control would not pass Constitutional scrutiny. You can be annoyed at that, but come on, I think even conservative members of the Supreme Court would reject such rules. (And BTW, no bleeding-heart liberal here. I always find it astonishing that people take having kids SO lightly, when it is THE most life-changing thing you can do. But I am rational enough to know that the Constitution would simply not allow the government to force birth control on people.)
Last edited by Oldhag1; 01-22-2015 at 03:20 PM..
Reason: Edited quote
Our country used to sterilize poor, non-white women. Not something to be proud of and not something to bring back.
Quote:
For example, in 1972, United States Senate committee testimony brought to light that at least 2,000 involuntary sterilizations had been performed on poor black women without their consent or knowledge. An investigation revealed that the surgeries were all performed in the South, and were all performed on black welfare mothers with multiple children. Testimony revealed that many of these women were threatened with an end to their welfare benefits until they consented to sterilization
Requiring temporary forms of birth control isn't a satisfactory answer, either. Not all women can tolerate hormonal birth control. Should someone have to bleed constantly in order to receive benefits? Or gain 50lbs? We would have to provide all of these women with access to a gynecologist, not just to prescribe the birth control, but to deal with side effects and problems like an embedded or lost IUD.
Do some of you posters realize that it is not just single mothers who receive welfare benefits? Many recipients are married couples, the working poor, with one or two children. Some of the single mothers are divorced women with little job skills perhaps not receiving child support payments and just trying to survive. Some welfare recipients have lost jobs or had to take lower paying jobs and just need temporary assistance for their already established families. Its harsh to paint all welfare recipients with the same brush. Not everyone on welfare is a drugged up deadbeat baby machine.
I think a lot of people have an image of the "typical welfare recipient" in their head, 2mares. Right or wrong, it's there.
My gripe with the handouts isn't necessarily who gets them but how the system is constantly gamed and defrauded in order for some people to live a lifestyle they are content with, not necessarily lavish. Comfort means different things to everyone.
Getting an increase in benefits for having a child a year after you just had one is nuts. Being allowed to spend money on luxury, or "sin", items is nuts. Being able to go to a warehouse club to buy all of the supplies to do a weekend fish fry so you can pocket the proceeds is nuts. This is the kind of thing I'd like to see stopped. There are far too many people with no integrity and who will abuse what should be seen as help, not an entitlement.
We don't hear the stories about the mom with 3 kids, husband was killed ina car wreck. We don't hear how she busted her tail to get off of assistance as a matter of pride, if nothing else. We DO hear about the abuses that are constantly happening and it sours many of us on the whole program especially when there are people out there who need the help and some "welfare queen" is squandering her monthly check on junk.
We hear politicians and bureaucrats talk about how they'll fix everything, then do nothing. We've got people who acknowledge the problem but refuse to address it for political reasons. This isn't an attack on a particular party, so please don't go there. Maybe we need to be mad at the people who continue to allow these problems to exist rather than the people who take advantage of the loopholes.
I think a lot of people have an image of the "typical welfare recipient" in their head, 2mares. Right or wrong, it's there.
My gripe with the handouts isn't necessarily who gets them but how the system is constantly gamed and defrauded in order for some people to live a lifestyle they are content with, not necessarily lavish. Comfort means different things to everyone.
Getting an increase in benefits for having a child a year after you just had one is nuts. Being allowed to spend money on luxury, or "sin", items is nuts. Being able to go to a warehouse club to buy all of the supplies to do a weekend fish fry so you can pocket the proceeds is nuts. This is the kind of thing I'd like to see stopped. There are far too many people with no integrity and who will abuse what should be seen as help, not an entitlement.
We don't hear the stories about the mom with 3 kids, husband was killed ina car wreck. We don't hear how she busted her tail to get off of assistance as a matter of pride, if nothing else. We DO hear about the abuses that are constantly happening and it sours many of us on the whole program especially when there are people out there who need the help and some "welfare queen" is squandering her monthly check on junk.
We hear politicians and bureaucrats talk about how they'll fix everything, then do nothing. We've got people who acknowledge the problem but refuse to address it for political reasons. This isn't an attack on a particular party, so please don't go there. Maybe we need to be mad at the people who continue to allow these problems to exist rather than the people who take advantage of the loopholes.
And that is no excuse to try and punish those who are not scamming the system.
The average TNAF is about 500/month and FS about the same for a family of 4. Personally, I don't sweat what they do with that because they have to live the entire month on $1000 and if they squander it they will pay the consequences.
The burden should be placed on the department to weed out fraud. If they cant manage that how do you think they will manage forced BC and drug testing? Even with all that in place there will always be a % of fraud.
The system will itself by simply running out of money. Up to then it will get uglier.
Hence the effort by the Democrats to make it as easy as possible to garner the vote of welfare recipients with online voting.
Much more helpful would be programs to send welfare recipients on some kind of mandatory peace corps missions to Third World nations. Those oppressed, impoverished people would teach our brood to appreciate what they enjoy here in the USA.
So poor people should not be allowed to have and raise children? If that had been the law 100 years ago, I suspect most of us would not be here today.
100 years ago poor people didn't have a welfare system to leech off.
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