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Just trying to gather some advice early on starting a farm there in MS. How much do you think is too much acreage for one person/one family? My wife and I will be the only people working the farm until we have children. Actually, I'll be the only one in the fields mostly.
I was thinking 20 acres. Is that too much for one person? Maybe not enough? I know you'll probably say it depends on what I want to do with the land. I'll get into that now.
I want to have a very diversified farm that is only for my family and I. Not a commercial farm. So, I want to have a few of each of these animals:
cows (dairy & beef), chickens, sheep, llamas, horses, goats, guinea hen, turkey, alpacas, donkey, pigs, and a few others I might have missed (I'll have to find the list I made and update this post later) My dogs and cats will be in the house with me.
So, I was thinking 20 acres for under $30K. I'll purchase this with cash. Then to start with, I build a small house (maybe 800 sq foot) and barn on it for under $100K. I'll use a loan for that. Depending on the land I purchase, I figure that I'll have to clear the land and have a well and pond put on it for the animals. Lots to plan out, so any farmers here that care to share experiences/advice?
My parents (mostly my dad) tried the goat thing to keep from mowing so much. Their two goats quickly turned into over 20. I guess they didn't teach biology back then. Anyway, this was basically the over the barn area (2 acres) out of around 80. It was too much for them and they sold them all and eventually the entire farm.
Is this just a hobby farm? No crops? When I was younger I worked those 80 acres and about 100 rented acres with my dad for a few summers. Soybeans and milo were the main crops. My in-laws are still big into farming with a few thousand acres.
I am not exactly the person you may want to talk to, but I do have some relevant experience. I grew up on a 10 acre "play farm" in AL, lived for several year in the Starkville and Meridian areas, and briefly owned a 5 acre "play farm" in TN.
The first question I have for you is what is your full time job? Are you planning on making farming your profession, or is this a sustainable lifestyle/hobby farm?
If you are trying to make a living from your farm, it will need to be commercial to some extent. Yo can live off of what you raise, but you are still going to need money.
If this is a hobby farm:
5 to 10 acres is a very good start. You can raise goats, poultry, maybe a cow (although you may find yourself swimming in milk) or a pig or two, and still have enough space to do a big garden, and orchard, and maybe some grain. Check out the book, "The Backyard Homestead" for some ideas on space constrained homesteading. They have ideas on lots as small as 1/4 acre.
If this is going to be your livelihood:
I would think that you would need significantly more. I would probably start with no less that 40, maybe 80. You will need enough to raise either produce or livestock for sale, so that you actually have some money. If it were me, I would try to get on the organic, locally produced bandwagon, but the market for this stuff is not as great in MS as it is in eco conscious towns. There are not so many swanky bistros and restaurants that buy locally.
I think your price for land may be low. From what I have seen, farm land starts at $2000/acre and can be significantly more expensive. I think you will be doing good if you can get 10 acres for your $30k. Also make sure you budget for fencing, and a tractor. You can get an older one for a couple thousand dollars, but you will sink a huge amount of time, effort, and money into it to keep it running well ( my '64 Ford was a total money pit!)
Just from what you have been mentioning in your post, I don't think you are anywhere near ready to make a living as a small farmer. There is just way to much upfront money needed to buy and clear land, build a house and barn, buy a tractor and the appropriate implements, buy fencing and other miscellaneous stuff, and still have money for livestock.
I do think you could find an existing 5 or 10 acre property and work your way into a sustainable lifestyle, but it would be better to find something that already has a house and maybe a barn.
As a data point, my wife and I know a couple in MS who have 80 acres, and lease an additional 40, mostly raising livestock with some produce, take care of their own milk, butter, and cheese, and sell beef. They both still have day jobs. Farming is tough to make a go of, particularly if you don't inherit an existing farm.
My last thought is however much you think it will cost, double it. It is so easy to overlook things that add up really quickly, both in farming and in homebuilding.
The first question I have for you is what is your full time job? Are you planning on making farming your profession, or is this a sustainable lifestyle/hobby farm?
Yes, this is going to be a sustainable lifestyle farm where I just want to raise my own food for my family. I wouldn't mind selling some if others are interested but that is definitely not the plan.
I work in a security position now but I am trying to get my own business started. It is taking time but I'm working on it.
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Originally Posted by covedweller
What are you planning to feed the livestock?
I was planning on doing it the "natural" way and grass feeding them. I'll also grow crops specifically for them as well.
And yes there will be plenty of crops (herbs, vegetables, fruits, etc.) on my farm as well. I just didn't list them here. I figured that the livestock will be the hard part to get down as a beginner.
And yes again I do not have any experience at all in farming. I am taking steps to remedy that though. I will be participating in WWOOF for a couple of months to a year sometime at the end of this year hopefully. That should give me some hands-on experience in all of this.
Yes, this is going to be a sustainable lifestyle farm where I just want to raise my own food for my family. I wouldn't mind selling some if others are interested but that is definitely not the plan.
In this case I would highly recommend getting some books on homesteading. The book I recommended above had plans and tips for having .5 to 1 acre being able to provide much of a small family's needs. On a lot that small you would definitely need to buy feed for animals, though. I think 5 acres could be more than enough, if well thought out. I also think much more than that and you will hit a money ceiling very quickly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by doitright1
And yes again I do not have any experience at all in farming. I am taking steps to remedy that though. I will be participating in WWOOF for a couple of months to a year sometime at the end of this year hopefully. That should give me some hands-on experience in all of this.
So I don't have a lot of practical experience either. I grew up on a hobby farm, but have not gotten to have my own yet. At the last place I lived, TN, my wife and I had a 5 acre spread with a barn and a pond (that usually dried up in the summer). We ended up having to leave , due to my job, before we were able to do everything we wanted to, but here are some things I learned:
5 acres is bigger than you think. There is a lot of maintenance required, particularly if the farm amenities (fences, barn, paddock, milking stalls, etc.. ) are either not their or in bad shape.
Work into it slowly. We started by just doing a garden the first year. It was our first chance to really grow anything that wasn't in pots. We learned a lot just from that. Our plan was to try to garden first, repair enough of the fencing and barn to house 2-4 goats, all nannys, and slowly acquire more for milk, meat and clearing scrub brush. We had also thought about a pig(only one). Often you can buy them young in the early spring and raise them until you slaughter them in late fall/winter. breeding them may not be the best choice for you. Just go slowly, otherwise you are liable to sink a lot of time and money and get in over your head.
Be careful in your choice of livestock. Research everything! I wanted to get a milk cow, but when we realized that a good milker can provide 6 - 10 gallons of milk a day, we had to reconsider. There is no way the two of us could keep up with that kind of milk production, even if we were making our own butter and cheese.We determined that a milk goat might be a better option for us. I also learned that it is a bad idea to have turkeys with other poultry, because they are susceptible to certain parasites, so you have to make a choice. Do your homework.
Make a budget and then double it, particularly if you are looking for bargains. Farming is expensive, and don't let anybody tell you otherwise. If you have to put in field fence, you are looking at something in the neighborhood of .50 per foot without posts, ties or gates. A new barn can easily run 20K-40K depending on what you need. You can get an old tractor for two or three thousand, but you will need to be prepared to pay at least half that in parts, assuming you can rebuild your own tractor engine( If you can't, a tractor is a good learning experience. You will not find a better way to understand an internal combustion engine than servicing an antique tractor. )
These are just thing I learned when we tried our hand at this. There are a lot of different way to approach this kind of sustainable lifestyle farming, so please don't take anything I have said as the gospel truth, it is just my opinion based on my experiences.
I was planning on doing it the "natural" way and grass feeding them. I'll also grow crops specifically for them as well.
Not sure how many animals you are wanting, but grass feeding will work well for part of the year, but you'll need hay for the winter. If you are only talking a couple then it won't be a big deal, but due to the drought in TX and OK this past summer, hay was being bought in MS and trucked to those states, so the price spiked. You'll also need to purchase feed, so figure that in. Probably a good idea to read up on nutrition, because there is more to it than simply putting a cow in a pasture and letting them eat grass. If you've already considered this, I apologize; just trying to be sure have a full view of things.
Have you ever done any farming before? There tends to be this idealized view of farming as some "get back in touch with the earth" and raise all your own food, be independent from the world, yada, yada, yada. The reality is that its hard, nasty, bloody work. Go for it, just don't let your kids name the animals.
Be careful in your choice of livestock. Research everything! I wanted to get a milk cow, but when we realized that a good milker can provide 6 - 10 gallons of milk a day, we had to reconsider.
Holy smokes! I have been researching a bit but not too much because I think that I just need to get my butt on a real farm and just start doing it. What I am going to do and am working on now is making a type of definitive checklist of tasks to learn during my time working on the farms overseas and INCONUS. That way, if I am able to do everything on the checklist associated with each animal/crop/etc. then I know I'll be able to do it on my own farm when I finally get it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldenfatt
Have you ever done any farming before? There tends to be this idealized view of farming as some "get back in touch with the earth" and raise all your own food, be independent from the world, yada, yada, yada. The reality is that its hard, nasty, bloody work.
Yes, that is my idea behind this as well. Not totally 100% but kind of. I just want to be able to grow/raise all of my own food by myself if I choose to. That's all. I am not saying that I will but the most important thing for me is having the choice to do what I want to. I probably will not do it all myself since it is hard work but there may be a couple of months or years that I only want to do it alone.
@covedweller - I'll be reading up on nutrition as well before/during my time on the farms hopefully.
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