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The only morons are the taxpayers who essentially wind up supporting Sam Walton's miserly family members. They lower wages, bribe public officials, sell crap, encourage over consumption, force their employees to get health care from the government and cheat employees out of overtime.
The only part of hte trade agrement that is unfair is that their currency is kept artifically cheap. That means their workers have reduced spending power abroad. When their currency is allowed to float then they will start buying things in other counttries. Of course, when the Japanese started doing that in the 80's everybody screamed that they were buying up America. People who are anti-free trade will always have something to complain about.
Manufacturing is only one field of many. I've never had a manufacturing job, nor have any of my friends, and we're all making good middle-income salaries. Manufacturing in the US was killed by big unions more than anything Wal-Mart ever did.
You can compare it to any industry where the consumers demand the cheapest goods possible. If some other factor than price drove consumer demand then Wal-Mart would accomodate that as well. For now, price is king and I don't see that changing anytime soon.
My rebuttal to you is...I stand by my previous statement.
The rich are getting richer and the poor are getting poorer at a staggering rate. Once upon a time, the United States had the largest and most prosperous middle class in the history of the world, but now that is changing at a blinding pace.
So why are we witnessing such fundamental changes? Well, the globalism and "free trade" that our politicians and business leaders insisted would be so good for us have had some rather nasty side effects. It turns out that they didn't tell us that the "global economy" would mean that middle class American workers would eventually have to directly compete for jobs with people on the other side of the world where there is no minimum wage and very few regulations. The big global corporations have greatly benefited by exploiting third world labor pools over the last several decades, but middle class American workers have increasingly found things to be very tough.
It does not matter that you and your friends do not have manufacturing jobs in the scheme of things. America will never have a thriving middle class without one.
Walmart is a very large part of this problem...it is undeniable.
I'm tired of hearing the "labor union" rhetoric.
The Only Answer to Organized Greed
Why America Needs Labor Unions
Many of the same folks who glowingly acknowledge labor’s contributions—equal pay for women, abolishing child labor, the 8-hour day, the 5-day week, overtime premiums, paid vacation, sick pay, pensions, maternity leave, mandatory safety programs, and company-paid health insurance—will sigh and announce that, alas, we don’t really need unions any more.
Corporations are predictable. They hate paying taxes; they hate paying wages (the U.S. Chamber of Commerce has spent millions lobbying against raising the minimum wage, which, even today, at $6.55, is pitifully low); they hate unions; and they more or less hate the federal government, which they view as an impediment—until they need bailouts or regulations to stifle their competitors. David Macaray: Why America Needs Labor Unions
and again...the airline industry does not drive the economy as the manufacturing sector does. No one is advocating for non competitive business, but what Walmart is doing is monoplozing by outsourcing manufacturing and driving out competition. So glad thay are banned from ever opening a store in Manhattan.
My rebuttal to you is...I stand by my previous statement.
The rich are getting richer and the poor are getting poorer at a staggering rate. Once upon a time, the United States had the largest and most prosperous middle class in the history of the world, but now that is changing at a blinding pace.
And Wal-Mart is responsible for this? Come on. They are one (big) store. They are REACTING to this, not CAUSING it. A poorer middle-class will put a premium on cheaper goods and Wal-Mart has positioned itself to capture that market segment,
Quote:
So why are we witnessing such fundamental changes? Well, the globalism and "free trade" that our politicians and business leaders insisted would be so good for us have had some rather nasty side effects. It turns out that they didn't tell us that the "global economy" would mean that middle class American workers would eventually have to directly compete for jobs with people on the other side of the world where there is no minimum wage and very few regulations.
And this surprises you? EVERYONE with half a brain could see how free trade means that workers would be competing with workers in other countries. That's pretty much the definition of free trade.
You complain about the middle-class getting poorer because they don't have good jobs but if they had good jobs and still had to pay high prices for everything because everything was made by people with good jobs ($$$) then they wouldn't be any better off net.
Quote:
The big global corporations have greatly benefited by exploiting third world labor pools over the last several decades, but middle class American workers have increasingly found things to be very tough.
Quite a few middle-class Americans own stock in those corporations and they benefit when the corporations do well. They don't see them as 'the enemy'.
Quote:
It does not matter that you and your friends do not have manufacturing jobs in the scheme of things. America will never have a thriving middle class without one.
Walmart is a very large part of this problem...it is undeniable.
I'm tired of hearing the "labor union" rhetoric.
The last job I had for 9 years was in a big corporation. We made medical instruments. About six years after I started the actual labor of putting hte instruments together was moved to China but the design, algorithm development, and scientific jobs remained in America. We still manufactured some things here too because they still had a manufacturing department. Maybe we're outsurcing those blue coller jobs overseas because we are replacing them with better, higher earning jobs. Its just that the retail jobs are more visible. If you are not a hospital or lab in the market for automation then you wouldn't even know about all the thousands of jobs at that company. Wal-Mart is mroe visible and it makes an easy target for attacks athat are often politically motivated.
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and again...the airline industry does not drive the economy as the manufacturing sector does.
Apparently manufacturing doesn't drive the economy either because, according to you, it is gone but we still have an economy. Although, in fairness, Obama's still got two more years so maybe we won't have one when he's done.
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So glad thay are banned from ever opening a store in Manhattan.
Liberal elitism at its worst. Fine, if the yuppies in Manhattan want to pay more for everything let them. That's the strength of a Federalist system.
And Wal-Mart is responsible for this? Come on. They are one (big) store. They are REACTING to this, not CAUSING it. A poorer middle-class will put a premium on cheaper goods and Wal-Mart has positioned itself to capture that market segment,
And this surprises you? EVERYONE with half a brain could see how free trade means that workers would be competing with workers in other countries. That's pretty much the definition of free trade.
You complain about the middle-class getting poorer because they don't have good jobs but if they had good jobs and still had to pay high prices for everything because everything was made by people with good jobs ($$$) then they wouldn't be any better off net.
Quite a few middle-class Americans own stock in those corporations and they benefit when the corporations do well. They don't see them as 'the enemy'.
The last job I had for 9 years was in a big corporation. We made medical instruments. About six years after I started the actual labor of putting hte instruments together was moved to China but the design, algorithm development, and scientific jobs remained in America. We still manufactured some things here too because they still had a manufacturing department. Maybe we're outsurcing those blue coller jobs overseas because we are replacing them with better, higher earning jobs. Its just that the retail jobs are more visible. If you are not a hospital or lab in the market for automation then you wouldn't even know about all the thousands of jobs at that company. Wal-Mart is mroe visible and it makes an easy target for attacks athat are often politically motivated.
Apparently manufacturing doesn't drive the economy either because, according to you, it is gone but we still have an economy. Although, in fairness, Obama's still got two more years so maybe we won't have one when he's done.
Liberal elitism at its worst. Fine, if the yuppies in Manhattan want to pay more for everything let them. That's the strength of a Federalist system.
I'm more than done debating this issue with you. FYI...the reason that Walmart is prohibited from opening a store in NYC is because there are many mom and pop and small business owners there that would be compromised due to Walmarts obscene expoitation of foreign workers, cutthroat greed exemplified by undercutting prices at the expense of the USA economy and the spitting in the face of the American worker and small business. So keep your talking points about "elitism" for as less informed poster because they are wasted on me. Keep shopping at walmart and buy all of the toxic garbage they tell you that you need and have a nice evening.
Last edited by sickofnyc; 09-21-2010 at 04:26 PM..
China’s entry into the World Trade Organization (WTO) was supposed to improve the U.S. trade deficit with China and create good jobs in the United States. But those promises have gone unfulfilled: the total U.S. trade deficit with China reached $235 billion in 2006. Between 2001 and 2006, this growing deficit eliminated 1.8 million U.S. jobs (Scott 2007). The world’s biggest retailer, U.S.-based Wal-Mart was responsible for $27 billion in U.S. imports from China in 2006 and 11% of the growth of the total U.S. trade deficit with China between 2001 and 2006. Wal-Mart’s trade deficit with China alone eliminated nearly 200,000 U.S. jobs in this period. The Wal-Mart effect: Its Chinese imports have displaced nearly 200,000 U.S. jobs
I'm more than done debating this issue with you. FYI...the reason that Walmart is prohibited from opening a store in NYC is because there are many mom and pop and small business owners there that would be compromised due to Walmarts obscene expoitation of foreign workers, cutthroat greed exemplified by undercutting prices at the expense of the USA economy and the spitting in the face of the American worker and small business. So keep your talking points about "elitism" for as less informed poster because they are wasted on me. Keep shopping at walmart and buy all of the toxic garbage they tell you that you need and have a nice evening.
I think it was more than just mom & pop stores. "A Wal-Mart spokeswoman said the company was still exploring other sites in the city, but the possibility that the company would open a 132,000-square-foot store in Queens had immediately stirred a storm of opposition by neighborhood, labor and environmental groups as well as small businesses. Wal-Mart Drops Plans for First New York City Store
I think it was more than just mom & pop stores. "A Wal-Mart spokeswoman said the company was still exploring other sites in the city, but the possibility that the company would open a 132,000-square-foot store in Queens had immediately stirred a storm of opposition by neighborhood, labor and environmental groups as well as small businesses. Wal-Mart Drops Plans for First New York City Store
It was Manhattan I was referring to, not the other boroughs. NYC takes pride in its boutiques and smaller more intimate stores. We have more than our fair share of chain stores such as The Gap, Victoria's Secret, etc, but Walmart would certainly not be a welcome addition and would further change the landscape in a negative way. Good for Queens for having the sense to tell Walmart to **** off.
The decision by the developer, Vornado Realty Trust, is a blow to Wal-Mart, the world's largest retailer, and comes after company officials said that New York City was an important new frontier in which Wal-Mart was eager to expand.
I read this and it sounds like they were salivating. Let them choke instead.
It was Manhattan I was referring to, not the other boroughs. NYC takes pride in its boutiques and smaller more intimate stores. We have more than our fair share of chain stores such as The Gap, Victoria's Secret, etc, but Walmart would certainly not be a welcome addition and would further change the landscape in a negative way. Good for Queens for having the sense to tell Walmart to **** off.
The decision by the developer, Vornado Realty Trust, is a blow to Wal-Mart, the world's largest retailer, and comes after company officials said that New York City was an important new frontier in which Wal-Mart was eager to expand.
I read this and it sounds like they were salivating. Let them choke instead.
If you want to keep paying more that is your privilege.
I choose not to.
Last week I bought my wife a new Nikon camera. Best Buy had it for $10 more than Wal Mart.
Contrary to what is posted o here, Wal Mart carries the same products the other stores carries.
I have all those store you list also. Competition is good.
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