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It depends on what the student majors in. Everyone likes to harp on how useless history and English Literature M.S. programs are, but if you get your degrees and Ph.D. you can eventually teach and become a tenured professor. Sad our society now trashes anyone who has interests other than forensic accounting.
On the other side of the coin, the "green jobs" graduate certificates and programs do seem to be a fad, not seeing many at University going far with those, at least in some regions.
True that it depends on what you major in. Most "hard science" and finance majors learn to do things that many employers want done. There are degrees that are not worth much at the BS/BA level but if you keep going to the PhD level you have something (Psychology for example).
People can and do use English as a major as a launching pad to go into law school. Straight BA in English is not that much in demand, but if you write well, and maybe have a nodding familiarity with science and/or business topics, there are jobs out there.
Also depends on how good a "fit" the student is to a degree that will make them employable. A kid who likes to work with their hands can become a skilled tradesman - electrician, plumber, carpenter, boilermaker, pipefitter, welder, etc. - and at the higher levels of skill, while these tend to be hard work, it pays well. Many of these skilled trades are conducive to striking out on your own as an independent business (helps a lot to have an SO with serious business skills though).
Also depends on what school the kid goes to, and how it's financed.
If a kid borrows money to take a 4 year degree in "Grievance Studies", with a minor in Ferret Husbandry, yeah, the ROI is not going to be good.
There's a lot of snobbery in that statement, Chemistry_Guy. Like only the post HS educated can find satisfying jobs and careers, right?
I know a lot of degreed/salaried folk who spend substantial sums of money on various lottery tickets every week, and despite having some affluence already ... brag about their "plans" if and when they win. None of their plans include continuing to work ... it's all about recreation, travel, etc.
By the same token, I know a fair number of HS graduates in service businesses or trades who make decent money, are satisfied and happy with their lives ... and wouldn't change anything if they were to win the "big one". In fact, I have neighbors who have done so and continue to operate their dryland wheat farm as they have for the last 50 years.
This is very true - although, if you think about it, these wheat farmers and tradesmen don't have "just high school" - that may be all the *formal* schooling they have, but, I think you will agree, they know a lot of stuff that your typical high school kid does not know on graduation day.
For that matter, slightly off topic, I have been studying Russian for 15 years, a completely informal reading seminar, result of which is I read Russian almost as fast as English, and can understand normal conversation, I speak a bit haltingly with minor grammatical errors, and apparently like most native English speakers I have a distinct accent in Russian that's so far resisted my efforts to get rid of it (similar, I have heard, to the Indian accent when speaking English). But I don't have any certificates, diplomas, etc.
My point is that formal education in a college is not the only way to learn something. Which you illustrate well in your other post about tutoring kids in courses you never took...and it is true that (at least one of) the best way to study a subject, once you are past the basics, is to teach it.
ROI is case by case. Depending on many factors. In general, I would say that 20-30% of people benefit from higher education, while 70% do not...in terms of income. There are too many factors to use a blanket statement.
However, the cost of education has gotten out of hand over the past decade.
It seems that The Payscale.com website did a study comparing hundreds of colleges across the nation, and their “return on investment.â€
Now by my own calculating. If you graduate at 22 and work until your 65, you would have a working career of 43 years.
$1.7Million divided by 43 years gives you an average annual gross income of $39k. So that means that as an engineer from a tech college you can expect to work a minimum-wage job, slowly climb in salary and then peak maybe earning somewhere around $45k/year.
$1.7Million may sound like a lot, but when stretched out over 43 years, not so much.
The above is true within the framework its given of course.
What is slightly off about these types of calculations are the decisions that very good professionals are able to sustain over the long run. But they are likely lumped into the averages.
IMHO, if say for example I am a software engineer and am in a thriving industry like mobile tech and dont capitalize on good opportunities that come my way, I may never truly realize my earning potential due to complacency due to lack of interest in being a C level exec, run a team or drop out of corporate and consult. I see it all the time.
College degree professionals that work in some corporate fashion will almost ALWAYS have a crossroad they are going to have to contend with at some point in their career. Its the crossroad that comes down to building professional capital, experience and connections where they either head for C level or leave and consult. If they dont, well shame on them. There are tons of younger less expensive employees ready to take that position.
The fundamental difference is that a college degree gets a foot in the door for certain types of industries or jobs. After a decade or so they are just about on the same plane as the high school educated if they dont capitalize and seize good oppts when they arise.
Thus, the validity of the article is true but under its own circumstances. In todays society it pays to be resourceful and view yourself as an asset to a business. Not the other way around. This goes for anyone whether or not they went to college or not.
The most successful people I have met are the best when they have an honest and true understanding of what their value is to a business. The financial/wage aspect comes into play as a result of that value.
College isn't just about earning more, it's also about intellectual growth. Courses like philosophy or psychology might be "useless" in terms of employment opportunities, but I think they can really open one's mind.
That's why college should be free.
College isn't just about earning more, it's also about intellectual growth. Courses like philosophy or psychology might be "useless" in terms of employment opportunities, but I think they can really open one's mind.
That's why college should be free.
Great...just what we need. People questioning authority and debating about moral hazard in life
College isn't just about earning more, it's also about intellectual growth. Courses like philosophy or psychology might be "useless" in terms of employment opportunities, but I think they can really open one's mind.
That's why college should be free.
Thats why they invented a library. Colleges are for the piece of paper, and if you are treating them as anything different, you have issues.
If they 'should be free'; then who 'should be' paying for them?
The land, the buildings, the the paint, the janitors, the instructors, etc all require money from some source.
If the money 'should' come from employers; then the courses 'should' focus on training workers.
If the money 'should' come from the government; then the focus 'should' be on training good citizens.
If the money 'should' come from tax-payers; then only the upper 10% of our society's income earners 'should' decide what courses are offered [since they pay 90% of the taxes].
I'm glad of criteria like this, because it's really forcing colleges to finally justify the outrageous tuitions they charge. After all, they've been hiking tuition at a rate 4x inflation for roughly 40 years. I mean, anything within the top 200 is a good value, while it becomes a pretty iffy proposition when you get to the lower end of the scale.
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