Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Well, it appears that Huntsville City is taking your words to heart. They are working hard to make "mixed" communities.
I suppose it is probably the right thing to do.
Housing Projects just make for blighted and economically depressed areas of town. Look at Hwy 72 down near Costco by the Projects. Nobody is going to build a nice store or restaurant anywhere near there because it looks so depressing.
Not only that, but Projects probably encourage a cycle of poverty because the people who live there grow accustomed to that. Children grow up in that environment believing that is what is "normal".
It would probably be cheaper and have better social outcomes to give vouchers to the tenants of those projects to live almost anywhere else in Huntsville. By distributing the poor among the wealthy you eliminate the blighted areas and you also provide an opportunity for people to learn by example of how to conduct yourself as a middle-class person.
Of course everyone is NIMBY about it and I can't blame them. We live in a nice neighborhood with quarter-million-dollar houses and we have 2 houses in the neighborhood with lowlifes where the police are routinely visiting about drugs.
Ultimately, the people with money will leave to avoid crime.
Well, it appears that Huntsville City is taking your words to heart. They are working hard to make "mixed" communities.
I suppose it is probably the right thing to do.
Housing Projects just make for blighted and economically depressed areas of town. Look at Hwy 72 down near Costco by the Projects. Nobody is going to build a nice store or restaurant anywhere near there because it looks so depressing.
Not only that, but Projects probably encourage a cycle of poverty because the people who live there grow accustomed to that. Children grow up in that environment believing that is what is "normal".
It would probably be cheaper and have better social outcomes to give vouchers to the tenants of those projects to live almost anywhere else in Huntsville. By distributing the poor among the wealthy you eliminate the blighted areas and you also provide an opportunity for people to learn by example of how to conduct yourself as a middle-class person.
Of course everyone is NIMBY about it and I can't blame them. We live in a nice neighborhood with quarter-million-dollar houses and we have 2 houses in the neighborhood with lowlifes where the police are routinely visiting about drugs.
Ultimately, the people with money will leave to avoid crime.
No, it's not the right thing to do. I don't want to be elitist, but why take nice, expensive neighborhoods and turn them into something less? It's not fair to the vast majority of homeowners. You're right about the projects - it tends to breed complacency if the government will pay for their housing. In some cases it's necessary (elderly, disabled, etc.) but I suspect that's only a minority of cases.
Well, it appears that Huntsville City is taking your words to heart. They are work
ing hard to make "mixed" communities.
I suppose it is probably the right thing to do.
Housing Projects just make for blighted and economically depressed areas of town. Look at Hwy 72 down near Costco by the Projects. Nobody is going to build a nice store or restaurant anywhere near there because it looks so depressing.
Not only that, but Projects probably encourage a cycle of poverty because the people who live there grow accustomed to that. Children grow up in that environment believing that is what is "normal".
It would probably be cheaper and have better social outcomes to give vouchers to the tenants of those projects to live almost anywhere else in Huntsville. By distributing the poor among the wealthy you eliminate the blighted areas and you also provide an opportunity for people to learn by example of how to conduct yourself as a middle-class person.
Of course everyone is NIMBY about it and I can't blame them. We live in a nice neighborhood with quarter-million-dollar houses and we have 2 houses in the neighborhood with lowlifes where the police are routinely visiting about drugs.
Ultimately, the people with money will leave to avoid crime.
Agreed. I understand its a double edged sword, but people greatly benefit by being exposed to a diverse environment.
Well, it appears that Huntsville City is taking your words to heart. They are working hard to make "mixed" communities.
I suppose it is probably the right thing to do.
Housing Projects just make for blighted and economically depressed areas of town. Look at Hwy 72 down near Costco by the Projects. Nobody is going to build a nice store or restaurant anywhere near there because it looks so depressing.
Not only that, but Projects probably encourage a cycle of poverty because the people who live there grow accustomed to that. Children grow up in that environment believing that is what is "normal".
It would probably be cheaper and have better social outcomes to give vouchers to the tenants of those projects to live almost anywhere else in Huntsville. By distributing the poor among the wealthy you eliminate the blighted areas and you also provide an opportunity for people to learn by example of how to conduct yourself as a middle-class person.
Of course everyone is NIMBY about it and I can't blame them. We live in a nice neighborhood with quarter-million-dollar houses and we have 2 houses in the neighborhood with lowlifes where the police are routinely visiting about drugs.
Ultimately, the people with money will leave to avoid crime.
You must be new to Huntsville, because the City has had "mixed income" areas for decades and it hasn't improved the test scores of the students from public housing. Huntsville's wealthiest residents were within a stones throw of the poorest when there was public housing just across the creek from the mansions of Twickenham in Downtown Huntsville. I'm not sure that the residents who lived in the public housing were "inspired" for better when they could easily walk down Franklin St. and Adams St. and see successful people.
The public housing was on both sides of Gallatin Street running along St. Clair Avenue down to the nursing home (behind First Baptist Church). The kids who lived there attended the same public schools as the kids in the mansions of Twickenham and also the nearby high income Blossomwood area. If being in such a mixed income area was so beneficial to the poorer kids, why did the City tear down the public housing and redevelop it with the Publix and high rent apartments.
Even today, there are large areas of the Huntsville High School district (west of the Parkway, south of Oakwood extending west to the campus of UAH) where the homes sell for barely more than $100 K, (if that much) and I am curious if the kids from such neighborhoods, are benefitting from being under the same roof as the wealthy when it comes to their education.
No, it's not the right thing to do. I don't want to be elitist, but why take nice, expensive neighborhoods and turn them into something less? It's not fair to the vast majority of homeowners.
Well, I explained why. When you create ghettos, it creates economically-barren areas of town. Drive down 72 near Costco to see what I'm talking about. And, like I said, ghettos propagate a ghetto lifestyle and normalizes poverty expectations for the people who grow up in them.
Quote:
You must be new to Huntsville, because the City has had "mixed income" areas for decades and it hasn't improved the test scores of the students from public housing. Huntsville's wealthiest residents were within a stones throw of the poorest when there was public housing just across the creek from the mansions of Twickenham in Downtown Huntsville. I'm not sure that the residents who lived in the public housing were "inspired" for better when they could easily walk down Franklin St. and Adams St. and see successful people.
Been here since 2007. So 13 years now. My kids go to Providence and Williams. Mostly poor kids - everyone gets free food there now because of it. These kids are still growing up in public housing, and all of the rich people have bailed from HCS so they aren't exposed to many in school, either. Now if those poor kids were growing up in Twickenham, maybe they would have a different outlook on expectations.
Quote:
Even today, there are large areas of the Huntsville High School district (west of the Parkway, south of Oakwood extending west to the campus of UAH) where the homes sell for barely more than $100 K, (if that much) and I am curious if the kids from such neighborhoods, are benefitting from being under the same roof as the wealthy when it comes to their education.
It's for sure if you dump them in ghettos and schools that feed from ghettos you will propagate a ghetto lifestyle. Maybe they won't benefit from rubbing elbows with wealthier people but they sure won't by being stuck in ghettos. And it sucks for the rest of us because you end up with ghettos.
Agreed. I understand its a double edged sword, but people greatly benefit by being exposed to a diverse environment.
Is there any evidence to support this statement? If the claim is that a "lesser" person will improve by exposure to a "better" people isn't it also true the "better" people will conversely get worse by exposure to the "lesser" people?"
Living here in Madison City is wonderful in many aspects. What was once a small quite easy-going place with plenty of open spaces is now strip malls and stores everywhere. Houses everywhere cookie-cutter houses subdivisions that are overpriced and It's a very nice looking city. I do love living here thou, except for the traffic. One of the main reasons I moved away from Huntsville was traffic and OMG now the traffic is bumper to bumper everyday.
The fact that the home builders own workers are even sharing the truths. The Homeowners want to raise the price of the homes in the areas so that they will keep the lower middle class out of the city. These homeowners want to price everyone out.
What the right thing to do would be is to build areas where families could buy homes that were not so expensive. Build more nice apartment complexes that are affordable for the poor and get rid of the nasty looking blight ones that hide those that don't belong here, committing the crime and those that deserve better living conditions for what they pay. The low income deserves the ability to homeownership too.
I believe turning this city into a super upper-middle only is wrong. If you want it that way that sounds racist, classist, and just small-minded. People do not want to drive a long distance for work and you need the people to work in your stores that you want.
Beware, you are being tricked into believing something that isn't true.
There is no such thing as homeowners "trying to raise the price of homes in the area to keep the lower middle class out of the city and price everyone out". That is a conspiracy theory, it's what people say who look at their neighbor and is jealous, and then says bad things about their neighbor because they are jealous.
The truth, is that the Madison City School system is one of the very best around. Huntsville is a city with a highly educated population - the people here care about education, for both themselves, and their kids. That means that people are willing to pay more money for a house that is in an area where the schools are good.
If you build the exact same house (or apartment) in Huntsville City and in Madison City, you will have more people interested in buying the house in Madison City, and willing to pay a much higher price for it. Because of the schools. The fact that people are willing to pay a higher price for the house just because it is in Madison City means that home values in Madison City are higher. Because people are willing to pay more for them. So the house in Madison City will sell for higher than the one in Huntsville City, even though they are exactly the same.
It's not a conspiracy. No one is trying to drive anyone out. No one is being classist, or racist, or small minded. Its just that people are willing to pay more to live there so their kids get a good education.
In fact, it's folks who look at the home owners in Madison City and assume that they must be conspiring against poor people, it's those folks who are classist. YOU are the ones making unfair and untrue allegations about someone based on just their class. That's what being classist means.
I own a home in Madison City. I specifically bought a house here so my child could go to school here. I don't really care how much money my neighbor has, I only care that they care about their child's education. Because I want my child to go to school with other children who care about their education. Madison City has a high number of people who care about their kids education. So, I was willing to pay more for my house in order to live here. Which, in turn, drove up the housing price.
So I guess if there's a conspiracy, then it's not about "driving out poor people". That's ridiculous. It's about wanting our children to get good educations. Now, is that bad? I would hope that the desire to improve the education of the next generation of Americans is a good thing.
In fact, even if we did as you said and "built areas where families could buy homes that were not so expensive", those homes would still be much more expensive than the same home outside of Madison City. Because people will be willing to pay more for them. Your plan would not work. I'm sorry. It's just a fact of life that in areas where there are good schools, home prices will go up, and in order to live there, you will have to pay more. Paying more also increases the amount of taxes we pay, which increases the amount of money that goes to the schools. Which is fair. If they do a good job, then they should get more money, and if we expect good schools, then we should pay for it. You want your boss to pay you more money if you do an extra good job, right? And if your coworker doesn't work as hard as you, then you should get paid more than he, right? Same with schools. The good ones should get more tax money. It's only fair.
Just give out vouchers so that the project-dwellers can live in regular houses whatever the market sets the price of them to be.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
