Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
What the Soviets did, what other Allied soldiers did - that's absolutely
irrelevant when it comes to discussing what Nazis did.
Just tell my why it is irrelevant. It is relevant. The Soviet regime killed many more people than Hitler is accused of killing. Stalin killed about 30 million or so. That's not relevant? Don't tell me that Hitler's supposed killing was worse because it wasn't. Not only that but historical revisionists are questioning just how much killing Hitler really did and it seems like the winners writings of history is adding millions when there only thousands.
While fighting for victory the German soldier will observe the rules of chivalrous warfare. Cruelties and senseless destruction are below his standard.
Combatants will be in uniform or will wear specially introduced and clearly distinguishable badges. Fighting in plain clothes or without such badges is prohibited.
No enemy who has surrendered will be killed, including partisans and spies. They will be duly punished by courts.
P.O.W. will not be ill-treated or insulted. While arms, maps, and records are to be taken away from them, their personal belongings will not be touched.
Dum-Dum bullets are prohibited; also no other bullets may be transformed into Dum-Dum.
Red Cross Institutions are sacrosanct. Injured enemies are to be treated in a humane way. Medical personnel and army chaplains may not be hindered in the execution of their medical, or clerical activities.
The civilian population is sacrosanct. No looting nor wanton destruction is permitted to the soldier. Landmarks of historical value or buildings serving religious purposes, art, science, or charity are to be especially respected. Deliveries in kind made, as well as services rendered by the population, may only be claimed if ordered by superiors and only against compensation.
Neutral territory will never be entered nor passed over by planes, nor shot at; it will not be the object of warlike activities of any kind.
If a German soldier is made a prisoner of war he will tell his name and rank if he is asked for it. Under no circumstances will he reveal to which unit he belongs, nor will he give any information about German military, political, and economic conditions. Neither promises nor threats may induce him to do so.
Offenses against the a/m matters of duty will be punished. Enemy offenses against the principles under 1 to 8 are to be reported. Reprisals are only permissible on order of higher commands.
Is it really necessary for me to delineate how each and every commandment was ignored by the SS?
Ok, the SS got the message about Dum-Dum bullets but obviously not much else.
The SS were not part of the German Heer (Army) or the Wehrmacht (i.e. War Machine) ( it included all German forces, Kreigsmarine, Luftwaffe and Heer). The SS was more like the Roman Pretorian Guard (personal enforcers and body guard for the Emperor). So military law or tradition didn't apply to the SS.
Of course, invading neutral territory was an integral part of German strategy in WWI and WWII. If German soldiers took this "commandment" literally, they would have been shot for disobeying orders.
Partisans were summarily killed. Suspected or proven. This dates from the Frano-Prussian was and extends through WWII. And if a village did not identify and turn over suspected franctiruers, it would be burned and all its male inhabitants shot.
Location: West Los Angeles and Rancho Palos Verdes
13,583 posts, read 15,664,868 times
Reputation: 14049
Quote:
Originally Posted by Troyfan
Of course, invading neutral territory was an integral part of German strategy in WWI and WWII.
The same can be said of Germany's neighbors. Take France's actions after WWI, for example, in southwest Germany, where they attempted to enslave Germans in order to faster collect Germany's war debt.
The same can be said of Germany's neighbors. Take France's actions after WWI, for example, in southwest Germany, where they attempted to enslave Germans in order to faster collect Germany's war debt.
Germany did the same thing in 1871. It troops stayed in France until reparations were paid. War debts had to be paid off in one way or another. Until WWI. And now that they don't have to be paid off, war is free and we have a lot of it.
I realize this is WW2 but one branch of my family was Belgian, and lived there during the German occupation of WW1. My grandmother was their daughter who was told by them they did very good business with the Germans during that time and had nothing bad to say about them.
They moved to America shortly after the war ended when business got slow after the Germans withdrew.
I realize this is WW2 but one branch of my family was Belgian, and lived there during the German occupation of WW1. My grandmother was their daughter who was told by them they did very good business with the Germans during that time and had nothing bad to say about them.
They moved to America shortly after the war ended when business got slow after the Germans withdrew.
I believe that. Once the invasion had made it way into France, the Belgians and Germans probably did get along OK. But while the Belgian army was fighting the Germans, it was different. Civilians thought to be shooting at German troops were shot. No trial. German soldiers used Belgian civilians for a human shield in an attack on one town.
It was pretty brutal and I'm sure some Belgian civilians did indeed shoot at German troops. But this BS about trials for partisans is nonsense.
Same in 1870. France invaded Germany but had to withdraw. Germany invaded France and was pretty good with the population. They gave IOUs for food, fodder, etc. Didn't bother the women. Not like the Napoleonic wars.
But as the German invasion progressed, French civilians out of uniform fought them. When they were caught, they were shot.
That's the way of war. The uniform identifies a man as a combatant. He is allowed and expected to fight the enemy. If he's captured, he becomes a POW to be released at war's end or in an exchange. Officers can be paroled in they promise not to fight for the duration.
Civilians can't fight. In return, soldiers are supposed to leave them alone. If a civilian fights, he's broken the rules and has lost the protection of military convention. The reason for this is to prevent the wholesale extermination of populations that was common in earlier times.
I believe that. Once the invasion had made it way into France, the Belgians and Germans probably did get along OK. But while the Belgian army was fighting the Germans, it was different. Civilians thought to be shooting at German troops were shot. No trial. German soldiers used Belgian civilians for a human shield in an attack on one town.
It was pretty brutal and I'm sure some Belgian civilians did indeed shoot at German troops. But this BS about trials for partisans is nonsense.
Same in 1870. France invaded Germany but had to withdraw. Germany invaded France and was pretty good with the population. They gave IOUs for food, fodder, etc. Didn't bother the women. Not like the Napoleonic wars.
But as the German invasion progressed, French civilians out of uniform fought them. When they were caught, they were shot.
That's the way of war. The uniform identifies a man as a combatant. He is allowed and expected to fight the enemy. If he's captured, he becomes a POW to be released at war's end or in an exchange. Officers can be paroled in they promise not to fight for the duration.
Civilians can't fight. In return, soldiers are supposed to leave them alone. If a civilian fights, he's broken the rules and has lost the protection of military convention. The reason for this is to prevent the wholesale extermination of populations that was common in earlier times.
They were German speakers, which likely had helped them. My grandmother was born a few years after they came to America so she only got it all second-hand much later.
Location: West Los Angeles and Rancho Palos Verdes
13,583 posts, read 15,664,868 times
Reputation: 14049
Quote:
Originally Posted by Troyfan
Germany did the same thing in 1871. It troops stayed in France until reparations were paid. War debts had to be paid off in one way or another. Until WWI. And now that they don't have to be paid off, war is free and we have a lot of it.
My original point was that, despite common beliefs, it's not like all non-German Europeans were sitting on their hands minding their own business, when suddenly Germany decided to pick on all her neighbors without provocation in 1939.
My original point was that, despite common beliefs, it's not like all non-German Europeans were sitting on their hands minding their own business, when suddenly Germany decided to pick on all her neighbors without provocation in 1939.
True and especially true of Germanys invasion of Russia. When Germany and Russia signed there non aggression pact the Soviets had 63 divisions on the border of Germans border. When Hitler invaded the Soviets the Soviets had 158 divisions with thousands of tanks and airfields in place and there army in offensive formation for an invasion of Germany. Even one of Stalins top generals admits that the Soviets were 2 weeks away from an offensive into the west. So Hitler got the jump on the Soviets which he had to do for Germany to survive.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
