Sue for back rent for illegal rental? (city hall, rental market)

[1newyorkguy]

A small claims adviser told me I can sue for past rent paid if I find out the unit I was in was illegal--not registered, without proper permits.

Does anyone know about this?

I am having problems with getting the proper security deposit back, so aside from suing for that, this would be another possibility.

[1newyorkguy]

bump?

[CALGUY]

First off, you need to make certain that the unit is an illegal rental before proceeding.
Call the department of building and safety.
Tell them you think the unit is an illegal one, and why you think it is.
They will investigate and come back with an answer.
If it is, you can't sue for back rent, because you DID live there, but you can sue for the return of the security deposit.
Bob.

[1newyorkguy]

Originally Posted by CALGUY

First off, you need to make certain that the unit is an illegal rental before proceeding.
Call the department of building and safety.
Tell them you think the unit is an illegal one, and why you think it is.
They will investigate and come back with an answer.
If it is, you can't sue for back rent, because you DID live there, but you can sue for the return of the security deposit.
Bob.

I called santa monica rent control--no record of the unit. I went to city hall building safety, they only have records of the unit being classified as a recreation room.

Landlord is saying they will counter sue me for (trumped up) damages if I go to small claims court and want me to take a small amount of my deposit back. It's my contention that I can sue for the deposit (was past 21 days before I heard anything) plus 3x times that amount for bad faith (lying about the damage, sending me a fake letter claiming to be before 21 days, renting out an illegal unit.

I have heard of suing for all back rent though, as well..as it is illegal to accept money for the rental. Has anyone heard of this?

[Twinkle Toes]

Then there's that whole "unjust enrichment" thing ... just sayin' .....

[CALGUY]

You can't sue for any rent you paid because regardless if the unit were legal or not,you lived there.
The courts will side with the owner on this.
If before any court proceedings, the unit is found to be an illegal rental unit, the courts will side with the owner on that portion of the suit where you are trying to recover the rent you hav already paid, but the court will rule in your favor for return of the security deposit.
Basically, here is what the judge would state:
"The defendant is guilty of renting a unit which does not meet city codes,however plaintiff lived in the unit, paid rent, and was obviously not concerned with the legal status of the unit until now."
"Because the plaintiff willingly paid rent, that rent does not need to be returned to the plaintiff but, the landlord must return all of the security deposit due to the fact it was not paid as rent, but rather as a damage security."
"Because the unit is an illegal rental unit, the court cannot rule in favor of the defendant in keeping the security deposit."
Judges are sworn to uphold the law, and ruling that the defendant could keep any security deposit would be against the law, and would be condoning the illegal behavior.
As for suing for three times the amount of the security deposit, you would be out of luck.
Again, if in fact the unit is found to be an illegal unit, only the security you paid to the landlord is all that would have to be returned.
Bob.

[Ceece]

I have heard of suing for all back rent though, as well..as it is illegal to accept money for the rental. Has anyone heard of this?

Apparently YOU have heard of this so....

[1newyorkguy]

Originally Posted by CALGUY

You can't sue for any rent you paid because regardless if the unit were legal or not,you lived there.
The courts will side with the owner on this.
If before any court proceedings, the unit is found to be an illegal rental unit, the courts will side with the owner on that portion of the suit where you are trying to recover the rent you hav already paid, but the court will rule in your favor for return of the security deposit.
Basically, here is what the judge would state:
"The defendant is guilty of renting a unit which does not meet city codes,however plaintiff lived in the unit, paid rent, and was obviously not concerned with the legal status of the unit until now."
"Because the plaintiff willingly paid rent, that rent does not need to be returned to the plaintiff but, the landlord must return all of the security deposit due to the fact it was not paid as rent, but rather as a damage security."
"Because the unit is an illegal rental unit, the court cannot rule in favor of the defendant in keeping the security deposit."
Judges are sworn to uphold the law, and ruling that the defendant could keep any security deposit would be against the law, and would be condoning the illegal behavior.
As for suing for three times the amount of the security deposit, you would be out of luck.
Again, if in fact the unit is found to be an illegal unit, only the security you paid to the landlord is all that would have to be returned.
Bob.

3X the amount of the deposit is for "bad faith", which is in the code.

[CALGUY]

The code is written for units that are legally rented, and the courts will back that provision too the hilt,but in an illegal unit, monies paid to the landlord as security deposit are ordered returned to the tenant.
Penalties covering legal units do not apply to illegal units.
Though you may not know of it in the court the day of the judgement, when dealing with illegal rental units, a verbal judgement is given in court, and a cease and desist order is included in the written judgement given too the landlord to cease and desist renting the illegal property, and options are given too the owner of the building too either bring the building up to code, or remove it from the rental market.
Trust me on this one, if this case ends up in court, you will only get what you paid in security,not additional penalty fees.
Bob.

[Twinkle Toes]

How long did you live there, OP?