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The LIRR thread got me thinking; doctors and lawyers aside, why is it so hard to make money on long island? I think it's a chicken or egg thing where companies don't attract top talent because they pay poorly. I wish there were viable companies here in my line of work, the thought of another 20 some odd years of the LIRR is almost too much to bear.
The LIRR thread got me thinking; doctors and lawyers aside, why is it so hard to make money on long island? I think it's a chicken or egg thing where companies don't attract top talent because they pay poorly. I wish there were viable companies here in my line of work, the thought of another 20 some odd years of the LIRR is almost too much to bear.
The average person with a law degree on LI is most likely making less than what conductors make. For every big shot pulling 250K there are 2 people making 75K working as paras.
A MD who is a General Practitioner is not making much more than Conductors if you factor in all the benefits and that fact that they can't start really earning until they are almost 30. So while the plastic surgeon is making millions, that's not the norm. So, you are actually understating your point, which should read "aside from Plastic Surgeons and Partners in big law firms, why...."
You always hear these type of arguments from the resident public sector guys "yeah, but dat guy in Wall ST is makin half a Mil!!", when again, for every person pulling that kind of coin there are 5 other people working 60 hours a week to make $100K if they're lucky.
It seems like every teacher, cop, and MTA employee thinks that if they were working on Wall ST they'd be VP's as opposed to worker bees. It doesn't work that way in the real world. You don't automatically get paid more because you've been working for 10 years because it's in your contract. As long as you don't do anything stupid enough to get fired, like sleep with women while on the job, you have guaranteed income.
As a lifelong Long Islander and a business executive, I can tell you that the money has almost always been in Manhattan and not on Long Island. Over the years, we have seen company headquarters leave in droves (taking the decent-paying jobs with them) because of the high cost of doing business on Long Island and the political corruption and turmoil. It is even hard to get executives to come to Long Island because of the living costs and the lack of amenities, other than the beaches.
Late yesterday, Northrop Grumman announced that it was moving 850 jobs to other states where it is apparently easier to do business. These are good-paying jobs with good benefits and advancement opportunities. That leaves 550 Northrop Grumman positions on Long Island and I can almost guarantee that those will be gone soon. Corporations tend to leave Long Island quietly in stages. During each stage, they announce that they are in some way still committed to the Island even though they really intend to depart entirely.
As the good-paying jobs retreat to other, business-friendly regions, we are left with retail and service jobs that probably pay little more than minimum wage and have few, if any benefits. Or, we are left with overpaid cops and teachers who depend on the rising property taxes that are crushing homeowners. That's the Long Island of the future and it's not pretty.
The LIRR thread got me thinking; doctors and lawyers aside, why is it so hard to make money on long island? I think it's a chicken or egg thing where companies don't attract top talent because they pay poorly. I wish there were viable companies here in my line of work, the thought of another 20 some odd years of the LIRR is almost too much to bear.
Only way to make real money in this economy is via Wall Street, corporate management, big law or owning your own business or real estate or to inherit it! The first three are all in Manhattan (why would they move to Long Island). The last three are only for the select few lucky or skilled or combo of both. By definition you can't build a critical mass of high paying jobs in the last three categories as they only describe a small % of the population. So the only way for LI to attract high paying jobs en masse is to attract corporations that pay high wages. Why would those corporations locate on a super expensive island that is difficult to get to with mediocre universities, high prop taxes, corrupt govt, NIMBYism, need to compete with Manhattan wages, etc. Just doesn't make sense. The future of Long Island is rich and poor with not much in the middle except govt workers who have no choice but to live here and those who are supported by rich mom and dad. It's only going to get worse now that tolls and LIRR went up again and prop tax increases have no end in sight. Rich or poor is the future. Middle class on LI is dead. Some doctors and dentists can still make big money if they are established, but there is such an oversaturation of these people on LI that is tough to do that today starting out with student loans, practice loans, declining reimbursements, Obamacare, etc.
As a lifelong Long Islander and a business executive, I can tell you that the money has almost always been in Manhattan and not on Long Island. Over the years, we have seen company headquarters leave in droves (taking the decent-paying jobs with them) because of the high cost of doing business on Long Island and the political corruption and turmoil. It is even hard to get executives to come to Long Island because of the living costs and the lack of amenities, other than the beaches.
Late yesterday, Northrop Grumman announced that it was moving 850 jobs to other states where it is apparently easier to do business. These are good-paying jobs with good benefits and advancement opportunities. That leaves 550 Northrop Grumman positions on Long Island and I can almost guarantee that those will be gone soon. Corporations tend to leave Long Island quietly in stages. During each stage, they announce that they are in some way still committed to the Island even though they really intend to depart entirely.
As the good-paying jobs retreat to other, business-friendly regions, we are left with retail and service jobs that probably pay little more than minimum wage and have few, if any benefits. Or, we are left with overpaid cops and teachers who depend on the rising property taxes that are crushing homeowners. That's the Long Island of the future and it's not pretty.
Good Post. And I agree it wont be long before NG moves all those jobs off the island. NG moving those jobs had nothing to do with the typical "tougher to do buisness on LI" roadblocks that repels so many other buisnesses though. It was simply moving the engineers working on certain programs to the locations the respective aircraft are actually manufactured and tested. The only real reason Bethpage has remained open all these years is for political reasons (with most NG facilites now in SoCal, Florida, and Virginia), but with sequestration squeezing the defense budget there really is no choice anymore.
When I worked for State Farm, the pay was pretty good. Most of us knew it was a pretty good gig; every once in a while someone would leave for another company, and within the year they'd be trying to come back. Aside from pay, they offered a pension when I started, a 401K, retiree health benefits had been phased out right before I started, COLA increases for salary (that stopped the year the CPI went up 18% LOL), as well as a fairly liberal personal time policy and a TON of sick time if you'd been there over 5 years.
Most of the management I worked for made well over $100K, and this was in the '90s.
When I worked for State Farm, the pay was pretty good. Most of us knew it was a pretty good gig; every once in a while someone would leave for another company, and within the year they'd be trying to come back. Aside from pay, they offered a pension when I started, a 401K, retiree health benefits had been phased out right before I started, COLA increases for salary (that stopped the year the CPI went up 18% LOL), as well as a fairly liberal personal time policy and a TON of sick time if you'd been there over 5 years.
Most of the management I worked for made well over $100K, and this was in the '90s.
I think they've completely left the Island.
I think thats true for just about everywhere twingles. Overall wages have been stagnant for decades in the US and pensions in the private sector are very, very rare nowadays. Makes you wonder what benefits our children will get another 30 years down the road.
I work in media/advertising and aside from cablevision there are no legit companies here paying anything decent. I started and sold my company a few years back and wish I had the energy to do it again.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomais
Only way to make real money in this economy is via Wall Street, corporate management, big law or owning your own business or real estate or to inherit it! The first three are all in Manhattan (why would they move to Long Island). The last three are only for the select few lucky or skilled or combo of both. By definition you can't build a critical mass of high paying jobs in the last three categories as they only describe a small % of the population. So the only way for LI to attract high paying jobs en masse is to attract corporations that pay high wages. Why would those corporations locate on a super expensive island that is difficult to get to with mediocre universities, high prop taxes, corrupt govt, NIMBYism, need to compete with Manhattan wages, etc. Just doesn't make sense. The future of Long Island is rich and poor with not much in the middle except govt workers who have no choice but to live here and those who are supported by rich mom and dad. It's only going to get worse now that tolls and LIRR went up again and prop tax increases have no end in sight. Rich or poor is the future. Middle class on LI is dead. Some doctors and dentists can still make big money if they are established, but there is such an oversaturation of these people on LI that is tough to do that today starting out with student loans, practice loans, declining reimbursements, Obamacare, etc.
I think you can count the major businesses left on LI on one hand. Every few years, companies such as ADP or Canon wake up and start talking about moving operations to other low-cost areas. This results in the business retention dance our incompetent local politicians engage in, ponying up millions in tax abatements and utility credits. These bribes always end up costing the tax and rate payers in the end, though the politicians will tell you they're retaining good LI jobs. In truth, many of the best jobs have already been moved to lower cost regions or countries. Almost all of these businesses have outsourced many white collar jobs to India or China, leaving some of the lower-paid jobs here on LI.
Usually, as another poster pointed out, NYC is the key job market with higher salaries buoyed by Wall St. But as Wall St. has shrunken itself over the last 4 or so years, even that is in jeopardy. NYC does have a growing ecosystem of technology startups and lots of foreign capital, so it is still more economically vital than LI.
I think thats true for just about everywhere twingles. Overall wages have been stagnant for decades in the US and pensions in the private sector are very, very rare nowadays. Makes you wonder what benefits our children will get another 30 years down the road.
Oh, don't worry, everything will be free by then!
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