Tea partier Glenn Beck compares Norway victims to Hitler Youth (military, party)
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When looking at what often passes for political debate in the USA, the hatred of the other side, the two-party system, and the number of people who does not bother voting, having given up on the system...-I do feel that teaching how political debate should happen and how to influnce the system and participate would benefit the USA termendously.
In America, there is an artificial distinction between the government and the people, as if those were two separate things, that is not healthy for a democracy.
When I read about this island "political retreat" I thought the same thing. Very weird. Apparently both parties in Norway do it.
There are about seven political parties in the Norwegian parliament. Six of them have been in government in the last two generations. All of them do it.
The second biggest party in Norway was started in the 1970s. A party that used to be a government party is only clinging on to its parliament seats by the skin of its teeth.
The Norwegian political system functions far more likle a marketplace than American politics, with Norwegian voters/customers activly choosing the parties they feel offer the best product, and parties that do not work are selected away.
And that system depends on educated customers.
In Norway, children are taught that being politically aware and active is a good thing in a democracy. Everyone is encouraged to aquire political information, show some ability to source critique and participate in political debate from a young age. The first political debates will have been in school at an early age. There is an ongoing debate on lowering the voting age to 16, because of the numbers of politically aware young people who want to vote.
I lived in Norway for many years, and I never met a Norwegian who didn't vote. Or had ever missed an opportunity to vote in national elections. (Local ones were slightly less interesting.)
All the parties run yourth wings, and it is not uncommon for a youth to have been a member of 3-4 political parties before coming of age. After all, people tend to change a lot as they grow up and learn more about the world.
Technically, the youth camps are supposed to be about information and political debate. After all, they are the places where the youth wings of parties sometimes end up with radically different resolutions from the adult parties.
In practice, they are a bunch of young people away from their parents, some for the first time, on wooded islands. Much of what happens involve what in the Scout movement would be called "learning woodcraft and bushcraft". But for very different meanings of the words "wood" and "bush" than the boy scouts use.
Go back and read my posts. If you can pull a claim that you feel I should defend, then go for it. All I have asserted is that you and Viking and others would rather turn a blind eye to the apparent indoctrination that may be occurring by giving it the ole "awe shucks, it's normal to have a youth political wing!" treatment. And then when a guy who grew up in that atmosphere comes out and kills 80 people, you're quick to ignore the potential for indoctrination that comes with the system you defend!
Quote:
Originally Posted by AeroGuyDC
That's part of your problem. Just because **YOU** said there is **NO** indoctrination does not make it fact.
It is you and Glenn Beck that made the claim that the camp is Hitler Youth-like and its indoctrination. I am still waiting for you to come up with evidence to back up your claim.
Its normal that EVERY party has a youth wing. Its not mandatory for youths to participate. That is one of the major difference between them and the Hitler Youth. Another one is, as Viking who is Norwegian stated is, that the youth actually challenges existing beliefs within the party.
Again, who knows more about the topic, you and Glenn Beck or someone who actually grew up in Norway?
And what exactly does the shooter have to do with the party? He wasn't part of that. His beliefs were completely contrary to their beliefs.
It is you and Glenn Beck that made the claim that the camp is Hitler Youth-like and its indoctrination. I am still waiting for you to come up with evidence to back up your claim.
Its normal that EVERY party has a youth wing. Its not mandatory for youths to participate. That is one of the major difference between them and the Hitler Youth. Another one is, as Viking who is Norwegian stated is, that the youth actually challenges existing beliefs within the party.
Again, who knows more about the topic, you and Glenn Beck or someone who actually grew up in Norway?
And what exactly does the shooter have to do with the party? He wasn't part of that. His beliefs were completely contrary to their beliefs.
Look up these words, and you will enlightened:
1) Caveat
2) May
3) Potential
4) Possible
When you figure out what these words mean, go back and read my posts and you will see that I have NOT said that the "youth political camps" are engaging in indoctrination. I have plainly stated that there is the "potential"...there "may" be....it's "possible". There's a distinct difference in what I have said and what you are claiming I have said.
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