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I haven't posted in the forum in quite awhile (and I don't believe I have ever posted in the Pittsburgh forum), but I was contacted about a potential new position that would bring us to Pittsburgh. It is somewhat of a long-shot and may never happen but I wanted to do some initial research on Pittsburgh regardless in the chance that things start rolling.
Anyway, about us: me (mid-30's); wife (early-30's). No kids and not really planning on having any. One wonderful golden retriever. We live in Houston, Texas currently. I am originally from Texas but have lived on both the East Coast and West Coast before coming back to Texas about 5 years ago. Wife is from outside of New Orleans and has never lived north of I-10. I am in business services for the oil and gas industry. My wife is in commercial real estate development.
Neither of us have ever visited Pittsburgh although when I lived in Washington DC I used to go skiing at Seven Springs and there were a lot of Pittsburgh people there. We both are pretty active. I enjoy tennis and I am a former competitive swimmer who would love to get back into open water swimming. My wife races bicycles and also does distance running. We are both pretty moderate politically (which makes us raging socialists in Texas ). We enjoy going out to restaurants, travel and visiting a good English pub for soccer on the weekends. Oh and we love sports. I love the NBA and my wife is addicted to football (both college and NFL).
First, what is Pittsburgh like culturally? My impression (which is based solely on what I have read and some thoughts from friends who have been there) is that it is a mix between East Coast and the Midwest. It is a pretty "blue collar town," if there is such a thing in the US anymore. It is more down-to-earth than cities like Washington or New York. A little like Baltimore maybe?
Second, if it comes to actually looking at places to live in Pittsburgh can you name a few nice, safe urban neighborhoods that we would enjoy? We like walking, especially on the weekend and would love to have restaurants/bars/entertainment within walking distance (or at least an easy cab). We currently live in a town-house in one of the few urban areas of Houston that is somewhat walkable for Houston standards. Not what I was used to on the East Coast or even in New Orleans but for Houston standards, about as good as it gets.
Finally, any additional advice or words of wisdom would be appreciated. I would be especially interested to hear from any recent transplants and their thoughts on Pittsburgh.
If you can schedule a trip up here to check it out, that would probably help a lot. I don't know if there are any real "blue collar" towns anymore. Pittsburgh used to be one, but has been transitioning for many years, so it's a mix of a lot of different things, depending on where you live. You can find upscale areas with young people and bistros and you can find working class areas that are down on their luck.
The nice thing about Pittsburgh is that it's a collection of almost 100 distinct neighborhoods. Many, especially in the East End, North Side and South Side, are densely built with everything from row houses to bungalows to single family homes with yards to mansions. Many neighborhoods are walkable with stores, restaurants and bars, grocery stores, cleaners, galleries, etc.
If you've never been here before and were expecting the old dirty steel town of yore, you'll be surprised, especially if your first view of he city is coming in on I-376 from the south and you see the skyline as you exit the Ft. Pitt Tunnel. Pittsburgh has undergone a pretty successful transformation and is welcoming new people and business, especially since the middle of the last decade.
Physically, it's a rugged place of hills and plateaus, three rivers, lots of bridges, and some incredible architecture, if you like those things. Historic preservation is big here (but a few areas were wrecked by 60s-style demolition). Of course, Pittsburgh has the same problems as any other city, but overall it offers a high quality of life. More down to earth than either New York or DC, so it's a little east and midwest at the same time.
I'm not well versed on the sports angle, so someone else may have more info.
If you can schedule a trip up here to check it out, that would probably help a lot. I don't know if there are any real "blue collar" towns anymore. Pittsburgh used to be one, but has been transitioning for many years, so it's a mix of a lot of different things, depending on where you live. You can find upscale areas with young people and bistros and you can find working class areas that are down on their luck.
The nice thing about Pittsburgh is that it's a collection of almost 100 distinct neighborhoods. Many, especially in the East End, North Side and South Side, are densely built with everything from row houses to bungalows to single family homes with yards to mansions. Many neighborhoods are walkable with stores, restaurants and bars, grocery stores, cleaners, galleries, etc.
If you've never been here before and were expecting the old dirty steel town of yore, you'll be surprised, especially if your first view of he city is coming in on I-376 from the south and you see the skyline as you exit the Ft. Pitt Tunnel. Pittsburgh has undergone a pretty successful transformation and is welcoming new people and business, especially since the middle of the last decade.
Physically, it's a rugged place of hills and plateaus, three rivers, lots of bridges, and some incredible architecture, if you like those things. Historic preservation is big here (but a few areas were wrecked by 60s-style demolition). Of course, Pittsburgh has the same problems as any other city, but overall it offers a high quality of life. More down to earth than either New York or DC, so it's a little east and midwest at the same time.
I'm not well versed on the sports angle, so someone else may have more info.
Much appreciated.
I am a big fan of history and architecture. My wife is as well (coming from New Orleans).
This is going to be a fairly lengthy process (again, if it happens at all) and I am sure there will be several trips to the area for interviews. Again, this was just my initial research on the area because I know so little about Pittsburgh.
Looking on Google Street View though, it does look stunning (especially coming out of that tunnel). I also like the idea of compact neighborhoods with local stores and places to explore. That is something I really don't like about Houston because everything seems so new and sprawling.
One additional concern (and I know this would be a massive generalization), how welcoming are people in Pittsburgh? Most places I have lived have been cities that really attract newcomers and thus there are many, many transplants new to the area. Houston, for all of its faults (and there are many), is a very welcoming place and you can visit the local pub and meet people from all over the world. As a result, I think this encourages people to be generally pretty friendly because everyone is "new" to the area and looking to meet new friends. Is this the case in Pittsburgh? Philly and Baltimore (two cities that often get a bad rep but I really like actually), seem to be the exact opposite and it makes it harder to "break-in" and make new friends. This s obviously a concern given we don't know anyone in Pittsburgh right now.
Finally, I think the position is actually in Canonsburg, PA which looks to be about 20 miles from Pittsburgh. What would the average commute be if one lived in Pittsburgh and commuted to Canonsburg? We would prefer to live in an urban neighborhood and I have about a 40 minute commute each way right now in Houston so I am used to driving. That being said, I don't want to have to commute 1 1/2 hours each way or something like that.
I'm not well versed on the sports angle, so someone else may have more info.
I've heard there's a football team, but I haven't been able to find out much about it myself.
We moved here a few years ago, and have not found it to be very blue collar. I'll let others comment on the urban neighborhoods because that's never been my thing. There is outdoor stuff to do here, but it will pale in comparison to places like Colorado. Hiking, kayaking, boating, eastern skiing, and so on are all readily available. Bicycling can be an adventure in all the wrong ways, but if you go where there's space for it, that can be had too.
It seems like its a stop on allot of bands tour lists, and there's a decent live theater district, and the symphony is pleasing enough to my unrefined ear. We've never thought of a cuisine that we couldn't find, and there's plenty of museums and art centers. It lacks some of the pretension of NoVA. It's a little more compact that the west. It's cloudy allot.
I've heard there's a football team, but I haven't been able to find out much about it myself.
We moved here a few years ago, and have not found it to be very blue collar. I'll let others comment on the urban neighborhoods because that's never been my thing. There is outdoor stuff to do here, but it will pale in comparison to places like Colorado. Hiking, kayaking, boating, eastern skiing, and so on are all readily available. Bicycling can be an adventure in all the wrong ways, but if you go where there's space for it, that can be had too.
It seems like its a stop on allot of bands tour lists, and there's a decent live theater district, and the symphony is pleasing enough to my unrefined ear. We've never thought of a cuisine that we couldn't find, and there's plenty of museums and art centers. It lacks some of the pretension of NoVA. It's a little more compact that the west. It's cloudy allot.
Thanks.
I lived in NoVA (Arlington) and loved it but it can seem pretentious. I guess I found a good group of relaxed people which made it more tolerable.
This is a huge generalization I know but in general what are the "good" sides of the metro area and what are the "bad" sides? Maybe there isn't such a breakdown?
For example, in general the west of Houston and the western suburbs are "good" and eastern Houston and the eastern suburbs are "bad." A lot of this has to do with the fact that the heavy industry, oil refineries and ship channel are east of the city (pollution is terrible over there).
I am a big fan of history and architecture. My wife is as well (coming from New Orleans).
This is going to be a fairly lengthy process (again, if it happens at all) and I am sure there will be several trips to the area for interviews. Again, this was just my initial research on the area because I know so little about Pittsburgh.
Looking on Google Street View though, it does look stunning (especially coming out of that tunnel). I also like the idea of compact neighborhoods with local stores and places to explore. That is something I really don't like about Houston because everything seems so new and sprawling.
One additional concern (and I know this would be a massive generalization), how welcoming are people in Pittsburgh? Most places I have lived have been cities that really attract newcomers and thus there are many, many transplants new to the area. Houston, for all of its faults (and there are many), is a very welcoming place and you can visit the local pub and meet people from all over the world. As a result, I think this encourages people to be generally pretty friendly because everyone is "new" to the area and looking to meet new friends. Is this the case in Pittsburgh? Philly and Baltimore (two cities that often get a bad rep but I really like actually), seem to be the exact opposite and it makes it harder to "break-in" and make new friends. This s obviously a concern given we don't know anyone in Pittsburgh right now.
Finally, I think the position is actually in Canonsburg, PA which looks to be about 20 miles from Pittsburgh. What would the average commute be if one lived in Pittsburgh and commuted to Canonsburg? We would prefer to live in an urban neighborhood and I have about a 40 minute commute each way right now in Houston so I am used to driving. That being said, I don't want to have to commute 1 1/2 hours each way or something like that.
Thanks again.
The people are pretty welcoming. They can be extremely rude and often dangerous at times behind the wheel, but that's usually where it ends. I think we have a good mix of lifers and transplants.
I think a good determination on how friendly everyone will be is whether you're on a street where most of the people are renting, or whether its one where most people own their homes. From my experience you're probably not going to get to know your neighbors on a street that primarily consists of duplexes. The transient nature of it doesn't justify the effort to interact socially. Buy a home though and you'll know everyone in the neighborhood pretty quickly. They'll come over to say hello, or catch you outside to chat you up.
Geeo's comment about the city having 100 distinct neighborhoods is something to take note of. A lot of variety in housing to be found, and a lot of variety in the neighborhoods you have to pick from. My best advice on choosing one is to make a list of what you want and need in a neighborhood/home and then compromise. A lot of people who move here struggle with that last bit. They want to live in a trendy neighborhood, but in a home that is less than 200k. They want the charm and aesthetic qualities of an old house, but with walk in closets and a two car garage. It isn't difficult to find a place that is right for you, but its going to take being honest with yourself about the bare minimum you must have to be happy.
The city is old and was populated at a time when cars had yet to exist, so most are completely walk-able (albeit sometimes up hill..you'll get used to it). Whether or not they have what you're looking for in terms of daily amenities is another story. For instance mine has numerous townie bars, a little restaurant that caters to the elderly, two decent pizza takeouts, a convenience store, a brewery, a laundromat, a pharmacy, a few garages, a gas station, and just about none of them we patronize on a regular basis. Go figure, but we are located close to downtown, and access to the highway means that we can get anywhere quickly. Just about all of the neighborhoods are safe. I'd make the case that even some of the more dangerous one's (and there are only perhaps 2 or 3 in total out of 100 to choose from) are safe to walk around at night as well because the crime that occurs there is rarely random (think criminal on criminal). I say that because I've personally done it...repeatedly (the walking of course, not the crime).
You'll probably want to live in the South Hills to have easier access to Canonsburg, as the tunnels can make your commute significantly more difficult. The good news is that you'd be going against traffic, but there still will be a bottleneck around all of the tunnels at peak times. Where I'm located just north of downtown would take me somewhere between 45 minutes to an hour to get to Canonsburg during peak traffic times, and that's going opposite the heavier traffic. The further out you get from the city center the less walk-able the neighborhoods will be which is typical of the suburbs which were designed with motorists in mind.
We have a few English/Irish pubs that you'd be able to catch soccer games at. The most notable is Piper's on East Carson Street in the south side.
NoVA's funny like that. I worked in Ballston, near the Hockey Rink. The people I knew were all really down to earth people. It was just everyone else... >.<
Anyhow, in my fairly new to the region opinion, there are pockets of both all over the place. Pittsburgh metro is made up of a bunch of little townships. Some are amazing. Some need some TLC. Some need allot of TLC. I don't think it breaks down quite as easily as things did in Texas. (I'm from Texas, too btw.) Things can vary greatly from one block to the next in certain parts of the city. I love the Mexican War streets area on the north side even if I could never live there, but adjacent to it are some pretty rough blocks.
Squirrel hill, Shadyside are probably what you're looking for, and there's a premium to be paid for it. I suck at the hidden urban gems though, because that will never be our thing. Once you get out into suburbia where I live, it's all pretty much varying degrees of not really dangerous at all.
Neither of us have ever visited Pittsburgh although when I lived in Washington DC I used to go skiing at Seven Springs and there were a lot of Pittsburgh people there. We both are pretty active. I enjoy tennis and I am a former competitive swimmer who would love to get back into open water swimming. My wife races bicycles and also does distance running. We are both pretty moderate politically (which makes us raging socialists in Texas ). We enjoy going out to restaurants, travel and visiting a good English pub for soccer on the weekends. Oh and we love sports. I love the NBA and my wife is addicted to football (both college and NFL).
Second, if it comes to actually looking at places to live in Pittsburgh can you name a few nice, safe urban neighborhoods that we would enjoy? We like walking, especially on the weekend and would love to have restaurants/bars/entertainment within walking distance (or at least an easy cab). We currently live in a town-house in one of the few urban areas of Houston that is somewhat walkable for Houston standards. Not what I was used to on the East Coast or even in New Orleans but for Houston standards, about as good as it gets. !
Good luck with the job.
It sounds as if you are willing to accept a long commute to live in the city. Since you are okay with a long commute then look at our bigger neighborhoods, Sq. Hill, Shadyside or Lawrenceville. All are great for people in their 30's.
Only really going to comment on your activities. A friend is a former collegiate swimmer and he swims in the mornings at Pitt. As far as open water swims, another friend has done some in Lake Erie which is about 1.5 hours north. Not sure about the rivers, but another friend (triathelete) has done training swims in them.
Their is a bicycle oval which has races weekly during the summer. It is on Washington Blvd.
As far as tennis, there are quite a few indoor places and a few tennis clubs. It would depend on where you wind up living. Mt. Lebanon has a great tennis facility if you open to the burbs.
Since you like tennis, I think you should pick up platform tennis, aka paddle. Kind of a unique sport that most tennis players wind up liking better than tennis. I am a paddle junkie. Google it for more information.
As others have already excellently pointed out the beauty of Pittsburgh is its sheer diversity in terms of living options. Want to live in a post-apocalyptic-looking neighborhood that has been massively depopulated and is replete with urban prairie? We have that. Want to live on a narrow street with Victorian homes a stone's throw from a posh business district where men routinely receive pedicures and carry poodles around in purses? We have that. Want to live in an old ketchup factory? We can offer that. Want to lovingly restore an old brick rowhome that used to house immigrant workers in the 1890s? We have that. Want to live in a 1970s-era ranch-styled dwelling with an integral garage on 1/3-acre lot? We have that. Want to live in brand new construction McMansions? We have those.
I also agree with Q-Tip Motha. Bear in mind any alarming violent crime statistics you see are largely attributable to those who "know" one another, if you catch my drift. Something like 90% of the homicide victims in the city in 2012 were African-Americans killed by other African-Americans, usually in the same few rougher pockets, and usually over something tragically trivial like drug debts, drug turf, women, etc. He knows his stuff, as he used to routinely walk from my own neighborhood of Polish Hill through the Hill District to work. I use the Hill District library without fear. Member Goodjules uses the Hill District YMCA without fear. Member Uptown Kid is our resident expert on violent crime and can allay any concerns you may have about safety or security in various neighborhoods you investigate. I live within a short walk of a "rough" neighborhood. Guess what? I routinely am out and about at night without fear.
I think as others have noted you'll really need to come up and take a look around yourselves. If I were in your position I'd consider first renting in a place like the Cork Factory, Heinz Lofts, Morgan at North Shore, or Lot 24 in/around the Strip District and North Shore areas, where you'll find numerous other 30-something educated professional transplants to mingle with. All of these complexes are expensive by Pittsburgh standards (generally $1,200-$1,600/month for a 1-BR), but you'll have the heart and pulse of the city at your fingertips, and that will also provide you with time to scout other neighborhoods you may wish to buy within.
If this actually pans out and makes sense financially (I am still trying to get them to give me some hard numbers on compensation), we would definitely come up together for a bit to tour the place.
BTW, just as a note, as I have looked into it more I really like the layout of the city and the neighborhoods. I also love the mountains. I've been living in Houston for so long I really miss real neighborhoods with actual stores and restaurants on the street (rather than in a strip mall). I know my wife will love that as well since that is what we both love about New Orleans (along with the food of course). I also miss mountains and water!
We will definitely do the rental first since we are unfamiliar with the area. As long as it is a young professional area we should be fine.
Thanks again!
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). We enjoy going out to restaurants, travel and visiting a good English pub for soccer on the weekends. Oh and we love sports. I love the NBA and my wife is addicted to football (both college and NFL).
