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We are looking for an apartment in Astoria. Out of the 6 we've seen, 3 were under renovation. When I say under renovation, I mean holes in the floor, wires/nails sticking out, nothing in the kitchen, dust everywhere, etc. We really like the location and the layout of one of them, but I'm annoyed at the condition they are showing it in. They absolutely refuse to wait because they are confident someone else will rent it, and I believe it because we saw a couple rent an apt. like that on the spot earlier in the day without hesitation.
I want some advice we can keep in mind as we look because I feel like we are going to keep running into this and 1. I'm afraid that if we take an unfinished apartment it won't get done in time for move-in date (but we can stay if necessary in our old apt. until they finish although that's complicated) and 2. the work might be subpar because I have no idea what they are actually putting in there. In both scenarios, we'd be locked into the lease and have little leverage. We don't want to play around with putting a deposit down because it is still a lot of money to gamble with, and we would lose a lot of time if it didn't work out. The problem is that we've been looking the whole month, and the stock is REALLY limited compared to the last few years. Apartments are going really fast, and I would hate to pass on one that seems perfect aside from the gut renovation and end up with nothing.
I don't trust brokers in Astoria whatsoever, so I can't give them the benefit of the doubt. I've used brokers in Manhattan and Queens, and they are by far the worst in Astoria..blatant liars, but no way to avoid them at all. They basically show up and 2 minutes later say if you don't want to take it we'll rent to someone else. They don't work with you or negotiate with the owner. They just want the fee asap. Should we just say forget it until it's done? But there is a good chance that someone else will rent it before then, or at what point do we say "ok you are making progress, so let's move forward". When they finish the floors? When they put in cabinets? Should we avoid this altogether? Or am I exaggerating? I've had some really bad experiences with renting, so I could be paranoid. Help!
I rented an apartment in Harlem once that was being gut renovated. When I saw it it had no in the kitchen, a wall missing, only a tub in the bathroom and like you explained dusty, wires, etc. The day I moved in was the first day I saw it. I loved it. I screamed literally because I loved it. I was a bit worried how it would come together but it did and it was a great building. Mine was a big complex..
I want some advice we can keep in mind as we look because I feel like we are going to keep running into this and 1. I'm afraid that if we take an unfinished apartment it won't get done in time for move-in date (but we can stay if necessary in our old apt. until they finish although that's complicated) and 2. the work might be subpar because I have no idea what they are actually putting in there. In both scenarios, we'd be locked into the lease and have little leverage.
If it's not ready by the move-in date, they're in breach of the lease. So I think you'd have some leverage. Sure, the work might be subpar, but that's always a risk; you can move into a finished apartment and the facilties might be subpar too.
If the crews are actually working, it doesn't take that long to gut an apartment.
I think in most cases if the landlord is taking the time and money to rip the place apart like that they are going to put it back together in a condition what wont require that it's re-renovated for a good amount of time.
Yes, renting in NYC is not simple, easy, nor for the uninitiated Transplant!
That said, the main issue is 'your expectations' vs 'what you can afford'!!!
Knowing Astoria intimately, and the RE market, generally. Your issue is money!
It would appear that you are looking at apartments in OLDER buildings. Apartments which were or continue to be rent stabilized, but with renovation the LL is bringing the apt to market rate (either stabilized or non-).
Rent for these apts run in the middle between old crappier apts in smaller buildings, non renovated apts in larger older buildings, and newly built modern buildings.
Renovated apts in larger buildings run roughly $1600 to $1800 or so. Unrenovated, roughly $1200 to $1500. Crappy, $1200 and less; how much less? Depends on just how small and crappy. Basement apts generally the cheapest. Newly built, rougly $2000 give or take a couple hundred, or more.
You could rent "NEW", then there w/b no issue, but of course money is the issue.
You could look in Hunters Point, where all the buildings are newly built Manhattan style apartment towers, and there w/b no issues, but money is the issue.
What you need to accept is that the "quality" of the renovation will most certainly be greater than a unrenovated apartment in an older mostly rent stabilized/controlled building!!!
Take solace in that reality, and in a 1 year lease. One year isn't long!
What you could do, is to ask to see an apt in the building which has already been renovated. You should also ask to see one which has not been renovated, nor as yet gutted. If you are so lucky, you'll have a comparative.
I would also suggest that your previous poor rental experiences were do, again, to your naivete, poor comprehension of NYC's rental market, and your over expectation of what you can afford, and where you can afford.
Unfortunately, it can take a while and poor experiences for Transplants to realize their middle or lower middle financial status and, that of most of Manhattan and the trendy popular outer borough neighborhoods do not coincide, and are priced for upper middle incomes and above.
I suggest you realistically consider this reality. Perhaps, now having given up on Manhattan, you simply need to push out further into the boroughs, where you'll find cheaper rents, larger spaces, and likely acceptable quality, though a longer commute and less fashionable neighborhood.
My fear would be that once a landlord has a lease in his hand for a torn up apartment, there is no incentive to finsh the job in any but the shoddiest manner.
I also recoil at those people who BUY an apartment while looking at only a foundation. MANY have regretted that move later.
Maybe it's just me but I want to SEE what I am buying.
My fear would be that once a landlord has a lease in his hand for a torn up apartment, there is no incentive to finsh the job in any but the shoddiest manner.
[Snip]
Maybe it's just me but I want to SEE what I am buying.
First, you aren't buying anything.
Second, HOW would it benefit the LL on a ONE year lease???
The circumstance is like any other apt. You don't like it, you move! Just because place looks good, doesn't mean it is good.
Yes, renting in NYC is not simple, easy, nor for the uninitiated Transplant!
That said, the main issue is 'your expectations' vs 'what you can afford'!!!
Knowing Astoria intimately, and the RE market, generally. Your issue is money!
It would appear that you are looking at apartments in OLDER buildings. Apartments which were or continue to be rent stabilized, but with renovation the LL is bringing the apt to market rate (either stabilized or non-).
Rent for these apts run in the middle between old crappier apts in smaller buildings, non renovated apts in larger older buildings, and newly built modern buildings.
Renovated apts in larger buildings run roughly $1600 to $1800 or so. Unrenovated, roughly $1200 to $1500. Crappy, $1200 and less; how much less? Depends on just how small and crappy. Basement apts generally the cheapest. Newly built, rougly $2000 give or take a couple hundred, or more.
You could rent "NEW", then there w/b no issue, but of course money is the issue.
You could look in Hunters Point, where all the buildings are newly built Manhattan style apartment towers, and there w/b no issues, but money is the issue.
What you need to accept is that the "quality" of the renovation will most certainly be greater than a unrenovated apartment in an older mostly rent stabilized/controlled building!!!
Take solace in that reality, and in a 1 year lease. One year isn't long!
What you could do, is to ask to see an apt in the building which has already been renovated. You should also ask to see one which has not been renovated, nor as yet gutted. If you are so lucky, you'll have a comparative.
I would also suggest that your previous poor rental experiences were do, again, to your naivete, poor comprehension of NYC's rental market, and your over expectation of what you can afford, and where you can afford.
Unfortunately, it can take a while and poor experiences for Transplants to realize their middle or lower middle financial status and, that of most of Manhattan and the trendy popular outer borough neighborhoods do not coincide, and are priced for upper middle incomes and above.
I suggest you realistically consider this reality. Perhaps, now having given up on Manhattan, you simply need to push out further into the boroughs, where you'll find cheaper rents, larger spaces, and likely acceptable quality, though a longer commute and less fashionable neighborhood.
Did your wife leave you last night? Because you are very angry. It's not healthy..you are going to give yourself a coronary.
My question wasn't about what we can afford in Astoria, but thank you for your concern over my potentially unrealistic expectations, my state of origin and my socioeconomic status.
How you made the leap from my post to assuming that we are clueless country folk trying to hang on to the fringes of the stereotypical Manhattan lifestyle while towing the poverty line I have no idea.
1. I'm from New York
2. Unlike you who knows Astoria intimately but the neighborhood's real estate market generally, I happen to know both intimately having lived there for years, so I'm actually better qualified to give myself price vs. quality advice than you are. I didn't ask for that anyway, so I'm not sure why it was given to me.
3. Money is not an issue. We are paying more now than we would pay for a luxury apartment in Astoria. We are intentionally looking at older buildings because we want a rent stabilized place, and we don't like new construction. I see no reason to pay extra for a cookie cutter apartment in a crappy location because it has a mini-terrace and a dryer.
4. We are not interested in a 1 year lease. We are looking for a secure, long-term home where we don't have to worry about ridiculous rent increases. We have new landlords this year who are not renewing any of the market rate leases, and we don't want to deal with this again. We can find a rent stabilized apartment in Astoria, and we already know we are comfortable there. We have no desire to move next year, which is why I'm concerned with taking an unfinished apartment without knowing what it's going to look like.
My question was about people's experiences with renting apartments that were in the beginning stages of a gut renovation project. It had nothing to do with affordability or average rents in Astoria. When your train of logic goes that far off track, that's how you know it's time to cut back on the daytime drinking.
My fear would be that once a landlord has a lease in his hand for a torn up apartment, there is no incentive to finsh the job in any but the shoddiest manner.
I also recoil at those people who BUY an apartment while looking at only a foundation. MANY have regretted that move later.
Maybe it's just me but I want to SEE what I am buying.
That was one of my concerns because we are only looking at rent stabilized apartments, and they know we are interested in a long-term situation. Landlords in Astoria can be shady, so while it sounds counterproductive in the long run, it's not that far off the mark when you are talking about an apt. that will be potentially locked into a long-term rent stabilized lease.
Personal experience:
I closed on an apartment a month before I moved in.
Just before closing I checked on the apartment and they were working furiously "getting it ship-shape for me." One guy said that he hoped to have more time to finish.
So I gave iit to him...a month more.
But when I moved in, NOTHING had been done from the instant I saw the apartment 4 weeks earlier and signed on the dotted line. So I did the work. Nothing major, but buying and installing rods and shelves in closets and fixing almost every unsliding drawer in my kitchen, buying and replacing ceiling fixtures, replacing electrical switches and plugs paiinted shut over the years, and a LOT of cleaning.
Upside, it was all done RIGHT.
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