Low Vitamin D (sore, swelling, cramping, physician)
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you said 5,000, you dont need a prescription for that because its not that high the dosage
Vitamin D2 requires a prescription, vitamin D3 does not require a prescription; the dosage amount does not have to do with the prescription requirement.
How do you know that you have been deficient for a while? Were you tested? I ask because the test for vitamin D is usually not given when blood is taken at regular check-ups, unless the doctor requests it. I was going for regular check-ups every six months for about three years, with blood taken at every check-up, and they never tested for vitamin D until I requested it because it was suggested by a natural MD I was also seeing.
I was found to be severely deficient for vitamin D. I was a 15 on a 100 scale; one should be between 65 and 75. The doctor immediately wrote me a prescription for highly concentrated pills of 50,000 units each of D2, and advised me to take one per week for the next four weeks. I then went back to the other doctor I was seeing, a natural MD, who immediately criticized the other doctor. He told me that that is the worst way to take vitamin D because D2 is not absorbed easily and the amount of it in your system over a week will look like a downhill ski slope. He said that over the counter D3 is the better way to go and suggested that I take 5,000 units per day to keep the amount in my system constant, not fluctuating. Vitamin D3 is inexpensive and can be purchased at any vitamin shop. You can also get vitamin D3 tablets or capsules with vitamin K added to help absorption.
I was not given a reason for the deficiency other than it is normal for people at these latitudes to be vitamin D deficient.
Vitamin D2 requires a prescription, vitamin D3 does not require a prescription; the dosage amount does not have to do with the prescription requirement.
How do you know that you have been deficient for a while? Were you tested? I ask because the test for vitamin D is usually not given when blood is taken at regular check-ups, unless the doctor requests it. I was going for regular check-ups every six months for about three years, with blood taken at every check-up, and they never tested for vitamin D until I requested it because it was suggested by a natural MD I was also seeing.
I was found to be severely deficient for vitamin D. I was a 15 on a 100 scale; one should be between 65 and 75. The doctor immediately wrote me a prescription for highly concentrated pills of 50,000 units each of D2, and advised me to take one per week for the next four weeks. I then went back to the other doctor I was seeing, a natural MD, who immediately criticized the other doctor. He told me that that is the worst way to take vitamin D because D2 is not absorbed easily and the amount of it in your system over a week will look like a downhill ski slope. He said that over the counter D3 is the better way to go and suggested that I take 5,000 units per day to keep the amount in my system constant, not fluctuating. Vitamin D3 is inexpensive and can be purchased at any vitamin shop. You can also get vitamin D3 tablets or capsules with vitamin K added to help absorption.
I was not given a reason for the deficiency other than it is normal for people at these latitudes to be vitamin D deficient.
I asked them to do it because I started having pain in late September when just standing on my quads and other parts of my leg just by standing sometimes so I went to an orthopedic doctor and then went to physical therapy and when I was there he used a tens unit and gave me stretches to do which helped some but the pain was always there. Then he told me to get my calcium, magnesium and potassium checked. I am going to test what I was given first. This doctor told he himself has a vitamin D deficiency and he takes vitamin d2 and it helps him. It's not like he is a brainless doctor that doesn't know what he is doing. He himself has the same exact condition and vitamin d2 is what he takes. His ratings are
4.9 out of 5 (2159 Ratings, 596 Comments) and he has been working at that same location since 1986. That means I was 2 when he started working there. Who am I to question him what he gave me? I did left a message to the nurse about it though. I didn't even know what vitamin D was before I was tested for it, only until after I saw I had it low then I checked it out. Many doctors give Vitamin D2 with the same dosage to others and it helps. Doctors get pissed off I noticed from the past when you start questioning them too much like you are disrespecting their intelligence. Every single time I've done this in the past it didn't turn out well after that. And as I said before, Vitamin D3 contains animal product. VITAMIN D3 CONTAINS ANIMAL PRODUCT. I don't want animal product.
Last edited by KillerInstinct; 02-16-2017 at 05:46 AM..
That's really interesting. There might be a few things going on.
First off, too much UV can actually destroy Vitamin D/pre-vitamin D in the skin. This is why a base tan is crucial to vitamin D production in high-light environments.
Second, it takes a while for it to absorb into your skin. You could be washing it off before it has a chance to enter your dermal capillary bed.
Third, it could be some other problem with Vitamin D metabolism, like low vitamin D-binding protein. For whatever reason.
No wonder you're deficient! Stop avoiding sun, you both tolerate and need it more than whiter people do. If you want to avoid sun because you're afraid you'll become *gasp* the skin color you were born to be, and don't want to take D3 because you're vegan, then you should expect nothing more than poor health.
You can "wash off" sunshine? Tell me - how long does it take to absorb?
That's really interesting. There might be a few things going on.
First off, too much UV can actually destroy Vitamin D/pre-vitamin D in the skin. This is why a base tan is crucial to vitamin D production in high-light environments.
Second, it takes a while for it to absorb into your skin. You could be washing it off before it has a chance to enter your dermal capillary bed.
Third, it could be some other problem with Vitamin D metabolism, like low vitamin D-binding protein. For whatever reason.
No wonder you're deficient! Stop avoiding sun, you both tolerate and need it more than whiter people do. If you want to avoid sun because you're afraid you'll become *gasp* the skin color you were born to be, and don't want to take D3 because you're vegan, then you should expect nothing more than poor health.
Really? I'll have to research this because I am extremely fair and to get a "base tan" would require me to get burned/fried probably 5 times. I stupidly did that as a teenager many times over but now since my 40's and getting multiple BCCs I will NEVER get a sunburn again. So, if 15 minutes at a time (sans base tan) won't do it, too bad - that's why I take supplements. If I go outside for other than incidental errand-running I use SPF50.
Helmer AC, Jensen CH: Vitamin D precursors removed from the skin by washing. Studies Inst Divi Thomae 1937, 1:207-216.
Humans make some vitamin D on the surface of their skin, which water washes off. How much humans make on the surface and how much inside the skin, no one knows. However, the vitamin D levels of the African tribesmen support (but do not prove) the proposition that humans living in a natural state make a significant proportion of vitamin D on the surface of their skin for later absorption.
Assuming the African hunter-gatherers do not take showers twice a day that so many cosmetically brainwashed Americans do, then simple water, especially soapy water, routinely washes off oils containing vitamin D in modern humans. This means we must add soap and frequent showering to the list of things that explain why modern vitamin D levels continue to decline, decade after decade.
Helmer AC, Jensen CH: Vitamin D precursors removed from the skin by washing. Studies Inst Divi Thomae 1937, 1:207-216.
Humans make some vitamin D on the surface of their skin, which water washes off. How much humans make on the surface and how much inside the skin, no one knows. However, the vitamin D levels of the African tribesmen support (but do not prove) the proposition that humans living in a natural state make a significant proportion of vitamin D on the surface of their skin for later absorption.
Assuming the African hunter-gatherers do not take showers twice a day that so many cosmetically brainwashed Americans do, then simple water, especially soapy water, routinely washes off oils containing vitamin D in modern humans. This means we must add soap and frequent showering to the list of things that explain why modern vitamin D levels continue to decline, decade after decade.
1937? Nothing more recent than that as a replication or to dispute?
"During exposure to sunlight solar radiation with wavelengths of 290–315 nm penetrate into the skin and are absorbed by proteins, DNA and RNA as well as 7-dehydrocholesterol.1,2 Most of this UVB radiation is absorbed in the epidermis and as a result when exposed to sunlight most of the vitamin D3 that is produced in the skin is made in the living cells in the epidermis. This is the reason why after exposure to sunlight vitamin D3 remains in the skin even when the skin is washed with soap and water immediately after the exposure to sunlight."
1937? Nothing more recent than that as a replication or to dispute?
Did you look at the link? I couldn't repost the whole thing. The article was written in 2012, and this section from near the beginning is relevant:
Quote:
The recent [2007] Netherlands paper on “natural” vitamin D levels in Africa immediately brought to my mind another paper, a similar attempt to gather this vital information.
Why would light-skinned sun-drenched outdoor sport enthusiasts in Hawaii have an average level of 30 ng/ml, while very dark-skinned hunter-gatherers in Africa have levels of 50 ng/ml?
(He proceeds to argue that sunscreen use, genetics, and latitude are not adequate explanations).
Quote:
The only other possibility I can think of is an obscure paper from 1937, a paper that continues to be ignored. ...The authors concluded, “The evidence presented in the two groups of experiments indicates that washing the human skin by the usual methods removes vitamin D and its precursors from the outer layer of the skin.”
What explanation do the authors of your 2013 paper give for the differing vitamin D levels between the light-skinned surfers and dark-skinned Africans, which apparently still existed in 2007? (No, I haven't read the link.) :P
Did you look at the link? I couldn't repost the whole thing. The article was written in 2012, and this section from near the beginning is relevant:
(He proceeds to argue that sunscreen use, genetics, and latitude are not adequate explanations).
What explanation do the authors of your 2013 paper give for the differing vitamin D levels between the light-skinned surfers and dark-skinned Africans, which apparently still existed in 2007? (No, I haven't read the link.) :P
I don't think the 1937 paper was a true test (a direct comparison) - so those were separate populations that were compared in their own environments - there could have been many other things acting on them that could have differed. I'm not sure I can find the original research from 1937. All the "explanations" are pure supposition based on logic but not supported by a well-controlled experiment.
Hmm, you might be right Reneeh. Although I can't track down the direct experimental source for that statement. It appears that it might be in citation 25, which I don't have access to.
Can all of these cholesterol-related, fat soluble substances pass through the epidermis between the blood and the outside of the skin? And if so, is this process passive or active, and does it go both ways? This sort of thing is really hard to pin down. I know anecdotally that fats can really soften my skin, and oils rubbed on me become significantly less greasy after a short time. And it looks like various sterols (even foreign plant sterols) can be excreted from the body, although this is probably active: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC292362/
I guess it's possible that SOME of the vitamin D can be washed off via skin oils, while most stay in the epidermis and go to the blood. But I have no idea, and that doesn't seem like it would explain low Vitamin D in sun-drenched populations anyway.
And it also looks like I was (sorta) wrong about Vitamin D being destroyed by sunlight:
Quote:
During exposure to sunlight after previtamin D3 is produced it will absorb solar UVB radiation and isomerize into two major photoproducts, lumisterol3 and tachysterol3. Neither of these two photoproducts has any effect on calcium metabolism.32 Thus when the skin is exposed to sunlight it can only convert approximately 15% of 7-dehydrocholesterol to previtamin D3. Any further exposure will result in a photoequilibrium whereby previtamin D3 is converted into lumisterol3 and tachysterol3 as well as revert back to 7-dehydrocholesterol.
So it looks like it just hits a ceiling where it converts to metabolites, and the reactions can actually go back and forth. I disagree with their position that it's "biologically inactive" as they put it. It might be, but it might have other effects unrelated to calcium metabolism.
Anyways, here's an unfounded hypothesis. Maybe vitamin D status is lowered by the body on purpose in chronic illness, due to some protective effect. It might seem maladaptive, but maybe not.
Another hypothesis: some of us have evolved to have a lower optimal reference range of vitamin D
The reason why my dermatologist told me to avoid the sun is that I get sunburn easily and to avoid more wrinkles. All the sunscreen I used turns my skin red and it itches even sunscreen for sensitive skin and even sunscreen for babies. My siblings were always much lighter than me, we moved to a state in the south and now they are way darker than me, like the same color native americans are. I dont want to be that color. I just try to keep the original skin color I was back in New York. I was lighter there but my face and neck are darker now. My arms and the rest of my skin are the same.
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