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I agree that third parties don't have a realistic chance of winning.
Which is why we need a major revolution. A peaceful one hopefully, but all the same, we need to overthrow the government.
I have plenty of ideas for strategies. I just don't feel like taking tons of time to type it all out right now.
Sigh....
Here we go again. Rather than do the hard work necessary to save our democracy, let's just start over. That would be much easier, right?
OK, fine. But, I'll ask the same question I always ask when this subject comes up and, one which I STILL do not have an answer for. Maybe you can provide it where hundreds before you have not:
Overthrow the government and replace it with what?
I agree that third parties don't have a realistic chance of winning.
Which is why we need a major revolution. A peaceful one hopefully, but all the same, we need to overthrow the government.
I have plenty of ideas for strategies. I just don't feel like taking tons of time to type it all out right now.
We have a silent revolution every 2 years. It is a revolution, or you would not see the voter fraud we see at election time.
The first step to overthrowing the current government is in the works.
We have had both R & D Machines, going full throttle and the expense of the very people that put them there. The people are overthrowing the government.
We got the Progressive Republican machines out in the primaries and got the Progressive Democrats out in the General elections.
Did we get them all... NO.
Once the American people see who is fighting for the people and who is fighting for a bigger controlling Federal Government, the rest will be run to the gallows.
The people are waking up and you see real people being elected to once long time Progressive Machine career politicians seats.
Here we go again. Rather than do the hard work necessary to save our democracy, let's just start over. That would be much easier, right?
OK, fine. But, I'll ask the same question I always ask when this subject comes up and, one which I STILL do not have an answer for. Maybe you can provide it where hundreds before you have not:
Overthrow the government and replace it with what?
There is so much wealth, power and corruption festering in Washington D.C. that there is literally nothing that can reform it short of an all out revolution.
I believe that no amount of hard work can penetrate the deep corruption. If you don't agree, then maybe you just don't understand how deep the corruption is in our government?
Replace it with what? Ther are many options. I'd opt to return to what we had in the USA abotu 200 years ago. A small federal government with lotsof power at the state level. Decentralized power.
I've answered you're question. Now i'll ask you a question.
How can we reform the government with "hard work"? Besides a complete revolution, how do you thing we can reign in the corruption and plutarchy thateists in the US government?
We have a silent revolution every 2 years. It is a revolution, or you would not see the voter fraud we see at election time.
The first step to overthrowing the current government is in the works.
We have had both R & D Machines, going full throttle and the expense of the very people that put them there. The people are overthrowing the government.
We got the Progressive Republican machines out in the primaries and got the Progressive Democrats out in the General elections.
Did we get them all... NO.
Once the American people see who is fighting for the people and who is fighting for a bigger controlling Federal Government, the rest will be run to the gallows.
The people are waking up and you see real people being elected to once long time Progressive Machine career politicians seats.
Getting rid of progressives is not the answer. In fact, that might even put us in a worse situation.
As long as the US government exists as it does now. They will keep on appointing cronies to further their agenda.
Whether they are conservative or progressive. They are cronies of the same machine.
Getting rid of progressives is not the answer. In fact, that might even put us in a worse situation.
As long as the US government exists as it does now. They will keep on appointing cronies to further their agenda.
Whether they are conservative or progressive. They are cronies of the same machine.
I'm not sure the newer generation just elected has the same ethics as the previous career politicians that relied on payoffs and special interest lobbying.
The new generation got more donations from individual people, than big corporations and unions.
I agree we need to get rid of many Government overlapping agencies that just suck money and do nothing but raise the cost of living here.
I agree going back to the very principals this nation was found on.
Forced human behavior, breeds resentment.
There is so much wealth, power and corruption festering in Washington D.C. that there is literally nothing that can reform it short of an all out revolution.
I believe that no amount of hard work can penetrate the deep corruption. If you don't agree, then maybe you just don't understand how deep the corruption is in our government?
Replace it with what? Ther are many options. I'd opt to return to what we had in the USA abotu 200 years ago. A small federal government with lotsof power at the state level. Decentralized power.
I've answered you're question. Now i'll ask you a question.
How can we reform the government with "hard work"? Besides a complete revolution, how do you thing we can reign in the corruption and plutarchy thateists in the US government?
In other words, return to the starting point? By what right would you assume we wouldn't just end up back here again? If we got to this point under the Constitution, isn't it logical to assume we'd get here again under that same Constitution?
Practical questions: How would you stop a repeat performance? What specific changes would you make and how?
What steps would be taken to return us to the starting point? Who would draft those steps? Who would impliment them? Who would be in control of the whole process? Where would they come from? How would you deal with opposition?
A "complete revolution" can be accomplished in either party beginning at the precinct level. It's been done before, most notably by the Christian right when they essentially took over the Republican Party. They did not begin with high-powered oratory, but by gathering small bands of like-minded believers and taking over individual precincts in critical states. Both parties are democracies and, though the individual states have different procedures, in the end, it is those precinct captains who ultimately control the state organizations and the national organizations.
You want to start somewhere? Gather up 4 or 5 friends who feel the way you do and take over your local county party organization. It typically won't take many more than that, in most counties. By controlling a county organization, you'll have access to state conventions, power meetings and have a hand in deciding who gets what during the primaries, beginning in early 2012. That's where national candidates are selected and they are selected by whichever group can field the most activists: organizers, marchers, polling place supervisors, phone bank operators etc.
It takes organization to find, train and place people who believe as you do, so don't expect quick and easy results. Not only that, but the entrenched powers now will fight back and they're formidable. But, it can be done, so get started. You won't win a Presidential election in 2012, but you could damn easily win a state legislature or Congressional election that year, if you get busy now.
Otherwise..just sit home and let it continue to operate the way it does now and don't expect any changes.
I'm not sure the newer generation just elected has the same ethics as the previous career politicians that relied on payoffs and special interest lobbying.
The new generation got more donations from individual people, than big corporations and unions.
You'd better spend some time researching who those individuals were. You'll find that the biggest money came from individuals within those same corporations.
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I agree we need to get rid of many Government overlapping agencies that just suck money and do nothing but raise the cost of living here.
Ok. How?
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I agree going back to the very principals this nation was found on.
Forced human behavior, breeds resentment.
Both sides are equally corrupt. And everything you see from them in the news is an act. Nothin is an accident, it's all carefully strategized.
Republicans are blatently corrupt and to the public eye, they support most of the most corrupt actions and policies. But they maintain their support among the American people because of the socially conservative idealogies and appeal to Christians.
Democrats appear less corrupt in the public eye. But behind the scenes they are no different than the Republicans. The Democrats image is a front to gain the support of the more educated and liberal Americans.
It's all a big front, a big act. Behind the scenes they are both equally rotton. And all the votes and everything that you see is a carefully orchestrated charade.
If Democrats appear less corrupt than Republicans "to the public eye" it's only because of who controls the so-called public eye. And that's the mainstream media. Take, for example, Dodd's sweetheart deals from Countrywide, one of the major players in the sub-prime mortgage debacle. Dodd should have gone to jail. But because he is a Democrat the media shoved the story under the rug. In the same vein Barney Frank blocked effective regulation of Fannie and Freddie largely because his boy friend was working for Fannie and making gobs of money backstopping worthless mortgages on the taxpayer dime. Frank, too, belongs in jail and, if he were a Republican, you can bet that's where he'd be today.
You'd better spend some time researching who those individuals were. You'll find that the biggest money came from individuals within those same corporations.
Yet still an individual, not a collective.
Big difference. If you can't see it. Then you don't understand the peoples interests.
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Originally Posted by stillkit
Ok. How?
Several ways. First you can defund them. Bye, bye!
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Originally Posted by stillkit
Ok. How?
How are we going to get back to where we started?
Or how control breeds resentment?
As we have seen, nothing is permanent and nothing is impossible. The will of the people can overcome many obstacles, given all the information from all views to make an informed decision. The people are more involved and intrench than ever before.
I'm going to add a tax to your fuel use, so you buy less and go towards the alternative energy. Can you see the resentment to force the change in behavior? I could add how the civil war went down as a great example, too.
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