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Old 01-28-2019, 07:08 AM
 
252 posts, read 456,498 times
Reputation: 262

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As the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act of 2017 moved through Congress in late 2017, hysterical New Jersey realtors and their paid-for politicians began hyperventilating about the TCJA's negative impact on New Jersey home values.

A few examples:

"If both mortgage interest and real estate taxes deductions will be eliminated, home prices expect to fall from 14% to 21%. A decline in value as projected could mean a loss in home value of $36,620-$54,950 for the typical homeowner." https://www.nar.realtor/sites/defaul...w%20Jersey.pdf

"Businesses and families are going to pack up and move out at record rates. Home prices could go down by more than ten percent." https://gottheimer.house.gov/news/do...DocumentID=428

So what happened? In 2018, New Jersey house prices rose at the fastest pace in years.

Year-over-year change in New Jersey house prices, according to New Jersey Realtors:

2012 0.0%
2013 +3.0%
2014 0.0%
2015 0.0%
2016 -1.6%
2017 +1.0%
2018 +5.0% (range of Hudson County +12.3% to Salem County -4.8%)
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Old 01-28-2019, 07:23 AM
 
Location: NJ
516 posts, read 1,005,731 times
Reputation: 482
I don't believe the +5% number for a second.

Jersey City prices have collapsed. Condos in downtown aren't even listing and are instead renting out at discounts to previous years because the owners are afraid of the appraisals. Many investors who had been buying at a rate of 1-2 properties a year have all pulled out of the market because they feel there is another 25% drop in prices on the horizon.

I'm in Bergen County and my house has dropped at least 6% since I purchased last year. List prices in my town are dropping prices between 5-10% from last year's sold prices in order to get traffic or they sit on the market forever.

I want to see the data of Hudson County +12.3% lol.
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Old 01-28-2019, 07:38 AM
 
Location: Central NJ and PA
5,070 posts, read 2,278,237 times
Reputation: 3931
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrsPiggleWiggle View Post
I don't believe the +5% number for a second.

Jersey City prices have collapsed. Condos in downtown aren't even listing and are instead renting out at discounts to previous years because the owners are afraid of the appraisals. Many investors who had been buying at a rate of 1-2 properties a year have all pulled out of the market because they feel there is another 25% drop in prices on the horizon.

I'm in Bergen County and my house has dropped at least 6% since I purchased last year. List prices in my town are dropping prices between 5-10% from last year's sold prices in order to get traffic or they sit on the market forever.

I want to see the data of Hudson County +12.3% lol.
https://randrealty.com/2018/04/11/re...dson-county-nj


Overall sales (number) are down due to lack of inventory. You can't sell what you don't have.
For those homes that did sell, prices are up dramatically.
Quote:
impact on average prices, which spiked across the board: rising over 16% for single‑family, over 21% for multi‑family, and over 11% for condos. That kind of price appreciation is not sustainable, but even the yearlong trends are pretty impressive: up 5% for single-family, 15% for multi-family, and 5% for condos.
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Old 01-28-2019, 07:54 AM
 
252 posts, read 456,498 times
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Hudson County +12.3% house price statistic is here. http://njar-public.stats.10kresearch...ounty?src=page

Zillow data also shows Hudson County house prices rising at double-digit pace in 2018. This data shows a slowdown in the rate of growth through 2018, but house price growth remains strong, coming in at 14.9% in October, 14.3% in November, and 13.7% in December.

On a statewide basis, Zillow data shows house price growth ranging from 5.0% to 9.1% during each month of 2018.

Last edited by pretorius; 01-28-2019 at 08:12 AM..
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Old 01-28-2019, 08:01 AM
 
173 posts, read 216,413 times
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First post TCJA tax returns are just being prepared now. Preparation of these tax returns are likely to drive home how limited the tax benefits of home ownership have become. Having just started on my taxes, I can say that this is true for me, and I'm exposed to tax law on a daily basis.

It is entirely possible that this will affect future housing decisions/housing prices. Obviously the effects are/will be different in different market segments. Houses with taxes > 30k are likely to be affected to a greater extent than those with taxes < 10k.
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Old 01-28-2019, 08:09 AM
 
1,620 posts, read 3,774,139 times
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Not so sure about the numbers, but based on my clients I am NOT seeing the tax act affecting them at all. The elimination of AMT for most people, and the tax CREDIT for dependents is outweighing any losses in deductions.
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Old 01-28-2019, 08:16 AM
 
173 posts, read 216,413 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sonofagunk View Post
Not so sure about the numbers, but based on my clients I am NOT seeing the tax act affecting them at all. The elimination of AMT for most people, and the tax CREDIT for dependents is outweighing any losses in deductions.
That goes to whether overall tax liability has changed. There's a separate question about whether housing subsidies/tax benefits have been lost (i.e., even if you have the same amount of money in your pocket after taxes, is it comparatively more expensive, on an after-tax basis, to own a particular type of house).
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Old 01-28-2019, 08:19 AM
 
607 posts, read 554,991 times
Reputation: 1554
Quote:
Originally Posted by pretorius View Post
As the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act of 2017 moved through Congress in late 2017, hysterical New Jersey realtors and their paid-for politicians began hyperventilating about the TCJA's negative impact on New Jersey home values.

A few examples:

"If both mortgage interest and real estate taxes deductions will be eliminated, home prices expect to fall from 14% to 21%. A decline in value as projected could mean a loss in home value of $36,620-$54,950 for the typical homeowner." https://www.nar.realtor/sites/defaul...w%20Jersey.pdf

"Businesses and families are going to pack up and move out at record rates. Home prices could go down by more than ten percent." https://gottheimer.house.gov/news/do...DocumentID=428

So what happened? In 2018, New Jersey house prices rose at the fastest pace in years.
That initial projection was relative to how house prices would have changed.

The deduction change is only one factor in many when it comes to housing prices. Other factors can lead to an increases that more than offset any reduction due to the interest/deduction changes...leading to a net increase despite this factor bringing them down.
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Old 01-28-2019, 08:25 AM
 
Location: New Jersey
4,181 posts, read 5,063,818 times
Reputation: 4233
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrsPiggleWiggle View Post
I don't believe the +5% number for a second.

Jersey City prices have collapsed. Condos in downtown aren't even listing and are instead renting out at discounts to previous years because the owners are afraid of the appraisals. Many investors who had been buying at a rate of 1-2 properties a year have all pulled out of the market because they feel there is another 25% drop in prices on the horizon.

I'm in Bergen County and my house has dropped at least 6% since I purchased last year. List prices in my town are dropping prices between 5-10% from last year's sold prices in order to get traffic or they sit on the market forever.

I want to see the data of Hudson County +12.3% lol.
All real estate is local.


In the case of JC, there are sections of town that still have pent-up demand, and properties going under contract the same day that they are listed in the MLS. There are even FSBO's that don't even make it to the MLS.


Re: Bergen County, there too, it depends where you live. The high end homes ($800K and up) are sitting longer, but for example in Hasbrouck Heights and Wood-Ridge, anything in the $550K-$700K range doesn't last more than 10 days.
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Old 01-28-2019, 08:27 AM
 
1,620 posts, read 3,774,139 times
Reputation: 1187
Quote:
Originally Posted by TaxProf View Post
That goes to whether overall tax liability has changed. There's a separate question about whether housing subsidies/tax benefits have been lost (i.e., even if you have the same amount of money in your pocket after taxes, is it comparatively more expensive, on an after-tax basis, to own a particular type of house).
I have to disagree. If a house is worth XYZ before the tax breaks and after the tax breaks you still have the same money to spend, the house will still be worth XYZ. Houses are only worth what people are willing to pay for them, and people are willing pay as much as they can afford (this is why realtors show people expensive houses first so when they show them ones I their price range, they quickly figure out if the can afford the more expensive one
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