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Old 09-21-2009, 07:12 PM
 
76 posts, read 126,946 times
Reputation: 36

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nomadicus View Post
Good luck but I suspect anyone in your shoes is going to lose weight. Not by choice. I'd rather work than eat out of dumpsters.
Well that is why I need suggestions on how to make the argument to my parents. My mom is starting to cave, but my dad is still being firm. From my perspective the decision to be a parent entails certain responsibility.
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Old 09-21-2009, 07:17 PM
 
26,142 posts, read 31,215,888 times
Reputation: 27242
Quote:
Originally Posted by enamdar View Post
Isn't it irresponsible for parents to have children if they can not support them for life? After all it is the parent's choice to have children not the child's. Doesn't responsibility follow only from free choice?
OH grow up! When they pass away then what are you going to do?
I think your arguement is just a lot of B S to hide and compensate for being down right lazy.

You will never find a place in this world that doesn't have some sort of authority you have to answer to and by living under your parents roof - you have given authority to them. So, get over yourself. You can't function in a world with authority, but it's okay for your parents to work for authority and pay for the food you eat and the roof over your head. So you are benefiting from exactly what you say you despise.

If you don't want to work for someone else then start your own business, but even then you still have rules and laws to abide by. If you believe in God then you should be aware that sloth is one of the seven deadly sins.

GET A JOB!

Side Note: I think I smell troll.
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Old 09-21-2009, 07:18 PM
B4U
 
Location: the west side of "paradise"
3,612 posts, read 8,302,800 times
Reputation: 4443
This troll needs a military whoopin"!
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Old 09-21-2009, 07:22 PM
 
76 posts, read 126,946 times
Reputation: 36
I think it really narrows discussion, whenever anything outside the mainstream is called "trolling". It is one thing to disagree with my position, its another to say it is entirely illegitimate and that no real person could feel as I do. You have my word that I have had these actual discussions with my dad, and this is a situation I'm facing.

Did any of y'all see Neil Fergueson's ascent of money. He said that businessmen need the carrot of vast wealth and workers the stick of dire poverty in order to keep the economy running. Well if you didn't treat me like a horse, a mere beast of burden. But as a human personality, who knows what I could accomplish? Thomas Jefferson, Aristotle, Socrates all the Greeks, they didn't have to work for a living. Did they become lazy bums? If I were free to work freely. I wouldn't be a couch potato. I would sculpture my body into a work of art. I would tame nature. I would change the course of mighty rivers. I would take part in industry. I would study natural science and philosophy and explore the depths of metaphysics. I would write poetry, paint artwork, sing hymns. Who knows what a free me, would be capable of? So its that I need a chance to do, not freedom to sit on my butt.

That is what is lost, when a soul like mine is enchained to a Jabba the hutt boss.

As shocking as it may sound I find your mode of life, and decision to accept work as irrational as you find my rejection. I don't understand why and human being would submit himself to this sort of existence. Of course the easy answer is you gotta eat. But that eatings for the sake of eating, thats purchasing life as the expense of the chains of slavery. Its selling your body nay your soul. Selling your body to a boss is like a prostitute selling herself to an extra sadistic John who wants to plat master. Work to survive. Why? So I can survive to work. Look I know from a functionalist practical perspective what I'm saying is nonsense and what you say is logical. But from a cosmic metaphysical perspective you folks are speaking gibberish, and my nonsense is perfectly rational. Which is right? Since when was the worm's eye view so superior to the bird's eye view. Why is it so blindingly obvious that the small picture trumps the big picture?

Why I haven't been as insulting, to be honest the life you folks have accepted seems just as crazy to me as mine does to you.

Perhaps people are being defensive because the questions I'm posing necessitate major value judgments upon your life choices. Everyone here has implicity already answered my question in their own lives without ever really asking it. Every decision in your life has a purpose, eat to be full, get money to get a car, get a car to attract girls to have a wife and kids etc. But if you follow the infinite regress you get what Thomas Aquinas called the sunnum bonum. Now for me I can't so much as lift a pencil until I know what the ultimate aim of doing so is. So to shoot my cosmic perspective down without really addressing its core arguments is to defend your own mode of life.
There has to be another road.

Socrates, Plato, Aquinas, Hobbes, Locke, Hume, Kant, Hegel, Schopenhauer, Kierkegaard, Camus, Sartre. It all leads here. What is the good life? If you don't know what your ultimate aim is then your first move is a wrong move. Francis Bacon said method was everything. The fastest runner going down the wrong road, just goes further in the wrong direction.

This short youtube video from Schopenhauer, might give you an idea of my perspective:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S7pwItrhEZo
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Old 09-21-2009, 07:27 PM
 
Location: Covington County, Alabama
259,024 posts, read 90,713,101 times
Reputation: 138568
My opinion is that you should work as much as you read. This nation was founded on work or starve. English Gentlemen learned the hard way. I'd sure like to congratulate your father on his firmness.
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Old 09-21-2009, 07:27 PM
 
26,142 posts, read 31,215,888 times
Reputation: 27242
Hey, why not just type the entire book "War and Peace" into a thread
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Old 09-21-2009, 07:28 PM
 
Location: West Michigan
12,083 posts, read 38,896,006 times
Reputation: 17006
This is a troll thread all the way. Anybody this self absorbed and full of BS wouldn't be here to get ideas from us lackeys that actually work for a living and chat on an online forum.

Here let me take care of this poster, I just bought a new can, using money I made at a real job.
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Old 09-21-2009, 07:29 PM
 
Location: West Michigan
12,083 posts, read 38,896,006 times
Reputation: 17006
IF you are not a Troll, then get off your ass and start your own company so you won't be enslaved to Jabba yourself.
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Old 09-21-2009, 07:33 PM
 
1,591 posts, read 3,556,474 times
Reputation: 1176
You sound like you are brilliant. Go get your PhD and teach philosophy.
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Old 09-21-2009, 07:33 PM
 
76 posts, read 126,946 times
Reputation: 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bydand View Post
IF you are not a Troll, then get off your ass and start your own company so you won't be enslaved to Jabba yourself.
Well isn't the accusation of trolling, itself proof of just how unfree the decision to get a job is. If Choice A is an actual choice, then Choice B can not be totally illegitimate.

I've read myself into heresy. I can't match up my metaphysical ideas with the reconciliation and affirmation of the existing world that comes with working at a job.

And of course you can't be an entrepreneur without capital to begin with.

Why is it so crazy or outrageous to bring in metaphysical questions about the cruelty of existence and human nature into consideration on how to live one's life? You have to examine the world before deciding you want to be a part of it. Existence precedes essence.

Power is a philosophical concept but it is also a "real" concept. And work relations are fundamentally about power. So Nietzsche's cruel will to power and human nature are not as irrelevant as you may think. For me getting a job means accepting the cruel nature of reality as it is. For you on the board that simply means growing up, for me thats not a given.

Whether the exchange relation between your labor and the boss capital is authoritarian or not is a debatable theoretical point. What is not debatable is who has the authority in the actual workplace. So your not just exchanging labor your exchanging power. Its about domination and submission. Your boss has as much omnipotent power over your life as the Old Testament God did. No one's who actually worked on a job would be crazy enough to claim that the boss-employee relationship is not authoritarian. Has anyone here ever actually worked for a boss?Why is it so crazy or outrageous to bring in metaphysical questions about the cruelty of existence and human nature into consideration on how to live one's life? You have to examine the world before deciding you want to be a part of it. Existence precedes essence.

Power is a philosophical concept but it is also a "real" concept. And work relations are fundamentally about power. So Nietzsche's cruel will to power and human nature are not as irrelevant as you may think. For me getting a job means accepting the cruel nature of reality as it is. For you on the board that simply means growing up, for me thats not a given.

Whether the exchange relation between your labor and the boss capital is authoritarian or not is a debatable theoretical point. What is not debatable is who has the authority in the actual workplace. So your not just exchanging labor your exchanging power. Its about domination and submission. Your boss has as much omnipotent power over your life as the Old Testament God did. No one's who actually worked on a job would be crazy enough to claim that the boss-employee relationship is not authoritarian. Has anyone here ever actually worked for a boss?
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