Abolish Property Taxes (Miami: to rent, condo, high crime)

[tallrick]

If they want to push through an income tax at least the property tax will be gone and we will not be pushed out of our home. Anyway I doubt any Floridians will vote in an income tax. The bad thing is that I know Floridians are generally slow and will not vote for the right to own property, something that none of us have yet experienced. The removal of property taxes will fuel a real estate boom that will sweep across the state, giving property holders a chance to sell and leave. Yet without property taxes who would want to leave?

[rogerbacon]

Originally Posted by randian

What are you getting at? Because of Save Our Homes the property tax burden falls disproportionately hard on tourists and renters.

You must have misunderstood. Tourists don't pay property taxes. They don't live here; they're tourists. I think there isa a bed tax that hotels charge though so they do end up paying a little bit. It would takea lot of nights of that bed tax to equal outto my $8k property taxes though

SOH does not put any burden on tourists or renters. It places it on new home owners.

[randian]

Originally Posted by tallrick

If they want to push through an income tax at least the property tax will be gone and we will not be pushed out of our home.

But property taxes won't be gone. Read it again. Only ad-valorem taxes are gone. A fixed per-parcel tax real estate tax isn't ad valorem and is therefore an acceptable replacement under this proposal. So is an excise tax on your car (an extra $250 per year per car anybody?).

[randian]

Originally Posted by rogerbacon

You must have misunderstood. Tourists don't pay property taxes. They don't live here; they're tourists. I think there isa a bed tax that hotels charge though so they do end up paying a little bit. It would takea lot of nights of that bed tax to equal outto my $8k property taxes though

SOH does not put any burden on tourists or renters. It places it on new home owners.

All the property tax paid by hotels and landlords, at a higher rate than that paid by homeowners, doesn't count? Hoteliers and landlords don't have to pass this cost onto their customers, which in the case of residential landlords are less able to pay than new homeowners? The fact that SOH means that commercial and tenant-occupied residential property tax must increase much faster than a homeowner's to make up the difference isn't a burden? What crack are you smoking?

[rogerbacon]

Originally Posted by randian

But property taxes won't be gone. Read it again. Only ad-valorem taxes are gone. A fixed per-parcel tax real estate tax isn't ad valorem and is therefore an acceptable replacement under this proposal. So is an excise tax on your car (an extra $250 per year per car anybody?).

Such taxes are indeed possible but they would be much prefered over the current system. A non ad-valorem tax would be great because everyone would pay the same rate. That would keep the government from raising the rates too high because it would adversly affect the poor. It is only when government can charge different people different rates that they are able to cause real damage. Politicians will always tax the groups that are less likely to vote for them anyway and that the groups that are most likely to vote for them the least. We take a great deal of power away from politicians when we restrict them to taxing everyone at the same rate. While we're at it we should demand the same thing from the federal government on income taxes.

[reinfo2008]

i am all for it, we should spread the pain to everyone, not just homeowners. i am however very concern about the alternatives. you can't just give politicians a carte blanche and let them figure it out afterwards, i will support a flat tax if proposed

[tallrick]

Abolishing property taxes would give Florida a huge advantage, but who will do it? There's plenty of money from sales taxes and gasoline taxes, as well as fees. If Florida was run the way I run my home and business, it would be making money, not losing it. Instead of a property tax simply charge fees for services like garbage pickup, schools police, fire fighting, parks and libraries. Better yet, how about neighborhood and corporate sponsorship? The Florida Constitution whould have this statement added "Under no circumstances shall a confiscatory property tax apply to any homesteaded properties". Business property should be taxed based on services needed.

[reinfo2008]

Originally Posted by tallrick

Abolishing property taxes would give Florida a huge advantage, but who will do it? There's plenty of money from sales taxes and gasoline taxes, as well as fees. If Florida was run the way I run my home and business, it would be making money, not losing it. Instead of a property tax simply charge fees for services like garbage pickup, schools police, fire fighting, parks and libraries. Better yet, how about neighborhood and corporate sponsorship? The Florida Constitution whould have this statement added "Under no circumstances shall a confiscatory property tax apply to any homesteaded properties". Business property should be taxed based on services needed.

one word: bureaucracy.

[copacetic]

total tax burden is pretty low in FL compared to the national average (yes prop tax is high but there is no income tax). so i don't think we should rock the boat on this issue. we are getting off easy right now. sure i'd love taxes to be even lower, but i doubt it will happen. just be happy you aren't living in the Peoples Republic of New York, where the tax situation is out of control.

[rogerbacon]

Originally Posted by copacetic

total tax burden is pretty low in FL compared to the national average (yes prop tax is high but there is no income tax). so i don't think we should rock the boat on this issue. we are getting off easy right now. sure i'd love taxes to be even lower, but i doubt it will happen. just be happy you aren't living in the Peoples Republic of New York, where the tax situation is out of control.

According to http://www.nber.org/~taxsim/state-marginal/avrate.html the national average state sales tax in 2004, the most recent year available) was 4.46%. I'd rather pay that than $8,000 in property taxes. Income taxes, as bad as they can be when they get high, are less evil than property taxes. Property taxes don't consider the economic situation of the individual at all. They just take a set amount no matter what. Consider a person who buys an 'OK' house in South Florida (say $400,000 a couple of years ago). Then he gets downsized and has to take work making less money. If the county made money through income tax then would take the hit too when he had to take a lower paying job but he would still be able to pay his taxes. If, however, the county's taxes are property based, the individual will still have the high tax burden that he can no longer afford. The county doesn't feel any burden at all so they have no incentive to lower taxes. Income taxes reflect an individual's financial worth AT THAT MOMENT. Property taxes say "You must be able to pay X because you bought property Y Z years ago". It's just wrong.