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Old 12-04-2011, 03:04 PM
 
Location: North Cackelacky....in the hills.
19,567 posts, read 21,870,208 times
Reputation: 2519

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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCGranny View Post
A friend sent me an email lamenting, in BIG RED letters, about the signing of the bill to re-open slaughterhouses in the US. This is what I wrote back to him, and asked him to pass it along to the same group who emailed him with the initial email.

6 years ago, PETA and the HSUS lobbied for a ban on slaughterhouses for horses - and got it.
Since the recession, people have been abandoning horses at a prodigious rate. Horses are expensive to put down by a vet, and most people can't afford to do even that. Simply turning them loose into the wild means that these animals often stray onto cattle lands, grasslands, etc. They come into ranches and farms and eat the grass and alfalfa meant for not only grazing of beef animals, but for haymowing. Understand please that horses do not graze as cattle do, but eat down to the roots, killing the grasslands, acre by acre. It is why I only have one horse, yet 7 cows, on 60 acres - the cows, moved from pasture to pasture, do not overgraze as the horse does.

The 'wild and free' animals spread diseases. They are often victims of everything from bots and worms to mange and other diseases - and they spread these diseases as well. Coyotes, wolves, and mountain lions hunt them. They fall down ravines and break their legs, lying there helplessly. Since the ban, literally thousands of wild and once-tame horses are now wandering this country, uncaught. If you shoot a stray horse on your property, you have to dispose of it - and it isn't like burying the family pet; you need a backhoe.

Texas drought leaves heartbreaking toll of abandoned horses - Yahoo! News (http://news.yahoo.com/texas-drought-leaves-heartbreaking-toll-abandoned-horses-181314658.html - broken link)

Now, let me explain something else to you and your friends (because I hope that you pass this on). Back in the late 80's -90's, there was a drug put on the market called Premarin. It was made from pregnant horse urine. Thousands of get-rich-quick folks bought bits of property, populated them with female horses, and put a stud in with them to keep the flow of pregnant horse urine coming for this drug. Um - the drug was found to be hazardous and was banned. So thousands of mares with thousands of colts suddenly were of no more use for the pharmacutical industry - and there was no place to dispose of them after the ban. Thousands of horses that were not adopted and could not be destroyed have added to the damage of lands both private and public.

So please - before you start talking about "forever homes" for horses, or thinking that the ban was a GREAT idea and should be reinstated, please understand this - many people who adopt a horse not only have nowhere decent to put it, but have no idea that it needs medications to keep away diseases and parasites, it needs its teeth floated so that it can still chew, it needs its hoofs trimmed so that they don't split and cause crippling injuries, it needs constant attention so that it doesn't become wild and unrideable. Most horsemeat in the US previously sent to slaughter was sold overseas; you cannot sell horsemeat without labeling it as such. This hysteria is reprehensible by those who not only don't understand what, all too often, happens to horses during their lives - but who don't actually care that Black Beauty or Fury or those wonderful paintings and depictions of the 'wild and free' herds are simply glorious super-emotionalized fiction, without the cold hard and bitter truth of the horrors these animals often suffer. I have friends who work in horse rescue, and not even they can make a dent in the wild and abused populations of these animals. My own horse was adopted from a riding stable in MN that went underwater from the recession - a beautiful and proud creature who, had I not adopted her, would have been let loose to wander and fend for herself. I cannot save them all, but I could -and did - save one. How many people posting and reposting this email have even done that much?

Please let your friends know that the REAL horror was perpetrated by PETA and HSUS six years ago - the lifting of this ban will make the horror less.

BTW, Gracie may be the only horse in our pasture, but she is the self-established protector of all of the cows and calves. She herds them into the corral and barns when coyotes howl or bad weather threatens, and she puts up with no BS from anyone - including the bull. She is our cowherd's Mom, and they and we all know it.
Great post.
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Old 12-04-2011, 03:21 PM
 
Location: Florida
76,971 posts, read 47,629,107 times
Reputation: 14806
Quote:
Originally Posted by nightflight View Post
Obama signs law legalizing horse slaughter in the US « Our Compass

Erbe: Revival of horse slaughter to cost taxpayers | ScrippsNews (http://www.scrippsnews.com/node/65615 - broken link)
It was against to law? Why?
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Old 12-04-2011, 03:25 PM
 
Location: North Cackelacky....in the hills.
19,567 posts, read 21,870,208 times
Reputation: 2519
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
It was against to law? Why?
Because some people didn't like the idea of killing horses at slaughterhouses in the USA.

They didn't mind sending horses to Canada and Mexico to be slaughtered however.
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Old 12-04-2011, 03:31 PM
 
35,309 posts, read 52,305,052 times
Reputation: 30999
So where have the thousands of horses that die every year in the USA been going before Obama signed this law into action?
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Old 12-04-2011, 03:32 PM
 
Location: North Cackelacky....in the hills.
19,567 posts, read 21,870,208 times
Reputation: 2519
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambo101 View Post
So where have the thousands of horses that die every year in the USA been going before Obama signed this law into action?
You mean those not sent to Mexico or Canada?
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Old 12-04-2011, 03:51 PM
 
Location: Midwest
38,496 posts, read 25,815,033 times
Reputation: 10789
I don't think this bill is exactly like the OP would want us to think of it.

Quote:
Prior to 2005 USDA personnel carried out horsemeat food safety inspections at U.S. horse processing plants. In 2006 Congress voted to strip the USDA of funding for horsemeat inspections. USDA personnel continued to conduct those inspections on a fee-for-service basis until 2007 when a federal court judge ruled against the arrangement. The combination of the funding prohibition and the court decision resulted in the decline of the horse processing industry in the U.S.
Quote:
On Nov. 17 the full House passed H.R. 2112 by 298-121 vote. The Senate also passed the bill by a 70 to 30 vote. President Barak Obama signed the bill into law on Nov. 18. As a result, the USDA could conduct horsemeat inspections at least until September 2012.
The Horse | Bill Passes without Defunding Horsemeat Inspections
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Old 12-04-2011, 03:55 PM
 
15,092 posts, read 8,634,588 times
Reputation: 7432
Quote:
Originally Posted by SCGranny View Post
A friend sent me an email lamenting, in BIG RED letters, about the signing of the bill to re-open slaughterhouses in the US. This is what I wrote back to him, and asked him to pass it along to the same group who emailed him with the initial email.

6 years ago, PETA and the HSUS lobbied for a ban on slaughterhouses for horses - and got it.
Since the recession, people have been abandoning horses at a prodigious rate. Horses are expensive to put down by a vet, and most people can't afford to do even that. Simply turning them loose into the wild means that these animals often stray onto cattle lands, grasslands, etc. They come into ranches and farms and eat the grass and alfalfa meant for not only grazing of beef animals, but for haymowing. Understand please that horses do not graze as cattle do, but eat down to the roots, killing the grasslands, acre by acre. It is why I only have one horse, yet 7 cows, on 60 acres - the cows, moved from pasture to pasture, do not overgraze as the horse does.

The 'wild and free' animals spread diseases. They are often victims of everything from bots and worms to mange and other diseases - and they spread these diseases as well. Coyotes, wolves, and mountain lions hunt them. They fall down ravines and break their legs, lying there helplessly. Since the ban, literally thousands of wild and once-tame horses are now wandering this country, uncaught. If you shoot a stray horse on your property, you have to dispose of it - and it isn't like burying the family pet; you need a backhoe.

Texas drought leaves heartbreaking toll of abandoned horses - Yahoo! News (http://news.yahoo.com/texas-drought-leaves-heartbreaking-toll-abandoned-horses-181314658.html - broken link)

Now, let me explain something else to you and your friends (because I hope that you pass this on). Back in the late 80's -90's, there was a drug put on the market called Premarin. It was made from pregnant horse urine. Thousands of get-rich-quick folks bought bits of property, populated them with female horses, and put a stud in with them to keep the flow of pregnant horse urine coming for this drug. Um - the drug was found to be hazardous and was banned. So thousands of mares with thousands of colts suddenly were of no more use for the pharmacutical industry - and there was no place to dispose of them after the ban. Thousands of horses that were not adopted and could not be destroyed have added to the damage of lands both private and public.

So please - before you start talking about "forever homes" for horses, or thinking that the ban was a GREAT idea and should be reinstated, please understand this - many people who adopt a horse not only have nowhere decent to put it, but have no idea that it needs medications to keep away diseases and parasites, it needs its teeth floated so that it can still chew, it needs its hoofs trimmed so that they don't split and cause crippling injuries, it needs constant attention so that it doesn't become wild and unrideable. Most horsemeat in the US previously sent to slaughter was sold overseas; you cannot sell horsemeat without labeling it as such. This hysteria is reprehensible by those who not only don't understand what, all too often, happens to horses during their lives - but who don't actually care that Black Beauty or Fury or those wonderful paintings and depictions of the 'wild and free' herds are simply glorious super-emotionalized fiction, without the cold hard and bitter truth of the horrors these animals often suffer. I have friends who work in horse rescue, and not even they can make a dent in the wild and abused populations of these animals. My own horse was adopted from a riding stable in MN that went underwater from the recession - a beautiful and proud creature who, had I not adopted her, would have been let loose to wander and fend for herself. I cannot save them all, but I could -and did - save one. How many people posting and reposting this email have even done that much?

Please let your friends know that the REAL horror was perpetrated by PETA and HSUS six years ago - the lifting of this ban will make the horror less.

BTW, Gracie may be the only horse in our pasture, but she is the self-established protector of all of the cows and calves. She herds them into the corral and barns when coyotes howl or bad weather threatens, and she puts up with no BS from anyone - including the bull. She is our cowherd's Mom, and they and we all know it.
Aside the bolded section, the rest of the story you provide are rationalizations for the need for slaughter houses, and the full scale commercialization of horses for meat. Now, maybe you believe that this is the humane answer for the problems you outlined which are primarily the result of the purposeful implosion of our economic livelihoods by criminal gangsters .... the irresponsible actions of so many thoughtless human beings ... and a mindset that lining them up in wholesale fashion, and killing them one by one is somehow a thoughtful way to handle those issues ... but that only tells me that you know nothing about the reality of slaughter houses, nor of the animals themselves.

Unlike cattle, which demonstrate a certain lessor amount of reason and awareness, horses are more intelligent and aware. Even the presence of a strange trailer puts them on edge emotionally, and without exception, they understand and feel loss when one of the herd is separated. Green horses that have never been transported will often arrive soaking wet from sweating due to the stress-fear, so if that is enough to frighten them out of their wits, lining them up like cattle for slaughter ALONE is beyond inhumane, to say nothing of the horrors that occur routinely in slaughter houses as animals are slit open like so much garbage, dead, partially dead, what have you. Rivers of blood, animal carcasses, screams and wails of the animals being summarily discharged, all while the rest stand in line waiting their "turn", forced to wait and observe. And don't think for a minute they don't understand what is to become of them.

Now, do not mistake my next comment as some "equal value" comparison between humans and horses because that's not the point AT ALL ... but the flaw in your line of reasoning would become more obvious to you if you were to apply that same approach to all of the abused and suffering and homeless children and adults across this once great country of ours. You wouldn't think of slaughtering them as the humane answer to their plight, would you? Of course you wouldn't. So why do you do so with the horses? Because in spite of your kindness demonstrated by the adoption of Gracie (which I applaud), it's hardly worthy of the Nobel peace prize for finding room for one horse among 60 acres, and asking everyone else what they are doing to help. Very few people are blessed with that type of acreage, and many are doing much more with a lot less. And you really don't seem to see these creature as the intelligent living beings that they are, or you don't place the appropriate value on that. What seems totally lost in these rationalizations in measuring problems-solutions, is what we as human beings are saying about ourselves in the solutions being embraced, and the alternatives being ignored. And it's not a pretty picture. And your definition of the damage horses cause to land tends to suggest to me that your views are in concert with the cattle industry who sees these creatures as pests.

The bolded section demonstrates what others have been trying to communicate, and even though you speak the words, you seem oblivious to the meaning of your own observations and experience. Horses are indeed noble and proud creatures, intelligent, and not satisfied and content with simple existence like cows are. That is the reason why your's has taken on the role of heard mother. There is just simply more complexity to horses as sentient beings, and that fact alone demands more consideration in their proper handling.

We already have a deplorable situation in the commercial processing of cattle that few have a clue about the horrors thereof .... while there are some smaller operations that operate with respect to the animals, they are evermore being pushed out of business, replaced by the most offensive, inhumane big processing operations. Adding another species to the mix is moving in the entirely wrong direction, in spite of whatever reasons you use to justify it.

Given that commercial slaughter INEVITABLY seeks the most expedient and lowest cost methods to kill and process ... that INEVITABLY leads to severe cruelty. Well informed people know of the nature of these meat processing operations, and the inhumane treatment of the animals processed .... so it is a complete disconnect with rational thinking that allows you or anyone else to consider slaughter houses as the humane solution to dealing with horse issues.

I'm really at a loss for words to adequately define just how backward your position is on this matter. It just shows that there is no limit to the irrationality of the human mind, given too much time to theorize and hypothesize and rationalize.

The bottom line here is that there is a problem. That problem is result of greed, irresponsibility, ignorance, and a total absence of compassion. The slaughter of these animals as a solution to that exemplifies those very failures ... and does nothing to combat them.

Let's get one thing straight ... this solution you embrace is simply the most "cost effective", "Profitable" approach to dealing with the problem, and has nothing whatsoever to do with being humane.

Last edited by GuyNTexas; 12-04-2011 at 04:05 PM..
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Old 12-04-2011, 04:03 PM
 
Location: Florida
76,971 posts, read 47,629,107 times
Reputation: 14806
Quote:
Originally Posted by oz in SC View Post
Because some people didn't like the idea of killing horses at slaughterhouses in the USA.

They didn't mind sending horses to Canada and Mexico to be slaughtered however.
Where do you kill them if not in the slaugherhouse? In the barn?
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Old 12-04-2011, 04:56 PM
 
15,092 posts, read 8,634,588 times
Reputation: 7432
On another note ... the reopening of slaughter houses for horses will utilize a lot of public funding as it is sold to the public as a necessary thing. Then commercial processors will take these handouts and turn a handsome profit, as they export that meat to the European market which commands pretty high prices for horse meat.

Now the idea that this is a measure to address old, worn out and unwanted or abandoned horses is a ploy. Large equine facilities simply do not want to spend money disposing of horses when they can turn a cost into a receivable, sending the animal to slaughter and saving the cost of upkeep.

I've talked to some, and have read the accounts of others regularly attending horse auctions, and the vast majority are young healthy horses, yet the economy in downturn has taken a huge bite out of horse breeder profits, as sales have hit bottom. What to do? Well, find another market!!

Furthermore, aside the moral issues of the ethical treatment of these animals, the fact that they will be processed for consumption is another can of worms. The general maintenance of horses use drugs and chemicals that often say "not o be used on animals for consumption". Does anyone believe these considerations are going to be taken to heart when exporting the meat? Think again. The FDA will either do nothing, or they will re-evaluate what is fit for consumption and move along. That contaminated meat may not hit your dinner table, but is likely to do so overseas ... but who cares about them, right? Who cares if European children are eating contaminated, tainted horse meat?

But if such consideration was made ... then you likely see separate breeding facilities pop up that will be barred from using those unsafe chemicals and drugs to meet any new standards ... to produce food safe horse meat ... thereby totally eliminating the "old, abandoned, sick, unwanted" horse pretext altogether.

Next step ... roundup of wild horses ... you know, the "Organic" type ..that good old free range horse meat.

Either way, what we have here is a push for re-establishing an industry ... much of which will be publicly funded, while the profits are privatized, just like everything else that transpires in corporate-fascist dominated Amerika.

This is all about the BUCKS and nothing whatsoever to do with humane treatment of horses.

Want to really deal with these alleged problems .... set up strict laws governing how breeding facilities deal with the animals to be disposed of. Rather than "Slaughter Houses", have these animals humanely euthanized and their carcasses disposed of properly. If you can afford to use tax payer funds for Slaughter houses, you can afford to set up crematoriums for the effective disposal of humanely euthanized animals.

But where's the profits $$$$ .... well I thought this was about being humane?
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Old 12-04-2011, 05:04 PM
 
Location: Florida
76,971 posts, read 47,629,107 times
Reputation: 14806
Quote:
Originally Posted by GuyNTexas View Post
On another note ... the reopening of slaughter houses for horses will utilize a lot of public funding as it is sold to the public as a necessary thing. Then commercial processors will take these handouts and turn a handsome profit, as they export that meat to the European market which commands pretty high prices for horse meat.

Now the idea that this is a measure to address old, worn out and unwanted or abandoned horses is a ploy. Large equine facilities simply do not want to spend money disposing of horses when they can turn a cost into a receivable, sending the animal to slaughter and saving the cost of upkeep.

I've talked to some, and have read the accounts of others regularly attending horse auctions, and the vast majority are young healthy horses, yet the economy in downturn has taken a huge bite out of horse breeder profits, as sales have hit bottom. What to do? Well, find another market!!

Furthermore, aside the moral issues of the ethical treatment of these animals, the fact that they will be processed for consumption is another can of worms. The general maintenance of horses use drugs and chemicals that often say "not o be used on animals for consumption". Does anyone believe these considerations are going to be taken to heart when exporting the meat? Think again. The FDA will either do nothing, or they will re-evaluate what is fit for consumption and move along. That contaminated meat may not hit your dinner table, but is likely to do so overseas ... but who cares about them, right? Who cares if European children are eating contaminated, tainted horse meat?

But if such consideration was made ... then you likely see separate breeding facilities pop up that will be barred from using those unsafe chemicals and drugs to meet any new standards ... to produce food safe horse meat ... thereby totally eliminating the "old, abandoned, sick, unwanted" horse pretext altogether.

Next step ... roundup of wild horses ... you know, the "Organic" type ..that good old free range horse meat.

Either way, what we have here is a push for re-establishing an industry ... much of which will be publicly funded, while the profits are privatized, just like everything else that transpires in corporate-fascist dominated Amerika.

This is all about the BUCKS and nothing whatsoever to do with humane treatment of horses.

Want to really deal with these alleged problems .... set up strict laws governing how breeding facilities deal with the animals to be disposed of. Rather than "Slaughter Houses", have these animals humanely euthanized and their carcasses disposed of properly. If you can afford to use tax payer funds for Slaughter houses, you can afford to set up crematoriums for the effective disposal of humanely euthanized animals.

But where's the profits $$$$ .... well I thought this was about being humane?
What are you talking about? "Who cares if European children are eating contaminated, tainted horse meat"

Where do you get stuff like that? Who do you expect to believe stories like that?
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