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Old 06-22-2011, 09:01 AM
 
2,226 posts, read 2,103,072 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roysoldboy View Post
Hey, when did the Democrats change from strict construction to the very liberal kind of thought they have today? I always wondered when that was.
Then Ronald Regan opening up Washington to the corporate interests....well basically the whole sixties generation and the women's movement, civil rights movement, enviormental movement etc. etc.
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Old 06-22-2011, 09:04 AM
 
Location: Vermont
11,760 posts, read 14,654,294 times
Reputation: 18529
Quote:
Originally Posted by AeroGuyDC View Post
Liberals advocate Equality of Outcome, instead of Equality of Opportunity.

Simply put, Liberals don't believe their constituents are adept or capable, so "greasing the skids" to give certain segments a leg up is their driving philosophy. In other words, Liberals think their constituents are just plain stupid.
Apparently you don't know any liberals. No liberal I know believes in what you claim liberals believe in.
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Old 06-22-2011, 09:12 AM
 
82 posts, read 90,645 times
Reputation: 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW View Post
Conservatives yearn for a past that never was and progressives try to create a better future for all.

That is why I am a progressive.
CONSERVATIVE, n. A statesman who is enamored of existing evils, as distinguished from the Liberal, who wishes to replace them with others. - Ambrose Bierce.

-----

I'd say that the primary conceit of the progressive is that they understand the world well enough to shape it by layer after layer of imposed law and regulation. Each new accretion is a response to those pesky humans who just won't behave in the desired manner.
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Old 06-22-2011, 09:15 AM
 
Location: Londonderry, NH
41,479 posts, read 59,783,759 times
Reputation: 24863
JackM post 50

All the items you have listed are reasons the conservatives cannot tolerate Progressive ideas. All of these things increased individual rights and freedoms at the cost to the owners. Conservative still consider emancipating slaves to be a taking without compensation. Progressives find slavery and its descendants like company towns and usuorious interest rates to be repulsive.

Freedom of the individual from discrimination verses the right of the organization or owners to dictate who CAN AND CANNOT BE FREE. We consider freedom from famine one of the basic needs. This is why I am a progressive.
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Old 06-22-2011, 10:59 AM
 
29,939 posts, read 39,464,356 times
Reputation: 4799
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTexan View Post
More people are dependent on the government than ever before.
How is that better ?
That's perfect for these folks. Now they can use the government to get the things they want that they weren't willing to work for before.
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Old 06-22-2011, 11:03 AM
 
29,939 posts, read 39,464,356 times
Reputation: 4799
Quote:
Originally Posted by jackmccullough View Post
It was people you would call progressives who tried to "change America" in the fight to end slavery.

It was people you would call progressives who tried to "change America" who brought about women's right to vote.

It was people you would call progressives who tried to "change America" who brought about black people's right to vote.

It was people you would call progressives who tried to "change America"who created universal public education, and then began the struggle to end racial discrimination in public education.

It was people you would call progressives who tried to "change America" and created the most successful anti-poverty program we've ever known: Social Security.

It was people you would call progressives who tried to "change America" who gave us vast national mechanisms for the creation and protection of wealth and opportunity, including the Securities and Exchange Commission, the Interstate Highway System, and a myriad of other regulatory agencies without with everyday commerce would be impossible.

It was people you would call progressives who tried to "change America" who created the Internet and every other communications network that you use every day.

It happens that yesterday was the anniversary of the ratification of the United States Constitution. It is largely due to the work of people you would call progressives that the United States is a freer, more vital place now than it was on June 21, 1788. I don't personally know anyone who thinks things would be better if we had had no change since 1788, but maybe you're the first.

For now, I'll just say that I don't think we had achieved perfection on June 21. 1788, and I still don't think we've achieved perfection.
No, that would be the actual definition. "Progressives" today care nothing at all about cracking open a dictionary. They're more regressing back to the super nanny-state where they'll have a ruling leader (like a king) and everyone is poor....

Hey, but everyone will be equal then...
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Old 06-22-2011, 11:29 AM
 
4,500 posts, read 12,344,990 times
Reputation: 2901
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigJon3475 View Post
No, that would be the actual definition. "Progressives" today care nothing at all about cracking open a dictionary. They're more regressing back to the super nanny-state where they'll have a ruling leader (like a king) and everyone is poor....

Hey, but everyone will be equal then...
What do you base that assertion on?
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Old 06-22-2011, 11:34 AM
 
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
78 posts, read 103,048 times
Reputation: 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheViking85 View Post
What do you base that assertion on?
My guess? A very loose grip on reality. I'm constantly amazed by what a warped, distorted view most conservatives have of progs/libs/whatever. Their definition does not fit me, nor any left of center person I've ever met.
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Old 06-22-2011, 11:42 AM
 
Location: Sierra Vista, AZ
17,531 posts, read 24,698,072 times
Reputation: 9980
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robeaux View Post
I promise I'm not trolling (I'm a newbie), but I really want to understand why progressives want to change America.

America was founded on freedom, an escape from the tryanny of British rule. Our founding fathers wanted limited government (not NO government). Why do progressives want to change what this country was founded on? America is the last bastion of freedom (for now anyway) and those of us that believe in freedom want to protect it!

Expansive government has been tried time and time again only to be a failure. America has survived over 230 years (which is a long time for a government) by giving control to its citizens instead of a king/ruler/dictator...etc.

If you want the government to take care of you, why don't you move instead of screwing up what we have?!
It wasn't always this way, in the past decade the rich have tripled their wealth at the expense of all Americans. The top 400 make as much as 22% of the entire population of America, the top 1% have as much as the bottom 50%. So it isn't "Progressives " who are changing America
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Old 06-22-2011, 11:53 AM
 
30,065 posts, read 18,665,937 times
Reputation: 20884
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robeaux View Post
I don't see that we want to "change" America, we just feel that some of the fundamentals of what it was founded on have been hijacked.

So the founding fathers wanted money and labor taken from one man and given to another who did not earn it? I guess I did not see that in the Constitution.

The guarantee of America has always been EQUAL OPPORTUNITY, not EQUAL OUTCOMES.Every political system which has tried the EQUAL OUTCOMES route has failed miserably. The problem with a free system is that there will be people who succeed and those who fail. However, a rigged and unfair playing field involves confiscating resources from those who have succeeded and giving them to those who have not. This is further a gross misallocation of resources, such that those who have failed have already clearly demonstrated that they cannot develop those resources in the first place.
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