Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I am not totally unsympathetic to the OP. However, I struggle with this kind of logic alot. The notion seems to be that all of us ought to assist parents raising children with tax dollars for pre-school etc. I guess what comes to my mind is why is this type of behavior more worthy of assistance than say helping to subsidize a 20 year old who is having difficulty paying for college. What is going to be of more benefit to our society? As a country, we are spending far more money than we are currently taking it.
DW and I were childfree for the first seven years of our marriage. My sister is about 60 and chose to be childfree so she could focus on a career as a college professor.
We make choices in life and all of those choices have consequences that are attached to them. One of my greatest fears is that if we started subsidizing having children with preschools and other assistance that some women would never stop having children. I have talked to some women who see pregnancy as some kind of religious experience. Some people really believe that business in the Bible about "being fruitful and multiplying". This is a modern society that is struggling with problems of air pollution, global warming, and depletion of non-renewable resources. I am reluctant to anything that would encourage people to have extra children.
I am not totally unsympathetic to the OP. However, I struggle with this kind of logic alot. The notion seems to be that all of us ought to assist parents raising children with tax dollars for pre-school etc. I guess what comes to my mind is why is this type of behavior more worthy of assistance than say helping to subsidize a 20 year old who is having difficulty paying for college. What is going to be of more benefit to our society? As a country, we are spending far more money than we are currently taking it.
DW and I were childfree for the first seven years of our marriage. My sister is about 60 and chose to be childfree so she could focus on a career as a college professor.
We make choices in life and all of those choices have consequences that are attached to them. One of my greatest fears is that if we started subsidizing having children with preschools and other assistance that some women would never stop having children. I have talked to some women who see pregnancy as some kind of religious experience. Some people really believe that business in the Bible about "being fruitful and multiplying". This is a modern society that is struggling with problems of air pollution, global warming, and depletion of non-renewable resources. I am reluctant to anything that would encourage people to have extra children.
I am not totally unsympathetic to the OP. However, I struggle with this kind of logic alot. The notion seems to be that all of us ought to assist parents raising children with tax dollars for pre-school etc. I guess what comes to my mind is why is this type of behavior more worthy of assistance than say helping to subsidize a 20 year old who is having difficulty paying for college. What is going to be of more benefit to our society? As a country, we are spending far more money than we are currently taking it.
DW and I were childfree for the first seven years of our marriage. My sister is about 60 and chose to be childfree so she could focus on a career as a college professor.
We make choices in life and all of those choices have consequences that are attached to them. One of my greatest fears is that if we started subsidizing having children with preschools and other assistance that some women would never stop having children. I have talked to some women who see pregnancy as some kind of religious experience. Some people really believe that business in the Bible about "being fruitful and multiplying". This is a modern society that is struggling with problems of air pollution, global warming, and depletion of non-renewable resources. I am reluctant to anything that would encourage people to have extra children.
IMO, the idea we should help parents goes back to a time when kids just kind of happened. Now we can choose when to have them and how many to have. Theoretically, we should need less help.
I think it's just an old fashioned idea that never died even after the need died out. There was a time when parents needed help because babies came when babies came and parents were often very young. Now, there is no reason to have kids before you're ready to have them and then you should be able to take care of them yourself.
I don't believe in paying people to have children. People should have children when they can afford them, and if they want them. Husbands obviously should help out, parents can work opposite shifts if they don't want to pay babysitters or day care.
I think many problems today are the result of women who figure they can retire to the welfare life by having babies and everyone else is expected to pay for them. These kids grow up watching nothing but a free ride and fail to learn any kind of work ethic.
...
As for the thread, I just think the mentality of moms being able to have it all & the womens movt of encouraging this has also set women back a lot. Maternity care? Well, can't we do it all with our eyes closed & one handed? Some of it has gotten out of hand & over the years, companies have been allowed not to give a darn b/c "super mom" will scream "EO!" yet turn around and complain she only got 6 weeks...
Why don't father's also get "maternity" leave? Why can't they call it something else? Why should mom's be able to have this time and not father's? I've always wondered this. Perhaps some companies do this, but I've never known one who did, and I feel that all should - at least the ones who are apt to offer it for mother's should also offer it for father's.
Last edited by haggardhouseelf; 05-09-2010 at 11:51 PM..
Hee hee... well... you may not like me as a mom, really, I can be pretty strict and I'm a stickler for a set bedtime, healthy foods, and good study habits. I'm also really boring!
I am not totally unsympathetic to the OP. However, I struggle with this kind of logic alot. The notion seems to be that all of us ought to assist parents raising children with tax dollars for pre-school etc. I guess what comes to my mind is why is this type of behavior more worthy of assistance than say helping to subsidize a 20 year old who is having difficulty paying for college. What is going to be of more benefit to our society? As a country, we are spending far more money than we are currently taking it.
...
You make a good point. However, I believe the push for preschool being made available to all and not just the very low-income who qualify for head start or the higher incomes who can afford private preschools is due to the fact that research and brain studies have shown that children who are given educational opportunities earlier in life during crucial "windows of opportunity" stages have higher success rates in school later on. I don't think they are wanting to offer preschool or begin public schooling earlier simply so that parents don't have to pay for day care or whatever.
Also, in the case of very low income situations, you're often talking about getting children, for a better part of the day, out of potentially harmful environments and into a positive place where they can be cared for in a healthier way and intellectually stimulated as well. This gives these children a much-needed leg-up and levels the playing field a bit for them for when they do start regular school. It also helps authorities monitor risky situations, as so many of these children are kept hidden from outside "interferences" by their frightened parents and then these high-risk families are not helped as they should and could be. I'm not saying all low-income families or families who live below the poverty levels are all bad, but the reality is that many of them are not able to care for children as they should. So programs are needed to help these children and families, just as much if not more-so than high school graduates trying to figure out ways to pay for college. (Just using the examples you presented...)
If I personally had to choose whether to help out young children born into desperate situations, or grown adults who are capable of working and planning and doing things for themselves, however overwhelming the challenge may feel or be for them... I'd choose helping the children without a doubt. Yes, it's unfortunate that people who perhaps shouldn't have children, do. And yes it angers me that we have to pay for other adults thoughtless breeding habits and poor choices. But that's the reality of where's we're at today as a society. Until we can change that somehow, we'll not really be able to move forward in many areas such as these. And who has the guts - in America - to try to tell people that they can or cannot bear children for whatever the reasons are, however logically and realistically substantiated? I don't see it ever happening, as much as I wish it would.
Why don't father's also get "maternity" leave? Why can't they call it something else? Why should mom's be able to have this time and not father's? I've always wondered this. Perhaps some companies do this, but I've never known one who did, and I feel that all should - at least the ones who are apt to offer it for mother's should also offer it for father's.
Fathers can take "family medical leave" like moms. The problem is no one pays for it, and some families can't go that long without an income. My brother in law is taking a few weeks off after his wife returns to work.
Why don't father's also get "maternity" leave? Why can't they call it something else? Why should mom's be able to have this time and not father's? I've always wondered this. Perhaps some companies do this, but I've never known one who did, and I feel that all should - at least the ones who are apt to offer it for mother's should also offer it for father's.
Our #3 is due this summer & my husband will be using his PTO time (paid time off) that is offered all employees of his company along w/ paid vacation days. In his particular position, he is also able to earn more PTO time throughout the year. His company (which is international, fairly large & nonunion) is very into wellness and family. Every summer they offer free tickets to major events in our area...for example, we live in a city w/ a MLB team...they offer 4 tickets & host a very nice picnic prior to the game...or you can choose a few year pass to the zoo. It's not perfect for my dh but there are some perks his company offers and PTO is AWESOME! He earns about 14-21 days a year plus paid vacation (14 days).
We were military & getting time off when #1 was born was close to impossible. Within 18 hours of delivery, my dh's company commander was calling him back into work. ( I have to back that up w/ the fact that they were days away from deploying to Iraq so reality was what it was there & neither of us were angry about it b/c again, it was what it was)
One of my friends dh's is a GM of a very popular brew pub in our area. For both births of their children, he has "tried" to take more than 48 hours off, but gets phone calls left & right & she just tells him to go back to work.
Reality is that business is business and we "choose" to have babies. Is it right? No. Does it need to be fixed? YES!
FMLA is abused beyond belief. My OBs nurse was telling me some stories at a past checkup...moms blatantly lie; get hostile; do what it takes to beat the system; ask the nurse to change dates so they get more time off; specific dates off & so on.
There are SO many obstacles and issues that go into it that could be debated for years...
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Will you be my mom?
