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Arrest is a huge overreach and abuse of power that hi-lights the ridiculousness of the police state. If they do such a disturbing dance then issue a ticket. But don't arrest someone and put them in the system for something like this. Rapes, murders, assault and battery, vandalism and theft should be the focus for the system, not petty things.
Of course, if they don't have an id on them the cops can't simply ticket them. They'd have to arrest them. Or doing these acrobatics might violate parole or something, if these kids already have legal issues.
Whenever you make something a ticketable offense you ensure some people will be arrested.
The fact is that white boys are not performing acrobatics in people's faces as the train moves and then demanding, again in people's faces, money for the "entertainment." Or at least never that I have seen.
That said, in fact, I saw the police confronting a few white musicians at 14th street - in the station, again, not flipping around and harassing people on the train - the other day.
They packed up and left immediately and while doing so nobody mentioned "race" as a reason for the police acting.
The ones you regularly see performing in subway stations have permits from the city. Clearly the musicians the cops confronted who left didn't have their permits in order.
I generally don't mind the subway musicians/performers. I said generally, because I have seen some come across with a bit too much attitude when no one wanted to participate in the act (this man this cursed at everyone in the car). But overall if a subway musician performs well and makes me day better I'm happy to donate a dollar.
I'm a subway train operator/motorman. Arresting them is an EXCELLENT use of police resources. What they do is dangerous to themselves and passengers , not to mention it is a huge annoyance to most people. Being very annoying aside , the dance moves they execute can result in them kicking or hitting someone , and if the trains emergency brakes suddenly apply or are tripped by an object on the tracks and the train comes to a rapid halt while they are in mid-movement they can fall and get hurt , and also fall into or hit and injure a passenger/passengers.
I always personally tell performers to stop , and so far they have. If they don't , then I will refuse to move the train until they do and make sure to radio ahead for the police.
This HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH RACISM. Yes , I am white , and YES If it was a single white guy or a group of white guys trying to hook a disco ball up to the roof of the subway car and pretend to be Tony Manero from Saturday Night Fever doing spins and moves around the car , I would handle the situation the EXACT same way. It would either stop or police would get called in. Period.
Understand that if someone gets hurt in a subway car and there was a police officer or MTA employee who ignored the illegal and dangerous dancing , there could be a lawsuit. Police AND MTA employees are MANDATED to act on this issue. A conductor or train operator is NOT mandated to personally tell the performers to stop , only report it and call it in , but I and many other train operators DO tell the performers to stop and we DO NOT have to move the train if we deem we cannot do so with complete safety for not only the passengers , but interestingly enough , the "performers" themselves.
To anyone turning this into a race issue , I am going to say grow up and stop the b.s. ... The rules apply to everyone , and yes , I and we (MTA employees) do tell white people playing music or breaking rules to stop it. They don't get free passes , and you know that. I would have the back of and support any police officer or MTA employee who is NOT WHITE telling any WHITE performer to cease any dangerous activity on the train or face the legal consequences.
Doing something wrong or illegal is doing something wrong or illegal. Period. Just because it's not AS BAD as something else DOESN'T make it ok. Yes , break dancing on a train is the not the equivalent of murder or armed robbery , but it is still wrong and dangerous , and illegal , period.
The performances will only stop when there are real consequences. Being arrested for reckless endangerment is a just and right consequence , and is VERY effective in getting this illegal behavior to stop.
The MTA and the NYPD are right to address this VERY UNSAFE and VERY ANNOYING act , and I encourage any riders of any race to report illegal or unsafe acts committed by anyone on the train of any race to the police or train crews.
Arrest is a huge overreach and abuse of power that hi-lights the ridiculousness of the police state. If they do such a disturbing dance then issue a ticket. But don't arrest someone and put them in the system for something like this. Rapes, murders, assault and battery, vandalism and theft should be the focus for the system, not petty things.
I respect your opinion. On a personal level I also am very much against the militarization of the police in America , and the growing police and "nanny" state that America is turning into.
That said , this is not a "petty" issue. It is a legitimate and real safety and quality of life issue.
Going to give you a 'rep' point anyway so there are no hard feelings.
I'm a subway train operator/motorman. Arresting them is an EXCELLENT use of police resources. What they do is dangerous to themselves and passengers , not to mention it is a huge annoyance to most people. Being very annoying aside , the dance moves they execute can result in them kicking or hitting someone , and if the trains emergency brakes suddenly apply or are tripped by an object on the tracks and the train comes to a rapid halt while they are in mid-movement they can fall and get hurt , and also fall into or hit and injure a passenger/passengers.
I always personally tell performers to stop , and so far they have. If they don't , then I will refuse to move the train until they do and make sure to radio ahead for the police.
This HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH RACISM. Yes , I am white , and YES If it was a single white guy or a group of white guys trying to hook a disco ball up to the roof of the subway car and pretend to be Tony Manero from Saturday Night Fever doing spins and moves around the car , I would handle the situation the EXACT same way. It would either stop or police would get called in. Period.
Understand that if someone gets hurt in a subway car and there was a police officer or MTA employee who ignored the illegal and dangerous dancing , there could be a lawsuit. Police AND MTA employees are MANDATED to act on this issue. A conductor or train operator is NOT mandated to personally tell the performers to stop , only report it and call it in , but I and many other train operators DO tell the performers to stop and we DO NOT have to move the train if we deem we cannot do so with complete safety for not only the passengers , but interestingly enough , the "performers" themselves.
To anyone turning this into a race issue , I am going to say grow up and stop the b.s. ... The rules apply to everyone , and yes , I and we (MTA employees) do tell white people playing music or breaking rules to stop it. They don't get free passes , and you know that. I would have the back of and support any police officer or MTA employee who is NOT WHITE telling any WHITE performer to cease any dangerous activity on the train or face the legal consequences.
Doing something wrong or illegal is doing something wrong or illegal. Period. Just because it's not AS BAD as something else DOESN'T make it ok. Yes , break dancing on a train is the not the equivalent of murder or armed robbery , but it is still wrong and dangerous , and illegal , period.
The performances will only stop when there are real consequences. Being arrested for reckless endangerment is a just and right consequence , and is VERY effective in getting this illegal behavior to stop.
The MTA and the NYPD are right to address this VERY UNSAFE and VERY ANNOYING act , and I encourage any riders of any race to report illegal or unsafe acts committed by anyone on the train of any race to the police or train crews.
The major acrobatic offender is WHITE with a killer body, and he always has a head or face wound from crashing into the subway ceiling. I saw his flying foot miss a guys face by an inch.
His confreres who do less dangerous acrobatics are black...they do the pole dance thing.
The major acrobatic offender is WHITE with a killer body, and he always has a head or face wound from crashing into the subway ceiling. I saw his flying foot miss a guys face by an inch.
His confreres who do less dangerous acrobatics are black...they do the pole dance thing.
I have no problem with the "acrobatic" dancers if they stay on the streets, put that jumping, flipping & yelling into a crowded & enclosed space & it is annoying at best & dangerous usually. Definitely a public danger & a candidate for arrest.... no comparison to those musicians who play instruments or sing no matter what their race or ethnicity.
The performances will only stop when there are real consequences. Being arrested for reckless endangerment is a just and right consequence , and is VERY effective in getting this illegal behavior to stop.
It's relatively easy to arrest, but more taxing to actually create viable solutions.
The city needs to develop and fund viable youth/young adult job training "trade" programs. Young people need access to good training and jobs which pay a livable wage.
It's relatively easy to arrest, but more taxing to actually create viable solutions.
The city needs to develop and fund viable youth/young adult job training "trade" programs. Young people need access to good training and jobs which pay a livable wage.
True.
And I personally do ask the performers to stop so that if they do , I DO NOT have to call for police. I give them the option to stop first. I could just sit at the controls and call for police and let them deal with it. Even though the performers don't like it if I tell them to stop , I am actually giving them a break by doing it that way first.
The MTA does have a program for performers and artists and musicians to apply to. I am not familiar with the details. But there are people who do art and play music in the system legally and in safe places to do so. I do not object to these performers being allowed to perform in a set up in a stationary area where they safely can and people in the system can chose to see them or walk on by and not be forced to endure it.
The city also does have youth and adult training and trade programs. The problem is once someone has the training or learns a trade there are not enough jobs. Many people are out there , especially young , who DO have qualifications and skills but cannot find work.
Still ... giving you a rep point , I understand where you are coming from.
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