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I graduated this summer and want to move to London, my plan is to save at least £400 a month for 1 year and rent a reasonable priced flat (im not looking for anything spectacular yet not a dump)so I will have approx £5000 and will pay 4/5 months rent upfront, giving myself time to find a job and live on the low until I do.
Another possibility is my friend from uni is interested in coming too, I have looked on Gumtree and seen some alright flatshares.
I have a Bachelors Degree in Communications and Public Relations and a HND in Advertising and Public Relations.
Do you think I would be silly in trying to make the move and would I be able to find a job? Im 21 if that makes any difference.
You will most likley find trouble getting a flat by yourself without first having a job, unless you can pay all the rent upfront, which means for however long the length of your tenancy is for.
I would not commit to a tenancy for more than 6 months in your situation, unless you have a definite employment contract for longer than that.
If you're going to share with someone else, they will have to do the same as you plus you both need to be very sure that you already get along very well with each other and that you have lived with each other before (not just a few days here or there), as you could be in for a nasty surprise once you're both ensconsed together in a 6 month or longer tenancy commitment and you find things about them that you don't like or can't tolerate, etc.
To get a good idea about rent levels,. I would look at rightmove and spareroom as they are reliable sources.
Gumtree is OK it seems to have more scammers and dangerous people than other sites.
Beware of cards put up in shop windows and make sure you visit places with a good friend or work colleague if you can.
You will also find that many homeowners are looking for extra cash and will rent you a room in their home on a month by month basis, which could be handy for you and give you the flexibility to move quickly if need be.
It can also be cheaper and normally includes all bills.
This arrangement gives you almost no rights however and the landlord can lay down any rules and conditions they want, including how much notice for you to leave (if any).
Some homeowners can also be funny or change the rules after you've moved in so try to get all their requirements/issues etc., ahead of time and in writing.
There is no legal contract with this kind of renting so whatever you've agreed is what is agreed.
I would also advise you to consider using a reputable letting agency to find a home.
One way you know if they are reputable is that they should not be charging you anything more than £60 or so per person for admin fees.
There shouldn't be any other fees, except possibly a check in or check out fee of around £100 or less for a 1-2 bed flat.
If you see a list of charges in their documentation or website for all kinds of things that don't seem to make sense, just walk away.
There are enough agencies and homes to choose from.
I am from Aberdeen, NE Scotland. I'm looking for a quick fix out of here but have decided to save for 1 year to have a bit of money behind me. I was looking to pay maybe 4 or 5 months rent upfront to give myself a bit of time to job search and find my feet.
Do you think that its achievable to find a place, reasonably close to the city center which is affordable and easy accessible.
I am from Aberdeen, NE Scotland. I'm looking for a quick fix out of here but have decided to save for 1 year to have a bit of money behind me. I was looking to pay maybe 4 or 5 months rent upfront to give myself a bit of time to job search and find my feet.
Do you think that its achievable to find a place, reasonably close to the city center which is affordable and easy accessible.
What do you mean by achievable?
What do you mean by affordable?
If you check the sites I mentioned, you should be able to see what you will get for any given rent level and in what areas.
Many people are in the same position as you and they want the same things, so you're not going to be able to beat the system.
What you pay in rent is a balance of location (quality of neighbourhood & quality of transport services) plus size and type of accommodation.
There are cheap areas in London, but mostly they're poorly located and/or have moderate-high crime and/or indifferent neighbourhoods or lack of a community and high level of transient people.
Until you know where you might like to live (hard to know if you've never been there or know anyone from there), how much you will have to spend on rent and utilities/council tax, or where your job is located, its difficult to point you towards any one area.
I can tell you that I like west London, (Postcodes W2, W3, W4, W5, W6, W12, W8, W11) and know these areas well.
I would also recommend getting a flat in an area where there's more than 1 tube line, as they do go wrong periodically or they are out of service for maintenance during the weekend and then its a real pain to get to work or get around at the weekend by buses on congested roads.
You also have a choice of line if you need it.
There are also lots of cheap-ish little areas/districts in central London, but it takes a lot to find a place in these sought-after areas, as everyone is looking for the same thing and you may get into a bidding war.
I would advise you to budget around 1000 a month just for rent, gas/electric/water, council tax, phone, TV, internet, travelcard and to have enough for a year (12000) before moving down. If you find somewhere for less, the extra is a cushion for you to keep for backup. But if you budget for less and for some reason you don't have enough and you've already moved, what are going to do?
Your costs can be less than the above amount when you share, but you have to factor in the unknown about other people, etc., as I mentioned before.
You may have to consider putting away more money or getting help from family.
What do you mean by achievable?
What do you mean by affordable?
If you check the sites I mentioned, you should be able to see what you will get for any given rent level and in what areas.
Many people are in the same position as you and they want the same things, so you're not going to be able to beat the system.
What you pay in rent is a balance of location (quality of neighbourhood & quality of transport services) plus size and type of accommodation.
There are cheap areas in London, but mostly they're poorly located and/or have moderate-high crime and/or indifferent neighbourhoods or lack of a community and high level of transient people.
Until you know where you might like to live (hard to know if you've never been there or know anyone from there), how much you will have to spend on rent and utilities/council tax, or where your job is located, its difficult to point you towards any one area.
I can tell you that I like west London, (Postcodes W2, W3, W4, W5, W6, W12, W8, W11) and know these areas well.
I would also recommend getting a flat in an area where there's more than 1 tube line, as they do go wrong periodically or they are out of service for maintenance during the weekend and then its a real pain to get to work or get around at the weekend by buses on congested roads.
You also have a choice of line if you need it.
There are also lots of cheap-ish little areas/districts in central London, but it takes a lot to find a place in these sought-after areas, as everyone is looking for the same thing and you may get into a bidding war.
I would advise you to budget around 1000 a month just for rent, gas/electric/water, council tax, phone, TV, internet, travelcard and to have enough for a year (12000) before moving down. If you find somewhere for less, the extra is a cushion for you to keep for backup. But if you budget for less and for some reason you don't have enough and you've already moved, what are going to do?
Your costs can be less than the above amount when you share, but you have to factor in the unknown about other people, etc., as I mentioned before.
You may have to consider putting away more money or getting help from family.
Fiona, if you're able to follow all this advice, then you'll have no problems. But if it were even remotely necessary to have £12k in the bank before moving to London, the city would be pretty much empty!
The budget Volte61 mentions is to live alone, which few would ever actually do when arriving in town without a job. A much better option would be to rent a room in a shared house, or share with a friend, in which case you could bring your budget down to £750 for rent bills and travel, and still have options as to area. If you've got your head screwed on right and are prepared to put in some time looking, you can spend much less than that.
While it would be great to move down with enough money to pay a years rent, this would be a pipe dream for most. If you can pay four months rent up front, that gives you an amount of time in which you have every chance of finding work - as long as you're not too fussy about what kind. Of course, depending on the circumstances in which you depart whatever job you have up in Aberdeen, you many also be eligible to claim housing benefit if you find that there is a period of time for which your income won't pay your rent (and you shouldn't feel ashamed to take this option - benefits have no more useful function than to provide a short-term leg up to ambitious and hard-working people).
Ultimately, if it all goes **** up, you can jump on a Megabus back to Aberdeen, and try again. I doubt you'll regret giving it a go.
As already mentioned, this is not usually possible if you have no job.
The only chances someone has to pay 4-5 months rent in advance is if they are living with the landlord as a lodger, or a landlord agrees to give you an AST for only 4 months, which is not very common.
What is the OP going to do if they haven't found any steady work after 4 months - go back home?
Your suggestion that the necessity of having 12K before moving to London is a remote one is not true. Its quite the opposite in fact.
I have been a landlord & property manager for more than 20 years and I have seen people moving to London all the time who are ill-prepared and did not think XYZ would happen.
Also, London would not be "empty" if people didn't prepare properly before moving there.
There are lots of people (and there will always will be people) moving to London who are doing very well, OK, or who have assets/family to draw on, regardless of economic conditions.
Others who are not so well prepared have to take their chances with those that are, with your way of thinking.
Its better to have a cushion that to put yourself at risk, at any time, but especially in a very uncertain climate.
Sharing with others is common and cheaper, but its not always what its often made up to be.
The OP needs to be prepared and informed about all the factors before moving.
As already mentioned, this is not usually possible if you have no job.
The only chances someone has to pay 4-5 months rent in advance is if they are living with the landlord as a lodger, or a landlord agrees to give you an AST for only 4 months, which is not very common.
What is the OP going to do if they haven't found any steady work after 4 months - go back home?
Your suggestion that the necessity of having 12K before moving to London is a remote one is not true. Its quite the opposite in fact.
I have been a landlord & property manager for more than 20 years and I have seen people moving to London all the time who are ill-prepared and did not think XYZ would happen.
Also, London would not be "empty" if people didn't prepare properly before moving there.
There are lots of people (and there will always will be people) moving to London who are doing very well, OK, or who have assets/family to draw on, regardless of economic conditions.
Others who are not so well prepared have to take their chances with those that are, with your way of thinking.
Its better to have a cushion that to put yourself at risk, at any time, but especially in a very uncertain climate.
Sharing with others is common and cheaper, but its not always what its often made up to be.
The OP needs to be prepared and informed about all the factors before moving.
People trying to rent who don't have a job usually need a UK based guarantor, that's all. Sometimes, being prepared to pay several months up front will also be a factor in your favour.
If the OP were to rent a room rather than a whole flat, it would often be the case there there is either no contract, or just a rolling contract that you can leave any time. Often, a guarantor is not needed, when it's a less formal agreement (often, for eg, effectively subletting from housemates who have rented the house). Not sure what sharing is 'made up' to be - for most people, it's primailiy motivated by saving money, which it undeniably does.
My point is that many, many people arrive in London with only enough money to last a month or two; no one would deny that the more prepared and the more of a cushion you have, the better - but for the op, saving 12k would take over two years, and in her position I would be tempted to take my chances. If she doesn't find a job, and isn't able to access the benefits safety net, then yes, she can go back to Aberdeen - not the desired outcome, but hardly a disaster.
People trying to rent who don't have a job usually need a UK based guarantor, that's all. Sometimes, being prepared to pay several months up front will also be a factor in your favour.
The guarantor will need to be employed and also own a UK home in their name only.
Saying "that's all" minimises the problems that could ensue if the OP's guarantor can't meet the requirements.
There is also an increasing problem with landlords having trouble with guarantors meeting the requirementrs or proving to be errant in meeting their guarantee when the tenant fails to pay. As a result, landlords are shying away from having such an arrangement.
Also, unless you have a good reason to pay lots of rent upfront (the OP does in her case), landlords are suspicious as to the reasons so being able to pay rent upfront is not as helpful as one might think it would be.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benjamin Hubard
If the OP were to rent a room rather than a whole flat, it would often be the case there there is either no contract, or just a rolling contract that you can leave any time. Often, a guarantor is not needed, when it's a less formal agreement (often, for eg, effectively subletting from housemates who have rented the house.
Not true.
For many years now, unless you live with a landlord (in which case you automatically become a lodger regardless if whether you sign something that says its an AST or not), you automatically become a tenant and have an AST, whether one is given & signed in paper form or not.
And no, you cannot "leave at any time" regardless of the length of your tenancy. There will usually be a clause in an AST explaining what notice is required, but even if there is not, there is a defined period of time that must be given as notice from the landlord to the tenant and from the tenant to the landlord.
The only way an AST rolls on from one moth to another is after the intial term of the tenancy and then only if both the landlord and tenant agree to continue in that way.
The OP and other tenants need to understand that they have no security of tenure past the notice period of 2 months if the landlord wants them to leave.
There is no such thing as an informal agreement unless its as a lodger.
If a potential tenant does not meet the criteria required of a landlord and the landlord is are happy to have a guarantor, one is always be sought by the landlord.
A tenancy is a fully enforceable legal agreement and commitment and many people enter into these agreements without really understanding what they are commiting themselves to and for how long. Consequently, there are countless disputes & problems because people did not understand what they got themselves into. The problems are also from the landlord side too.
There is also no such thing as lawful "sub-letting from housemates".
There is lots of illegal sub-letting but people do get caught out and persued and its not pretty when they are faced with large costs and unpaid rent.
You should not be encouraging the OP or anyone else reading this thread to commit such acts.
The only way a person can be released from a tenancy and be substituted by someone else is through a legal Deed of Surrender.
Such myths as you have stated, including the one that is often quoted by others about using your deposit as the last month's rent, have been circulating for many years by ill-informed & ignorant people, who have never actually rented a home directly themselves in the past 20 or so years.
You should not go on public forums and pass off bad advice as fact.
The only way the OP can legally rent a room without a tenancy agreement is if the landlord also lives in the property and so they are a lodger.
In which case, while the OP will have more flexibility about how long she can stay there and it might be cheaper, she will have no rights, may not be given a key and be given very little to no notice to leave, among other considerations and issues, as mentioned before.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benjamin Hubard
Not sure what sharing is 'made up' to be - for most people, it's primailiy motivated by saving money, which it undeniably does.
I meant the experience of sharing. Of course people mainly share because they can't afford to live by themselves but by focusing only on the financial side, many people do underestimate the issues, problems and the side effects of sharing that often arise with sharing with strangers and which they may not have factored in before signing the dotted line.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benjamin Hubard
My point is that many, many people arrive in London with only enough money to last a month or two
And who often discover that things are not as easy as someone told them on some web forum.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benjamin Hubard
If she doesn't find a job, and isn't able to access the benefits safety net, then yes, she can go back to Aberdeen - not the desired outcome, but hardly a disaster.
I don't think you are in a position to know what could be a disaster for the OP or not.
It could be that she is definitely "on her own" in Aberdeen and moving one side of the country to the other, perhaps without knowing anyone in London and with only a few grand in her pocket, may be taking too many chances. And what if she doesn't have anywhere to go back to in Aberdeen?
Look mate, you can inform me until you're blue in the face (and you must be, after your last post) about how things, in your view, work. No doubt, in your dealings as a landlord and agent, you are most scrupulous and always follow the letter of the law. You are to be commended for this. But in my - extensive and ongoing - experience as a tenant, and in the far more extensive experience of my countless friends and acquaintances who are also tenants, things are constantly done in a less than formal fashion. Fact. I acknowledge your point about the contract that automatically exists between a landlord and a tenant, and I would obviously encourage anyone who is a tenant to know their rights and make recourse to them when it suits. But ad-hoc arrangements exist everywhere, for better or worse.
Neither of us can know what constitutes an acceptable risk for the OP, what the stakes are if she falls flat in London, or what sort of safety net she has back home. All these things will determine what level of risk she is prepared to subject herself to. But I can say that that many, many of my friends and acquaintances have come to London, or gone to live in other cities, without the level of financial backup you are advocating.
There is no right or wrong answer - it's all a matter of weighing what you have to gain and what you have to lose.
If things didn't work out for me I'd make it back up the road no problem, it would be a kick in the face returning but least I could say I tried
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