Please Help! - Home search in a specific area (Monroe: houses, buying)

[hey man_its me]

Friends of ours live on Geisler Dr. in Forest Hills.

forest hills, pa - Google Maps

Nice, quiet neighborhood with houses that I think are reasonable but I never checked into it. There seemed to be quite a few houses up for sale there. I think many were "turnovers," older couples looking to get out of houses with stairs, etc. but I can't be sure. They aren't the biggest or best houses but most have decent yards and 2-3 bedrooms. Garages...well, can't say that I saw many there but the houses were on a little hill and it probably depends on what side of the street you would buy on.

[Scientist Mom]

Forest Hills is a nice, generally safe, mostly residential area. We know several families that live there. I recently discovered that they have very nice community pool that only residents and their guests can use. BUT the school district is one of the worst in the state. It will affect your resale value and if you have kids, you will most likely choose to send them to private school.

[IcedCoffee]

I lived in Forest Hills for a year and had a wonderful experience. Great location, and yes, the pool is really nice. Great neighbors, too. I think Forest Hills is a stable area - not getting better, but not getting worse. The school district is the only negative thing about it, but it didn't matter to me since I don't have kids

[robrobrob]

In my opinion, property taxes are pretty rough every where in Allegheny County. I think Forest Hills taxes are even higher than Bethel Parks. Most people are surprised to know that often taxes are higher in the poorer performing school districts.

For example, a house assessed for 100,000 pays the following property taxes:

Mt. Lebanon 3608
Forest Hills 3869
Fox Chapel 2864
Bethel Park 3184
West Mifflin 3495

So, if you are buying a house for 100,000 you will be paying the least amount of taxes in Fox Chapel. The most in Forest Hills.

I found this on the county's website not the individual municipal government sites. So it may not be that accurate.

So, if you are set on spending 180,000 on a house you are better off spending it in some areas than in others.

[BrianTH]

Originally Posted by robrobrob

Most people are surprised to know that often taxes are higher in the poorer performing school districts.

They really shouldn't be. It is a vicious cycle: worse schools lead to lower property prices which mean lower revenues for the same tax rate which can lead to even worse schools. At some point the school district has to increase its tax rate to get a minimal amount of revenues, but that just drives property prices even lower.

So, if you are set on spending 180,000 on a house you are better off spending it in some areas than in others.

Well, except $180K will get you a lot more house in some places than other places, and prices are often inversely related to tax rates. So, for example, what would be a $180K house in a higher-price/lower-rate jurisdiction may be a $120K house in a lower-price/higher-rate jurisdiction (or even less). You can use that fact to spend less on your house, or get more house, or a little of both (say by buying a $150K house in this hypothetical).

[robrobrob]

Originally Posted by BrianTH

They really shouldn't be. It is a vicious cycle: worse schools lead to lower property prices which mean lower revenues for the same tax rate which can lead to even worse schools. At some point the school district has to increase its tax rate to get a minimal amount of revenues, but that just drives property prices even lower.



Well, except $180K will get you a lot more house in some places than other places, and prices are often inversely related to tax rates. So, for example, what would be a $180K house in a higher-price/lower-rate jurisdiction may be a $120K house in a lower-price/higher-rate jurisdiction (or even less). You can use that fact to spend less on your house, or get more house, or a little of both (say by buying a $150K house in this hypothetical).

I understand but I disagree. Home buyers have a budget. They then look at houses based on budget and after finding a house you look at the taxes. I don't think people tell there realtor that I want a typical 4 bedroom 2.5 bath 2200 square foot house please show me the options I am open to spending between 175,000 and 450,000.

[BrianTH]

Originally Posted by robrobrob

Home buyers have a budget. They then look at houses based on budget and after finding a house you look at the taxes. I don't think people tell there realtor that I want a typical 4 bedroom 2.5 bath 2200 square foot house please show me the options I am open to spending between 175,000 and 450,000.

Well, first of all, that makes no sense. At a minimum, their budget should be based on all the relevant financial factors, including taxes.

Second, I think that is oversimplified when it comes to real world behavior. We see it here all the time, in fact--people lay out a list of criteria, then say they could spend "up to $X". But that doesn't mean they actually will insist on paying $X--if they can get what they want/need for less, they might well do that. So if such person says, "I am open to spending up to $450K", that doesn't mean they will insist on paying $450K and nothing less.

That said, because real estate agents are typically paid a percentage commission, they have an incentive to get buyers to spend at the top of their range, and even to try to persuade them to push higher than their original range. That is something home buyers should look out for.

[djleith0622]

I just want to put in my two cents for Forest Hills. I bought a house here, on Atlantic Avenue, and absolutely love it and the area. It was actually a foreclosure but we lucked out that money became an issue for the previous owner because he put too much of it into the house. I have new windows, ceramic in the kitchen and bath, granite, a fresh paint job, etc. The home was sold in 2006 in the nineties before the work and I got it three years later for $74,000.

That aside, there are a ton of homes for sale here, as the most houses were built in the 60s and the original owners who spent the last fifty years here are moving into assisted living. The street I am on is both safe and quiet, with an adorable park at the end, and close to everything. The schools aren't good but I don't have kids and have the goal to move south before 35 so any children I may have would only make it to the elementary schools in the area so its just not a worry for me.

I work downtown (park at Station Square) and my commute is no more than 30 minutes in the car, then the 12 minute walk from the parking lot to my building (on Wood Street.) This is leaving at 7:45 for an 8:30 start. It's amazing. I also want to strongly urge you NOT to look in North Huntingdon if commuting all the way to Pittsburgh. That's were I was before I bought this house and the traffic on Route 30 in the mornings is just awful. You will easily have a longer ride in then you did from Plum.

Good luck in your house search!

[tech13579]

djleith0622, thank you for your kind response. I agree for the most part with what you have said. Our search has continued and we have found a couple of homes in Forest Hills, and a couple in Wilkins Twp (off Beulah Rd, close to the Country Club). All neighborhoods we have looked at seem nice and quiet and pretty safe. I could really need some advice, especially on that side of Wilkins Twp, and here are my concerns:

1. the school district is horrible, and even if it wasn't, this is what potential buyers would think. I do not not have any kids yet and there would be a while before junior high/high school

2. close to Turtle Creek which is not a booming area either - I have read the topics and drove around. So many run down homes, closed stores, homes for sale for very very little money.

3. After driving around the plans I am looking at and knocking on some doors, there are very many older people, all very nice, but they will retire soon and move into retirement homes or even worse, pass away. At that point a bunch of homes in that area will flood the market, probably at low prices.

4. The lower the prices get in an area, the worse an area gets...maybe not every time, but in this economy things will not be getting better. A very nice house that I would pay 180,000 for now may be impossible to sell

So I come to you guys and ask you to ease my worries and concerns. We did find a couple of homes that we could see ourselves living in, but they are where they are and I may want to move at some point in time

[robrobrob]

The area around the entrance to Edgewood Country Club is pretty nice. Some of the homes bring pretty big money. These are mostly in Churchill but Penhurst is a nice street in Wilkins. So, if it is really close to the entrance to Edgewood it is a nice area. Howerver, I would say Churchill is nicer than Wilkins.

The school district isn't going to change any time soon. A lot of families will hesitate before looking in the Woodland Hills School District so that my limit your pool of buyers. Then again, the school district is the reason that the house is priced the way it is.

Many of the older suburbs have residents who have been in their houses for years. So, you are correct to be concerned about whether or not there will be enough buyers if the houses suddenly come on the market. No way to predict what will happen.

As a buyer, I would be concerned if I had to sell my house in the next few years. I really doubt that appreciation would cover my real estate fees. This is true in most areas but more so in the two areas that you are looking at.