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I like a lot of personal development stuff out there, but sometimes I have to question the veracity of some of it. This quote does not ring true to me:
"Apologizing does not always mean you are wrong and the other person is right. It means you value your relationship more than your ego."
?????????
While I understand expressing sympathy for something painful that someone is going through that isn't our fault, like a loved one dying or an illness, that type of "I'm sorry (to hear that)" is worlds apart from APOLOGIZING. Apologizing implies fault and taking responsibility for it, then asking forgiveness, changing behavior, and rebuilding trust. If we don't feel that we are in the wrong, how is offering an apology going to help the relationship prosper and grow and remain authentic. Isn't giving a false apology as bad as not giving an apology when one is due?
I get what is meant about valuing ego over a relationship. I had a friendship end when the friend betrayed me but didn't apologize and in fact said "we can't be real friends because you don't understand where I am coming from" (meaning her mom had been critical of her, so sometimes she acts out...fifty years later!). Instead of owning up to what she had done, she saved face by shifting the blame on to me, that I was the person with deficits in those instance since I wasn't understanding/excusing her behavior. So was I valuing my ego by not saying "That's okay. I understand you had some issues with your mother, so of course I will always be okay with whatever you do?" Should I have apologized?
Too many people never apologize or do the non-apology (a woman who was charged with making terroristic racist threats at a kid's birthday party said she was "sorry that this happened to you (the birthday party people)"---it didn't just happen. She was responsible for it! But never did she say "I am sorry I did this to you and caused so much pain"). But some of us apologize too readily. I've been guilty of saying "Sorry" or "excuse me" when someone bumps into me!
And if someone values a relationship so much that they are willing to apologize for something they didn't do/aren't sorry for, does this necessarily show that they value it? Or just that they are desperately attached to it and will do whatever it takes to keep it going? Does it really say much for the relationship if it requires not being true to oneself just to appease the other person?
Has anyone else ever apologized just to keep a relationship going? Were you glad you did? And is anyone else working on not automatically apologizing for everything/stupid little things, saving apologies for times when they are really indicated?
Well, there are a LOT of different questions in your post, but in terms of the meaning of "apology," I think the definition you provided is definitely a western version.
The etymology of "apology," when you look at the meaning of the Greek words it comes from, is "apo-," meaning "away from," and "logy" from "logos," meaning story.
So if you strip the connotations down to the actual meaning of the word, you can see where it just means you are deviating from the original comments you made.
In terms of the quote you referenced, an apology CAN mean you just have regret that you are having a conflict with someone you care about and not that you are admitting you are WRONG.
But some of us apologize too readily. I've been guilty of saying "Sorry" or "excuse me" when someone bumps into me!..........
Has anyone else ever apologized just to keep a relationship going? Were you glad you did? And is anyone else working on not automatically apologizing for everything/stupid little things, saving apologies for times when they are really indicated?
I laughed when I read that you apologize when someone bumps into you. I have done that too. (I've also had the rare moment when someone has mowed me down without a thought and I've audibly said, "Excuse you!") I'm amused when the dog and I do that little getting around each other dance and I say,"Excuse me".
I don't believe in insincere apologies. Some people are masters of the un-apology. "I'm sorry you got your feelings hurt". Or just, "I'm sorry your feelings were hurt." No acknowledgment of their own role in the situation even when it's considerable.
I had an often prickly friend whose offense detector was generally set on "High". This was ironic as she was the one of our group to be overtly rude and condescending toward others on a not infrequent basis. I would usually address her behavior in a matter-of-fact way. Something like, "Now, would you want someone to say that to or about you?" Or, "Wow! What brought that on?" I also was given to apologizing for her because she wouldn't. (E.g to a chastened restaurant server, who, Heaven forbid, hadn't gotten all 30 special order instructions exactly right.) Then my highly peeved friend expected me to apologize to her for embarrassing her (to whom I should owe a higher loyalty). I often said, "I'm sure you know my intent wasn't to hurt you, but, how would you feel if you were on the receiving end of that?" Anything short of "I'm sorry," was insufficient and, that wasn't happening. We do the best we can do. Sometimes we can only acknowledge our own behavior and make clear there was no malice or careless disregard in our intentions. We all filter through our own lens and it helps to at least get a little more clarity even if that's not all we're hoping for.
I have eaten my share of crow. Sometimes an "I'm sorry, I was wrong," is the only right thing. Harder to get it out with some folks than with others.
With this election, I could see a couple of conversations headed for the ditch and I said, "Let's just agree to disagree. No matter our views, I love you. Let's hash this out in a year." Better to head any perceived need for an apology off at the pass if you can see it coming and reasonably avoid it.
This makes me laugh because one I was dating a guy and it was early on in the dating, but we had known each other via work. After some sort of argument, one of us stubborn ones had to do something and I chose to be the one. But carefully. 'I am sorry for MY PART in our disagreement.'
He sat there for a second and then busted up. He said 'That was hard, wasn't it?' Yes, it was! LOL! Anyway, that sometimes works and was honest but not sacrificing anything.
I recently had a dust up with a good friend and there was no way to apologize and no I didn't conjure one up.
She was going to have to apologize or we were going to have to just leave it and move on from it, and we apparently chose the latter.
And I guess we both know we simply don't want to talk about that particular topic anymore because she has her defensiveness up about it too high.
People that are not able to offer a sincere apology when a situation clearly warrants one lacks integrity and are usually insecure.
Here is an example - Someone is late meeting you for lunch or dinner they show up late and don't say, sorry to have kept you waiting. That is just common courtesy to apologize if you keep someone waiting, show some manners.
People that are not able to offer a sincere apology when a situation clearly warrants one lacks integrity and are usually insecure.
Here is an example - Someone is late meeting you for lunch or dinner they show up late and don't say, sorry to have kept you waiting. That is just common courtesy to apologize if you keep someone waiting, show some manners.
I saw something that advised to be more 'positive' by saying 'thanks for waiting for me!' Instead of apologizing. I didn't feel that is more 'positive' I felt it manipulative to deny the person their rightful apology and to force them to be gracious about it, which presumably they were apt to anyway but might feel chafed at it being forced.
I guess that scenario depends on the dynamics of the people involved. I don't think that is right for a friendship. I had an Aunt do that to me and I didn't like it. She said I appreciate you being generous about ..... and I said I'm not! I think that was really wrong and awful! so she switched to 'you're right, I'm a terrible person'. I felt manipulated a second time - now I have to soothe her and say no you're not.
Anyway, that's my take on that. But some people are worth their little whatever's and we have to look past them, not ask them to change.
I don't believe in insincere apologies. Some people are masters of the un-apology. "I'm sorry you got your feelings hurt". Or just, "I'm sorry your feelings were hurt." No acknowledgment of their own role in the situation even when it's considerable.
That is what my friend did recently and I wasn't going for it. It really means 'I'm not sorry at all.'
But I think the OP is talking about a sincere apology when one doesn't feel it's warranted for the sake of the relationship. To me that depends on a whole host of factors.
I like a lot of personal development stuff out there, but sometimes I have to question the veracity of some of it. This quote does not ring true to me:
"Apologizing does not always mean you are wrong and the other person is right. It means you value your relationship more than your ego."
?????????
While I understand expressing sympathy for something painful that someone is going through that isn't our fault, like a loved one dying or an illness, that type of "I'm sorry (to hear that)" is worlds apart from APOLOGIZING. Apologizing implies fault and taking responsibility for it, then asking forgiveness, changing behavior, and rebuilding trust. If we don't feel that we are in the wrong, how is offering an apology going to help the relationship prosper and grow and remain authentic. Isn't giving a false apology as bad as not giving an apology when one is due?
I get what is meant about valuing ego over a relationship. I had a friendship end when the friend betrayed me but didn't apologize and in fact said "we can't be real friends because you don't understand where I am coming from" (meaning her mom had been critical of her, so sometimes she acts out...fifty years later!). Instead of owning up to what she had done, she saved face by shifting the blame on to me, that I was the person with deficits in those instance since I wasn't understanding/excusing her behavior. So was I valuing my ego by not saying "That's okay. I understand you had some issues with your mother, so of course I will always be okay with whatever you do?" Should I have apologized?
Too many people never apologize or do the non-apology (a woman who was charged with making terroristic racist threats at a kid's birthday party said she was "sorry that this happened to you (the birthday party people)"---it didn't just happen. She was responsible for it! But never did she say "I am sorry I did this to you and caused so much pain"). But some of us apologize too readily. I've been guilty of saying "Sorry" or "excuse me" when someone bumps into me!
And if someone values a relationship so much that they are willing to apologize for something they didn't do/aren't sorry for, does this necessarily show that they value it? Or just that they are desperately attached to it and will do whatever it takes to keep it going? Does it really say much for the relationship if it requires not being true to oneself just to appease the other person?
Has anyone else ever apologized just to keep a relationship going? Were you glad you did? And is anyone else working on not automatically apologizing for everything/stupid little things, saving apologies for times when they are really indicated?
From time to time I have apologized to keep the peace, and because I felt that perhaps I had inadvertently hurt feelings or some other thing. But I think what the quote might refer to is, sometimes people do get their feelings hurt, or blame you for something you did not mean to do, and it is just easier to apologize.
What I hate, is the sort of apology that really isn't. "I'm so sorry if something I said or did caused you pain." It is as if the apologizer doesn't believe he or she did any thing wrong. Or, that he or she is actually in the right and is apologizing without admitting malice, or desire to harm, or even that harm was done.
If you apologize, just apologize. Say "I'm sorry for saying (or doing) that thing and I am sorry to have caused you pain." "Or I'm sorry my error screwed up the copy machine. I'll pay better attention in the future." Or similar. Own the error and apologize. Or if you are trying to keep the peace with kids or other family, try to see their side, and apologize. ("I was wrong and I regret it" almost always covers whatever it is in this case.)
Some people never learn to say "thank you" as well. Some never learn to tell people they love that they love them. And some people never apologize.
I saw something that advised to be more 'positive' by saying 'thanks for waiting for me!' Instead of apologizing. I didn't feel that is more 'positive' I felt it manipulative to deny the person their rightful apology and to force them to be gracious about it, which presumably they were apt to anyway but might feel chafed at it being forced.
I guess that scenario depends on the dynamics of the people involved. I don't think that is right for a friendship. I had an Aunt do that to me and I didn't like it. She said I appreciate you being generous about ..... and I said I'm not! I think that was really wrong and awful! so she switched to 'you're right, I'm a terrible person'. I felt manipulated a second time - now I have to soothe her and say no you're not.
Anyway, that's my take on that. But some people are worth their little whatever's and we have to look past them, not ask them to change.
I agree with you, it's not positive to say, "Thanks for waiting for me." This is ridiculous! This just really makes it ok for the late person to keep on time people waiting. There's no responsibility being taken with this lame comment.
It's just a way for the late person not to be accountable and act like an adult and simply say, "I apologize for being late."
It really does speak volumes to the person that can't, won't or just unwilling to offer a simple apology. They appear very little and I'll mannered.
Also, to the relative that quickly took the pity party role, that just pathetic.
This behavior is so immature.
It seems basic to be able to apologize but some people would rather not do the right thing by simply saying, I apologize ... Instead deflect from themselves by saying something like, "it's too bad your feelings were hurt" or pull the self-pity "oh, I'm just a terrible person ..." (Ok well you're the one saying it)
Geez ! Grow up people be accountable and behave like a mature adult !
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