A Lack of Retail Downtown ..... (Pittsburgh, Erie: wedding, buy, price)

[nei]

Meanwhile, Manhattan is getting more department stores:

A Department-Store Comeback in New York City - WSJ

[gladhands]

Originally Posted by nei

Meanwhile, Manhattan is getting more department stores:

A Department-Store Comeback in New York City - WSJ

Manhattan has 1.6 million people living in roughly 21 square miles (when you remove Central Park). Another 1.5 people enter the island daily. On the average weekday, that one walkable island is more populous than our entire MSA. It can sustain a few department stores.

[PghYinzer]

And those 5 new department stores combined only total 1/2 of the sq ft of what was once Kaufmann's. The former Kaufmann's building was really too big to work in any realistic manner and should work better for today's retail climate of smaller unique stores.

[gladhands]

Originally Posted by PghYinzer

And those 5 new department stores combined only total 1/2 of the sq ft of what was once Kaufmann's. The former Kaufmann's building was really too big to work in any realistic manner and should work better for today's retail climate of smaller unique stores.

Also, it's a bit of a stretch to call Barneys and Nieman Marcus department stores in the traditional sense. You're not going to find housewares, furniture or appliances there.

[sskink]

Originally Posted by gladhands

Also, it's a bit of a stretch to call Barneys and Nieman Marcus department stores in the traditional sense. You're not going to find housewares, furniture or appliances there.

Not at Barney's anyway.

[bluecarebear]

Originally Posted by SteelCityRising

We almost never drink while dining out, period. It's just too expensive. We'd rather have water at a restaurant and then enjoy a libation or two when we arrive back home. Paying $10 for a cocktail anymore thanks to the popularity of the "new Pittsburgh" is outrageous.

Originally Posted by PittChick

Meh. It is all relative.

Originally Posted by PittChick

[SIZE=3][/SIZE]Ifyou are paying $50-$100 (or more) per person for tickets to an event, and havemore money dropped on dining, another $10 or $20 for drinks doesn't reallymatter much.
[SIZE=3][/SIZE]But,like sealie said, it has to taste good.

Originally Posted by sealie

Well, and about popularity/new Pittsburgh, there's not a city with downtown fine dining and craft cockails that don't cost around $10, not in Buffalo, not in Cleveland. If you want blue collar down to earth prices, you go to a blue collar down to earth establishment. You can't blame restaurants for selling what people want to buy.

I have started to see the change. We experience very light crowds at the new restaurants and breweries that have opened up. Steady traffic but nothing heavy. We were even shocked to see how dead a brewery was before the Steelers game last week. But every time we head outside the city to the blue collar dying towns, the bars are packed and not only with blue collar workers. We are seeing more and more younger people visiting those dive bars. I don't see this region supporting the high cost of entertainment. Dropping $100 a night is pointless when it can be done for 1/4 the cost at the neighborhood bar that has been around decades.

[jay5835]

Originally Posted by gladhands

Also, it's a bit of a stretch to call Barneys and Neiman Marcus department stores in the traditional sense. You're not going to find housewares, furniture or appliances there.

Technically, they're not called department stores, but rather specialty stores. At least, that was the distinction back when people actually went to department stores. Bloomingdale's, Macy's, Kaufmann's, Gimbels, Marshall Field & Co., Woodward & Lothrop, The Hecht Company, Frederick & Nelson, The Bon Marche, were all department stores. They sold hard (furniture, housewares, and going farther back, toys, books, electronics) and soft goods (clothing, all fashion). Saks Fifth Avenue, Nordstrom, Lord & Taylor, B Altman, and Neiman Marcus were specialty stores, specializing in fashion and other soft goods.

Most people refer to them all as department stores, however.

[erieguy]

Originally Posted by bluecarebear

I have started to see the change. We experience very light crowds at the new restaurants and breweries that have opened up. Steady traffic but nothing heavy. We were even shocked to see how dead a brewery was before the Steelers game last week. But every time we head outside the city to the blue collar dying towns, the bars are packed and not only with blue collar workers. We are seeing more and more younger people visiting those dive bars. I don't see this region supporting the high cost of entertainment. Dropping $100 a night is pointless when it can be done for 1/4 the cost at the neighborhood bar that has been around decades.

What are the names of the bars and brewery you're seeing this at?

What are the names of these bars you're experiencing large crowds and 75% cheaper drinks?

[sealie]

It's a big enough metro to support Stillers dive bars and downtown cocktail bars. Hopefully we don't have to run either yuppies or yinzers out of town for people to be happy with life.

[Enough_Already]

Originally Posted by bluecarebear

I have started to see the change. We experience very light crowds at the new restaurants and breweries that have opened up. Steady traffic but nothing heavy. We were even shocked to see how dead a brewery was before the Steelers game last week. But every time we head outside the city to the blue collar dying towns, the bars are packed and not only with blue collar workers. We are seeing more and more younger people visiting those dive bars. I don't see this region supporting the high cost of entertainment. Dropping $100 a night is pointless when it can be done for 1/4 the cost at the neighborhood bar that has been around decades.

For retail to exist downtown or anywhere it must be profitable. Downtown only has enough population to support a limited amount. The large workforce downtown might shop but with how expensive parking is, people park a distance away and can only carry so much. Another way to support downtown retail would be for people to come into the city to shop. Again the steep parking charges keep people from doing that in large numbers. Until the leaders understand this parking dynamic, it will impede development of downtown retail.