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I know, riiiiight? Like, just jump through these excessive hoops please.
What excessive hoops are you babbling about?
She broke the law. It should be hard for her to get American citizenship after willfully continuing to violate our immigration laws.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockmadinejad
Letting people stay in this country because they are demonstrating clear social and economic value = NIGHTMARE WORLD THE SCOPE OF WHICH WE CANNOT FATHOM.
Good grief. Do you ever pick up a newspaper? Do you ever read any economic news at all?
From yesterday's New York Times in a column by Paul Krugman. You know. The guy with the Nobel prize in economics.
The bankers themselves have been bailed out, but the rest of the nation continues to suffer terribly, with long-term unemployment still at levels not seen since the Great Depression, with a whole cohort of young Americans graduating into an abysmal job market.
What economic value does someone campaigning for the Dream act bring? Why the hell do we need someone here believes that she ought to be rewarded because her parents broke our immigration laws? Or someone teaching when we're literally laying off teachers by the thousands? We sure as hell don't need lawyers from mediocre law schools, as I'm sure you're painfully aware.
This is ridiculous. Most of these people are not needed at all in America. We don't need lawyers, teachers or "activists" like Ms. Castillo who think she's adding to this country by demanding that ordinary Americans allow every single person in the world to come here and get American citizenship and access to the American welfare state.
We have a recession. We need to worry about the needs of American citizens rather than the economic desires of people who've voluntarily broken our laws.
FYI, this is what the guy with Nobel Prize in economics had to say about illegals:
I'm not going to cut and paste the column because basically the entire article simply backs up everything most posters in this forum have said about illegals: that they are bad economically for most Americans.
His case, that of the guy with the Nobel Prize in economics, is far more convincing than your self congratulatory, smug one liners.
Yeah like, education is a pretty good measure of those sorts of things. We use it all the time.
Your second sentence here is basically absurd.
While that may be, she is limited due to her status, thus your claim doesn't really work for her now does it, ya'know since she is limited in her employment and all. (she can change it provided she attains legal status) Even still, it is not a 100% guaranteed indicator that by having a degree she will actually contribute more than her social costs or that of her parents.
Absurd? She has only been out of college for 1 week. What's absurd is your claim she has socially and economically contributed anything as of yet. Surely you're not referring to her "internships".
While that may be, she is limited due to her status, thus your claim doesn't really work for her now does it, ya'know since she is limited in her employment and all. (she can change it provided she attains legal status) Even still, it is not a 100% guaranteed indicator that by having a degree she will actually contribute more than her social costs or that of her parents.
Absurd? She has only been out of college for 1 week. Whats absurd is your claim she has socially and economically contributed anything as of yet. Surely you're not referring to her "internships".
lol, is this a joke? I'm arguing that at the least, demonstrating certain educational achievement is a pretty good argument in favor of allowing her to work here. And your counter-argument is that she's NOT productive because of the very laws I'm opposing. UM YES GOOD POINT SIR.
BTW, internships are economically contributive in almost all instances. So is buying a bag of Doritos.
I literally loled at this. There is basically no chance that you read more financial news than I do, seriously.
BTW, Krugman isn't nearly as anti-immigration as anyone here is. Not even close.
Actually, Krugman states what everybody in here has stated:
Quote:
...many of the worst-off native-born Americans are hurt by immigration — especially immigration from Mexico. Because Mexican immigrants have much less education than the average U.S. worker, they increase the supply of less-skilled labor, driving down the wages of the worst-paid Americans. The most authoritative recent study of this effect, by George Borjas and Lawrence Katz of Harvard, estimates that U.S. high school dropouts would earn as much as 8 percent more if it weren't for Mexican immigration.That's why it's intellectually dishonest to say, as President Bush does, that immigrants do "jobs that Americans will not do." The willingness of Americans to do a job depends on how much that job pays — and the reason some jobs pay too little to attract native-born Americans is competition from poorly paid immigrants.
I literally loled at this. There is basically no chance that you read more financial news than I do, seriously.
BTW, Krugman isn't nearly as anti-immigration as anyone here is. Not even close.
We're still waiting for backup for your claims that we need lawyers from bad law schools, English teachers in a saturated teaching market and campaigners for that idiotic nonsense known as the dream act. I personally know two unemployed lawyers and an English teacher who subs because she can't find any work. Hell I know math and special education teachers -- normally the areas with the greatest teaching shortages -- who can't find work right now even in lousy school districts.
Krugman is about as anti-illegal as a paper funded by Carlos Slim (the world's richest man and Mexican national) is allowed to be at the New York Times. He still makes quite a few points that you have not bothered to refute because you can't.
BTW, illegals aren't immigrants. At best they are temporary residents with a highly limited set of rights that does not include the right to vote or gain direct access to our welfare system. It is insulting to conflate law abiding immigrants with arrogant people who brazenly flout our immigration laws and then shrilly demand we reward them for it.
And something I've even acknowledged. See, Krugman's point is that this might drive down wages for American workers. And I've said that's probably true, but the overall economy benefits (you only bring that number down when you eliminate the benefits to the immigrants themselves, which you guys all like to do because you don't give a **** about them).
But actualy, his policy position is still considerably more liberal than yours.
We're still waiting for backup for your claims that we need lawyers from bad law schools, English teachers in a saturated teaching market and campaigners for that idiotic nonsense known as the dream act. I personally know two unemployed lawyers and an English teacher who subs because she can't find any work. Hell I know math and special education teachers -- normally the areas with the greatest teaching shortages -- who can't find work right now even in lousy school districts.
Krugman is about as anti-illegal as a paper funded by Carlos Slim (the world's richest man and Mexican national) is allowed to be at the New York Times. He still makes quite a few points that you have not bothered to refute because you can't.
BTW, illegals aren't immigrants. At best they are temporary residents with a highly limited set of rights that does not include the right to vote or gain direct access to our welfare system. It is insulting to conflate law abiding immigrants with arrogant people who brazenly flout our immigration laws and then shrilly demand we reward them for it.
If we don't "need" those people, then they won't get jobs. That's how economies function. Like, if the market gets saturated and the bubble bursts, then people will have to redistribute to other functions.
And yes, illegals are immigrants. They immigrate, by the straight definition of the word. I know you guys go for maximum dehumanization at all times because you're...slightly less than ideal moral entities (how was that, Yac? lemme know), but they're immigrants. JUST ASK PAUL KRUGMAN, NOBEL PRIZE WINNING ECONOMIST LOL.
And something I've even acknowledged. See, Krugman's point is that this might drive down wages for American workers. And I've said that's probably true, but the overall economy benefits (you only bring that number down when you eliminate the benefits to the immigrants themselves, which you guys all like to do because you don't give a **** about them).
But actualy, his policy position is still considerably more liberal than yours.
He admits that those economic benefits are slight and while driving down wages part is much larger. I realize as you are not a worker or a taxpayer and probably don't care about those who of us who are. It's not your kids who get to face layoffs in music and art classes while the public buses run signs for "pre-escolar gratis" to serve the needs of illegals from Latin America. It's sure as hell not your property taxes that rise while the blithering idiot in the senate who is supposed to represent your needs pushes through legislation to hand in state college tuition to people who break our immigration laws.
BTW, I just checked the New York Times a few minutes ago. The current headline reads: breaking news: Dewey & LeBoeuf, New York Law Firm Crippled by Debt and Defections, Files for Bankruptcy
Explain to us again why we need a foreigner with a law degree from a mediocre law school like CUNY when well regarded law firms are being driven into bankruptcy?
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