News, Cape woman living "off the grid" challenged by city (solar, environment)

[canadian citizen]

Open D.

Thanks for doing the digging. to find out the facts about this woman. Citing actual news sources and criminal court files, is way better than speculation, isn't it ?

She has been exposed as a scammer , and a cheat. She gets no sympathy from me, and probably most other sane people would agree with me. People don't get probation, for TEN years, for a minor crime. Do they ?

Jim B.

Toronto.

[Ted Bear]

This woman, who appears to be a dirt bag, aside....the situation raises some interesting issues which a prior poster suggested ought to be dealt with in a balanced manner.

It all sounds good, living off the gird.

Electricity? Put up some solar panels and a few batteries and it really doesn't impact anyone, except maybe how to dispose of the batteries when they die every few years. Sell the excess juice back to the utility...well, that sounds wonderful, but then you should 'fairly' pay for the wires over which your 'product' is transmitted, shouldn't you?

Water? Sure, catch what comes off the roof, filter it, and use it to your hearts content. And when your house catches on fire, you will understand that because your community didn't want public water, there are no fire hydrants so there is no water to extinguish your blaze.

Heat? Nat Gas? No problem...throw a few logs on the fire. But understand that it means you have to cut the wood, transport it, store it, dry it, split it, and dispose of the ashes--and garbage man/landfill is not an option because, remember, you have disdained those 'public' services.

Sewer...there are a number of composting options, and as long as your stench doesn't spread to the neighbors, who is to care? No smell, no rats, no putrid piles of composted waste. Fertilize your garden with it....but don't ask for public help when you get sick from a small portion of bacteria which didn't break down completely.

We live in a modern society. It is simply not feasible for all of us to have our own utility systems when we live 25 feet apart. That's why we 'invented' utility companies to share the production and delivery of electricity, gas, water sewage and electronic connections. I am all for self sufficiency, and lord knows, I have no special place in my heart for big brother, but we need to be sensible in our solutions.

Opt out? Fine. But understand that doesn't mean you are screwing the pooch. It means you are sacrificing long term health and well being to save a few bucks in the short term.

[MissingAll4Seasons]

Regardless of the personal facts in this individual case, I do know that many municipal codes are archaic and enforce conventional systems only. It's nearly impossible to get a permit for any alternative system... they just won't look at it, period.

I personally think this is a jurisdiction violation and misuse of authority, at the very least a misinterpretation of charter and purvue. The health dept and building dept should be setting sanitation and safety standards and determining that those are met, NOT dictating how and what we should build and with what systems. Yes, it's easier for officials and inspectors to mandate stick framing with grid connections and adherence to national building code, but they should still be obligated to review submitted alternative system designs and approve them if/when concerns have been addressed. Yes, this means that someone actually has to do some workand a few calculations, or at the very least do some research and learn something so they understand the engineering principles they are being presented.

I don't care if a utility is provided by the state or a private company; if I have a system design for my personal property that allows me to safely circumvent the use of that utility, no one should be allowed to force me to make use of it or penalize me for not using it.

[Mack Knife]

Originally Posted by canadian citizen

Open D.

Thanks for doing the digging. to find out the facts about this woman. Citing actual news sources and criminal court files, is way better than speculation, isn't it ?

She has been exposed as a scammer , and a cheat. She gets no sympathy from me, and probably most other sane people would agree with me. People don't get probation, for TEN years, for a minor crime. Do they ?

Jim B.

Toronto.

Focusing on the individual instead of the issue is what the uninformed do. The issues brought up aren't about the woman but if there is a right to live "off-grid". That seems to have passed Moderator cut: other postersby at supersonic speed.

Indeed, that seems to be a common theme, disregard the rights of the many because one person was less than stellar in their living.

There are scammers in the green industry galore, shall we then say no one should be allowed to use alternative energy systems because there are scammers? That is the logic being presented.

[DCforever]

Originally Posted by Mack Knife

Focusing on the individual instead of the issue is what the uninformed do. The issues brought up aren't about the woman but if there is a right to live "off-grid". That seems to have passed Moderator cut: other posters by at supersonic speed.

Indeed, that seems to be a common theme, disregard the rights of the many because one person was less than stellar in their living.

There are scammers in the green industry galore, shall we then say no one should be allowed to use alternative energy systems because there are scammers? That is the logic being presented.

Strawman alert

[Mack Knife]

Originally Posted by DCforever

Strawman alert

Really, the 2nd post brought up this very question. After that, it became the woman as an individual instead of the larger and more appropriate focus of this thread.

Now, back to the real question this topic raised.

[DCforever]

Originally Posted by Mack Knife

Really, the 2nd post brought up this very question. After that, it became the woman as an individual instead of the larger and more appropriate focus of this thread.

Now, back to the real question this topic raised.

We get it. You're opposed to health and safety codes. Cities have a right to exclude dwellings that pose a risk to others.

[Dakster]

Missingall4seasons - Actually, our building codes down here in South Florida are some of the strictest in the nation. Key West is the most strict followed by Miami-Dade County, which most of the other counties in Florida have also adopted. At one point is was so strict for windows, that no one could pass the test. A window company built a CBS concrete filled wall that also failed the test. The code was lessened. My point is basically, if you pay a large fee and get tested your design is OK. (At least in Dade, I can't speak for the Cape Coral area) Every time I do work I have to submit engineering specs that show the house is up to code.

My opinion: Should she be allowed to live off grid - Yes, assuming she isn't harming anyone else by doing so. Now, her scamming, if true, is another SEPARATE issue.

I'll give an example on something that happened to me, after Hurricane ravaged Dade in 2005, I had a lot of damage to my house. One of which was the pool patio enclosure, which I had to remove so it wouldn't fall down on someone unexpectedly. I got a "legal" shed and pulled a permit for it, had it installed to code. They wouldn't sign it, because I was unable to get someone to erect a pool fence and my temporary construction barrier fence was obviously not to code. Ended up having to write a letter to the Village Mayor and he agreed that the inspector is only there to inspect the shed, if it is to code he needs to sign off on it. The pool fence part was another issue and should have no bearing on the shed. I did get a pool fence put up shortly after this was all done. It's when 300,000 people need one - you can't exactly expect service in a business day.

[OpenD]

Originally Posted by Dakster

My opinion: Should she be allowed to live off grid - Yes, assuming she isn't harming anyone else by doing so.

This is the essence of the real issue, yes, and according to the Orlando Sentinel the city is willing to allow her to continue with what she is doing if she can prove she is doing no harm. And that comes down to the question of sanitation, and her use of the sewer system to dispose of her waste without paying for it, since the sewer charge is coupled to the water bill, as it is in most cities. What the judge ordered is that she open an account for water service, so that she pays at least a minimum charge for using the sewer.

The background of this story even further removes it from the David & Goliath scenario many journalists initially cast it as. In the height of the foreclosure storm, Cape Coral ran in the top three cities for a long time. As a result it has a lot of vacant properties, and squatting has become an issue. The city has responded by relying on City Codes dating back to the 1960s to remove people from "uninhabitable" buildings that have no utility services.

But the city's response to violations is complaint driven. They don't have personnel out cruising the city looking for whomever they can find to drop the hammer on. Apparently they didn't even investigate this property after Ms. Speronis's utilities were disconnected for non-payment. But they finally checked her out after numerous complaints from neighbors, including 6 separate visits from Animal Control on complaints of animal abuse.

And that's when she contacted the TV station to tell her "Poor Me" story, in an obvious attempt to try to garner public sympathy and thus gain leverage with the city. Only now she's rapidly losing that favorable public opinion as her extensive record of scamming and manipulation, and the fact that she may not even have a valid claim to the property come out.

City codes serve many valid purposes, including protecting public health and safety, and also preserving property values. A friend of mine in another city is tearing his hair out right now trying to get code enforcement to act on a foreclosed house next to his, which first had squatters who trashed the place, then was boarded up and left to rot 2 years ago. He figures it to be an obvious fire hazard, as well as an eyesore, and considers that it knocks the value of his house down by $50K or more. He wishes his city was even a little bit more like Cape Coral in this regard.

Yes, of course city codes need to be updated to encompass technology updates like solar panels, that were not even a foreseeable option when the codes were first written. But there are acceptable ways in a democratic society to effect change, and ways that are not. Defying local codes, and then manufacturing a bogus whitewash story as an excuse for doing so is not acceptable. Her neighbors have rights too.

[arctichomesteader]

The only effective means of eliminating bad laws like "codes" that only serve to chain people to the system is for large numbers of people to ignore them.